A32NX will not be returning to the marketplace

Oh it has been educational as well. I think the people who I meant know who they were. I fully agree with your entire post.

Thanks for that reasoned response. make sense to me now !!

I would pay upwards of ÂŁ20 for a fully working add-on mod for the default A320neo Ă  la FBW A320nx.

I don’t think developers quite realise the potential of the Xbox user base. Yes, it might be more work, but there is serious potential as unlike PC users, Xbox users don’t have freeware mods and have much less choice and only one platform to choose from.

WOW what a pis#$@& contest this thread has become! lol :sweat_smile: I look at it this way. Their model their choice. Either way it’s still available to us, for free I might add, so who cares where it’s available from, all I can say is still after 9 months of using the FBW version, GREAT JOB FlyByWire! Can’t wait to see what the future has in store! Kudos to your work, your commitment to the project and to this, sometimes harsh, community. Your work is NEVER looked down upon by me or many others. I wish you all the best
 Oh look at that! Gotta go there’s another dev update I want to try out for the A320
 :joy::+1:t2::wink::flight_departure:

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Colour me not surprised. Wise move. Shame for the XBox users, but completely understandable. You have my full support. Reality is very simple: a whole lot of complex simulations will simply not be available to those who choose (willingly or by nature of circumstances) to use XBox for MSFS. This, the Fenix bird, we will see about DC-6 (no idea on that one), upcoming MilViz aircraft. It’s just something that needs to be fully understood and accepted by the XBox users. For the sake of transparency, it should be stated when you get the XBox version that not all add-ons will be available so that it’s not a surprise to those users.

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So it seems the “No Pilot left behind” does not apply to X-Box users ?

I believe that slogan was created before an X-BOX version was even conceived.

It certainly does not seem to apply now 


BTW “Colour” ??? BostonJeremy77 is a Britt ???

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Oh, make no mistake, pilots WILL be left behind. That’s just the reality. :wink: It’s not very good - there seems to be a diversion from the original vision of what the XBox product “would be” and what it actually IS now. I don’t think things have been thought through very much.

And BostonJeremy77 learned English in the UK. So, “colour” comes from that. (English is my 4th language)

In that case, we better hope I’m right, eh?

Kev

That’s were I also learn English. Now I am America, I am having to learn American, and be very careful when I ask for a Cigarette, or to borrow an Eraser !!

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You should see the look on the waiters’ faces when I ask for a glass of water. Half of them can’t understand what I am asking for. :wink:

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With regards the vanilla base game experience no pilot is left behind.

However, I don’t recall any official suggestion that this would extend to User Generated Content
That consoles have limited access to user generated content should really come as no surprise to anybody because it’s been that way for ever.
Even those titles which have provided access to user generated content on the console it has been a great deal more limited.

This is simply the nature of a closed ecosystem and one of the trade off’s that surely in 2021 everybody already knows about.

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To me, the more interesting reason for FBW not returning to the marketplace was this:

Finally, although the SDK has improved since the release of the sim a year ago, it still lacks some key functionality that limits what we can do with the aircraft. In an effort to work around this, we are considering the possibility of running certain components of the aircraft outside the simulator - something that would also not be compatible with the marketplace.

Everything that is wrong with Microsoft Flight Simulator is well summarized there. If we had a sufficient SDK, the whole debate about “simmers” versus “gamers” would be gone as would all of the whining about all of the stuff that Asobo can’t seem to get right. With a decent SDK, the community would have already developed suitable replacements for all of the poorly implemented features. They would have also already tackled the missing features and we would already have the kinds of add-ons that would address the “simmers” needs for realism. People could stop caring about that fact that (for many of us) the development roadmap (and therefore Asobo) is missing so many of the most important things that need to be addressed from a simulation perspective.

That even FBW is finally admitting that the SDK is insufficient for their needs is fairly telling. I’ve been saying this from day 1: WASM sucks and trying to force developers into a tiny little sandbox to ensure X-box compatibility is the wrong approach. What is going to happen is what is already happening: developers interested in producing add-ons with the level of realism appropriate for the simulator are going to find ways to bypass the obstacles that embody the SDK. That Fenix is building on top of ProSim may or may not be a happy accident, but now that cat is out of the bag other developers are going to follow suit.

Unfortunately, the X-box is a second-class development platform for flight simulator add-ons because of that platform’s locked-down nature. Many of the things that developers are doing (or will do) to work around SDK limitations may not work on X-box without platform changes that would enable a far more open cross-platform development environment. While undoubtedly add-on developers would love to take advantage of the X-box market, I suspect that those add-on developers producing cutting edge of flight simulator realism aren’t going to be willing to target X-box if it means delivering a lesser product. As a result, such products aren’t going to be available in the marketplace presumably due to the fact that they won’t work on X-box.

Plus, the reality is that cross-platform development is never completely seamless. Yes, stuff built with the SDK should work on X-box, but making products available in the marketplace is a commitment that it will. That requires developers to have access to x-box hardware for testing as well as the willingness and know-how to support that platform. For small shops, that may be a large ask and ultimately too much of a bother.

Of course, the other thing that I’ve been saying for quite some time is that the Marketplace itself is unfriendly to developers and customers alike. MSFS is the first FS platform that I’ve bought add-ons for and in the early days I bought into the idea of “one marketplace to rule them all.” However, my experiences with the marketplace were so bad that I quickly realized that as a customer, the downsides far outweighed the upsides. Now I won’t buy from there if given a choice, and if I’m not given a choice, that will work against vendors who sell exclusively there. There are definitely vendors who are cool on the marketplace because the slow turnaround times in making updates available result in the vendors looking bad to their customers. The reality is that unless Microsoft addresses the myriad problems with the marketplace, there are most likely always going to be products that will never be available in the marketplace regardless of whether they could run on X-box.

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Exactly. The FBW A320 from their stand alone installer is the only plane I use in MSFS. I also appreciate all of their hard work. If it wasn’t for this aircraft I wouldn’t be using MSFS at all. Keep up the great work.

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Yes:

And therein lies the rub.

Thing is, I don’t know of any “serious simmers” that run vanilla anything. No one flies default aircraft that is into high-fidelity simulations. So, in terms of XBoxers
 do they expect that the XBoxers will be satisfied with just flying default aircraft? And if it’s ONE platform, ONE sim, remember? “We are one community” etc
 Is that not a prime example of the reality not corresponding with rhetoric?

In a way they try to present the simulator is that it’s a “sim for simmers”, remember? :wink: And since it’s “one platform, one community”, doesn’t that look like “sim for simmers” except if you are an XBox simmer - in which case it’s a “sim for XBox users” that’s devoid of high quality aircraft.

I am not an XBoxer, thankfully, but I am playing devil’s advocate here and am empathizing with the XBox users because it surely must be frustrating. The product they are able to enjoy on XBox is handicapped by a myriad of limitations, so in no way, shape, or form would I consider it to actually BE what they are striving to achieve. That is to say, what they are trying to achieve is IMPOSSIBLE. It should have never been a claim they put forward. It should have always been more of “XBox runs it TOO
 you may be limited in terms of your 3rd party add-ons, but if you want to fly MSFS as it comes with a limited selection of 3rd party add-ons, we can give you that TOO
 But the PC version is obviously going to be superior in that regard
”

It should have never been “one platform, one community” - from many different angles. Tech issues is one reason - the XBox players may be experiencing XBox-only issues. PC users may be experiencing different issues. There COULD have been a separate Forum section for X-Box users, but this overarching desire to unify everything and everyone is starting to show its ugly side.

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Is this another reason why the debate rages whether this is a game a simulation?

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That debate is dumb. It’s a game
 or a simulator. Or a simulator game. Whatever. :wink: The point is that, for WHATEVER it is, they are trying to make it seem THE SAME on both platforms. Except it isn’t, and it will never be.

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We are in danger of drifting off topic here


Well, depends. FBW A320 is very much related to this. It’s just ONE of the things the XBoxers won’t be able to enjoy. So it’s a shining example of how this just isn’t the same thing.

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But weirdly
 (and playing devils’ advocate) are we really getting ‘off topic’ so very much?

The a320NX is the nearest we have got to Study level aircraft so far, and now FWB are announcing their decision not to release on that platform.*

I wonder if this decision helps to inform the debate, given that this is supposed to be a unified offering across both platforms?

Hides again

*with possible exception of the PMDG DC-6

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