Try flying in Europe. Loads of ATC and at peak times average of 300-500 users. If you want full ATC there’s PilotEdge that offers coverage of the entire West and Mountain areas, Seattle, Oakland, Los Angeles, Denver, Salt Lake, and Albuquerque 10+ hours a day except for holidays, but that it a pay solution.
You see. This is the ONLY thing that I need. Traffic in the air or on the ground is a non-issue for me, a nice to have. When Inwant realistic traffic, I inject Vatsim traffic. The rest is icing on the cake for me.
So, your rant may get recognition from a certain slice of the simming community, but there are many others who don’t find this the first priority.
Thank you for posting this, as the title of your post clearly states 'AI Traffic - ', not ‘How does AI Traffic Compare with Online ATC Services?’. This whole thread has NOTHING to do with VATSIM, Pilot Edge or any other virtual online flying ATC.
It is very frustrating, to me any way. Any time the subject of the in sim AI/ATC gets brought up someone inevitably has to interject a comparison to VATSIM as THE solution to the internal AI/ATC mess in FS2020.
The 2 items are completely different and should not be compared with each other unless the topic of the thread clearly asks for it.
But of course, if you’re flying in ‘flight simulator’, you must be wanting to be a pilot in real life so why wouldn’t you use VATSIM…
More power to VATSIM users. The root of this discussion, however, is the regressions from previous incarnations of FS and no progress made in the latest version, in fact, in some instances, made worse in terms of AI traffic and ATC.
[quote=“KnightofNi312, post:146, topic:557825, full:true”]
But of course, if you’re flying in ‘flight simulator’, you must be wanting to be a pilot in real life so why wouldn’t you use VATSIM…[/quote]
Your 1st assumption seems somewhat odd in my view, I was not aware that flying a ‘flight simulator’ necessitated someone become a pilot in real life. (I do have a PPL BTW). That aside your next assumption is flawed and predeterminate as well, i.e. on what basis do or did you determine that I do not use VATSIM?
The 3rd assumption on your part seems to be that by stating VATSIM is not THE (or even AN) answer to the problems of the AI/ATC in the sim somehow that must means they is degrading or chastising VATSIM in some way. Certainly not the case on my end and I do apricate, enjoy and use it on occasion.
In the end there is no denying this thread is supposed to be about in sim AI/ATC not virtual online ATC despite what some may think. Now that you and I have both taken away from that discussion, I’m going back to it.
As long as I have to deal with real ppl,
As long as I cannot be away from the sim while in cruise,
VATSIM is simply not an option or alternative.
I want immersion, a realsitic representstion of the environment in looks and feel.
But I still want it to stay fun and a game after all.
Else I would have made my ATPL and get paid to do what others tell me instead
It will eventually get fixed. I know I talk about VATSIM ad nauseam but trust me I have a handful of friends who don’t want to use it for the same reason many don’t here. I personally was never really a fan of ATC in flight sims like I said though I think I somewhat liked it in the sim Fly! from Terminal Reality, I recall an FSS feature and thought that was neat. That was ages ago. In 2009 I went over to FSX MP to get my fix and wasn’t getting it. Someone mentioned it to me and I never looked back at stock nor a MP lobby again.
The CoC allows this however with caveats.
I know. But there is too much of asking for permissions or explaining ypurself in real life already. Dont wanna bring that to my hobby.
It is great that there are online networks lile VATSIM and IVAO and I fully support thst the sim should ve as compatible with them as possible.
But it simply is not for me.
AI traffic is what I want. And I want it to work properly.
And looks like OP has a simular approach to this.
That’s totally understandable. I’m just curious what is expected to happen when it’s posted here in General Discussion? You can only talk about this topic so much, you’re not voting. People naturally are going to offer suggestions to get around this. My only real experience is being on VATSIM hence why I talk about it. Pardon my ignorance as I have virtually no experience with AI or stock ATC in MSFS and have never touched it in P3Dv3, v4, v5, XP11 and XP12 to the best of my recollection. Many are unhappy with the AI and ATC in MSFS, again I get that. Within the past 6 months I must have had at least 10 people come up to not happy with the AI and ATC in MSFS and ask that I get them into VATSIM. So many of them wish they got into it sooner. I do sincerely hope that one day it works out for you and others.
Oh, I tried VATSIM. I also tried IVAO.
Both are not for me.
And we discuss here, because this is what a discussion forum is for.
Of course I also file bug reports to zendesk and vote on the topic where possible.
But here we discuss, how AI Traffic seems to be the unbeloved child of MS and Asobo.
At least that’s what the OP chose to be the topic.
But some people dont get that and are advertising alternatives instead of staying on topic.
It is not a support thread and not a bug report that is asking for workarounds or alternatives, it is a discussion about the inbuilt AI Traffic.
We want working AI Traffic. Great that there are alternatives, but we want working AI Traffic, and this thread is about how we feel this being ignored by the devs.
I feel you’re entitled to that.
For the sake of getting this thread back on topic I will stop talking about VATSIM.
Maybe you just enjoy planes. I used to play with train sets and Legos, did that mean I wanted to become a Conductor or an Engineer? No. I enjoy FS but I am much more interested in teaching people and social connections.
Wow, clearly my post got lost in translation…
Agree, I suspect that is a big portion of the problem/delay in fixing ATC/AI in the sim. From the initial release there has been a mad dash to push new content out the door as fast as possible. As you said any company has finite resources and I suspect the vast majority at Asobo have been tasked with working on the new stuff.
Perhaps, and this is pure speculation obviously, now that the 40th Anniversary show is out of the way some additional resources can be tasked with cleaning up the long standing AI/ATC problems.
The other requirement to fix the problems is ‘the desire’ to do it in the first place. Unfortunately, even if the resources are available, I’m a little worried the second part could be lacking somewhat. We’ll see.
Wow, now that is bringing back some memories. I had forgotten about that title but now that you mention it I recall it having (for the time) a very good ATC system.
did my first transatlantic yesterday. the cruise was so boring. no traffic. atc did crash once more. i had atc chatter on. but thought “wow such empty for that 5 hour cruise”. i ended up sim rating up to 4x.
landing at boston (nice flytampa scenery) i was designated to the correct gate for a DHL 747. GSX bugged a bit so the deboarding got wracked.
and again that bitter taste of something was missing to make this adventure truly immersive as it could be. that wasnt as real as it gets. at least not to the fullest.
I remember taking a flight from SFO-MUN on United back when you could listen to their Channel 9. Have to say, cruise once out of Canadian airspace was quiet boring, so that’s not really so much of a deviation from actual real world. Not to mention, most position reports are all done through the FMC/ACARS and newer CPDLC. ATC in the future is going to get a lot more quieter.
I always have the same feeling thats why I mostly only do vfr patterns
time and effort to setup the 737 or a320 and all my addons is too much to be disapponted every time especially now after su11 as nearly nothing works correct with ai traffic
AI traffic being the determining factor for not doing a flight? Being the sound of a beating drum, VATSIM or non sim reliant solutions.
yup, the best thing in a flight simulator for me next to flying is living/busy airports. I just loved to land somewhere and just watch the rush hours at big hubs in fsx. also the feeling of not being alone, ai-atc interaction, all those things are very hardly missed by me. vatsim is indeed a great platform. but I dont like the fact that coverage is dependent on what time it is, and the lack of traffic is still there with vatsim. at least in areas where I mostly do my flights (western europe) I also dont want to do real life procedures every time, sometimes you just want to get in the air and suck in all the atmosphere. which would be 100% better with working traffic. at the moment Im using psxt-real traffic because its the only solution to get at least live traffic to be injected correctly, but again no atc interaction of course