Any Brunner Yoke Folks out there?

The permanent attachment is not a big deal. I finally have a dedicated simpit after decades of wanting one. What do you dislike the most about it?

Oh cool! There’s a channel in the official MSFS Discord server called #show-your-flightdeck. If you happen to have joined that server, I’m sure a lot of people would love to see your finished sim pit!

It’s not any one big thing. It’s a bunch of little things, including:

  • Well, for me, not being able to find a clamp for my CLS-E NG and Brunner being un-helpful in their response to me, which was basically, “Keep searching, you can find it. They’re all over the place.” I never found it.
  • The fact that SimConnect knows which aircraft you’re flying, but Brunner’s software, CLS2Sim, requires you to manually change out the control loading profile whenever you fly a different aircraft. (In other words, there’s no way to say, make this the default profile for this aircraft.)
  • The fact that CLS-E MK II and CLS-E NG control loading profiles are not interchangeable. So for example, if someone made a really great Bonanza profile for the NG and you have the MK II, you can’t download it. They have a utility that can convert it on their end if you contact support, but you have to know about it. And it’s a pain if you just want to try one out. [Edit: I have discovered that you can do this. But it took me two years of ownership to figure out how. (Granted, I wasn’t looking the whole time, but still…) See this post for details.]
  • When in a situation where the yoke has to use some force for an extended period of time (e.g., a steep descent without trim), the yoke will push back for a little bit and then give up, causing your controls to jerk. This is on the NG; I don’t know about the MK II.
  • The fact that even though the handle easily detaches the body of the yoke, you can’t buy other kinds of handles, such as a Boeing or Cessna-style handle, etc. While maybe not a big deal, apparently they have accommodated some big customers with different handles. When I inquired about buying one of them, they said something like, “We do that for our business customers, but not our retail customers.”
  • The fact that the handle is plastic. It’s such a high-end piece of machinery, and yet the handle feels cheap. (I don’t know about the MK II.)
  • The sharp metal edges on the housing scraped me one time, and one time it left a hairline cut in my throttle handle when I accidentally moved it too close.
  • The aluminum base has scraped my desk and my monitor feet. This is not a problem if mounting it permanently, but it sure upset me.

This one’s not Brunner’s fault, but I’m also saddened that there aren’t any aftermarket addons you can buy for it. If you go on Etsy, you’ll see that people have made all kinds of things for the Honeycomb Alpha, including tablet holders that mount onto the yoke handle, which is something I really want. No such thing for the Brunner.

I don’t want to discourage anyone from buying these. It’s still an extremely high-end device. I remember using someone else’s Flight Simulator with a Honeycomb Alpha yoke, and I couldn’t fly nearly as well because I couldn’t feel the airplane. So I still highly recommend it for anyone who can afford it.

Ill have to check it out, haven’t been on the MSFS discord in a while! It not complete yet but I’d say its very close. My cousin does some woodworking so once I get a chance to link up with him, he’s going to design something to mount all this to that can support 3 screens. Right now its my older 55in LCD TV sitting on top of some wood blocks on my old ikea desk. Then I have the RSG kit on that with my old GoFlight center console for some extra switches and stuff depending on the aircraft. It works great in and out of VR since the buttons/knobs for all things G1000 are pretty much in the right spot. If I miss, I just look through the nose hole on the headset lol.

  • Back to the Brunner - that sucks on the clamp, why they wouldn’t sell one themselves seems odd. Also if it was so easily found why can’t they just send a link?

  • This is interesting about the CLS2Sim software, I could swear I read that it auto switched profiles on various forums posts. I guess I misread that! I wonder if SPAD.next could influence that somehow. I absolutely love that program and the fact and I add all the different aircraft to the profiles and not have to worry about it again.

  • This sucks the profiles aren’t interchangeable. Although I guess I can see why as they are different units with different travel lengths and forces. I think the NG goes up to 9lbs on pitch vs the 24ish on the MKII. I guess this is where the utility can interpolate the values and convert.

  • This just seems like strange behavior. Has support said that’s normal? Almost seems like a motor controlling the forces starts overheating and gives up to cool down or something.

  • Also strange that they essentially have these made, but don’t sell them to us regular consumer folk.

  • Is it a high-quality plastic at least? I know I’m looking at the MKII (which I don’t know is metal or not either) but the NG isn’t exactly a cheap unit.

  • This sucks overall. I did see a video someone made where it seems to show some sharp edges that could catch.

Your last statement about feeling the airplane is what I’m missing. VR combined with a flight simulator is really as close as you can get, G forces aside. Although what a time to be alive, if you pony up about $8k - you can get a 6 DOF platform direct to your house! That aside though I’ll settle for some feedback on the yoke. That fact that the different planes will all have that different feel is really what’s catching my interest so much. When I was going through my PPL training, the 172’s were all booked one day so I went up in a warrior since it was mainly a navigation lesson and not focused on maneuvers. The two things I noticed was how much easier the piper was to taxi over the 172, and how the controls felt heavier and a bit more stable in flight.

I think I may do it… It seems even with the issues you mentioned you’d still go brunner over a honeycomb. I guess there are much worse hobbies we could all have… :rofl:

That’s pretty great that you have such a talented cousin! Sounds like it will be pretty amazing when done!

I’d love it if they did! In fact, I even asked them. To be fair, they are located in Europe and I am not.

I will have to double-check, but I am not aware of a way. If you happen to find that thread, I would appreciate if you could send it my way!

Yeah. I would be less upset about it if I didn’t know they had a tool to convert them. They obviously are different products but I’m sure they could have a way to automatically convert them back and forth if they wanted to.

You know, it funny that I’ve never logged a ticket about this. I probably should some day.

Yeah, this one I’m pretty sad about. They said, talk to these other companies and see if they’ll sell you a handle, and I did and none of them had anything that would be compatible. It would be a big DIY project, and if you fail, you broke your very expensive yoke.

As far as I’m aware, it’s the same plastic for both the MK II and NG. The NG has a placeholder for a screen, but with no screen.

From what I recall when using a Honeycomb Alpha for ten minutes, the Honeycomb feels a lot nicer in your hands. It has a luxurious grip and feels like real thought was put into the experience. The Brunner does not feel like it’s going to fall apart at any point soon, so it doesn’t feel cheap in that sense. But it just does not feel like it belongs on something at this price point. It feels like industrial plastic. Plus, the front and back halves meet at a big seam in the middle. It’s something I’ve gotten used to and don’t think about anymore, but I remember being disappointed when I first felt it.

Yeah, I don’t want to discourage you from buying it because it still is top of the line. Unfortunately, since there’s no other competition at this level, it is what it is. If you buy this, the only better yoke out there would be the Brunner CLS-P at a low price of $10000.

I highly recommend a Buttkicker with Simshaker for Aviators and Simshaker Sound Module software, as well, if you want immersoom. I actually didn’t know that the 6 DOF is only $8k. It’s pretty amazing that the CLS-P yoke is more expensive than that platform!

Soooo I went ahead and pulled the trigger… lol. Excited and nervous on how this is gonna work out…

I actually have the honeycomb and it’s definitely quality for the price. I wish the roll axis had a little more resistance though as it really doesn’t feel like anything is there to me. The fact its got a built in switch panel and ‘key’ just adds to the value.

As for the buttkicker, whats it actually do? I’ve always heard about it but never really did research. More so whats all these extra modules do you mentioned? Oh boy I got some research to do lol.

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Congratulations on your purchase!

Actually, I went into CLS2Sim after I replied, and I think I may be able to remove one of my criticisms. I had said that you have to manually change the profile when you change aircraft. Turns out that there is a button on the profile that says something like, “Link to current aircraft”. So I assume that’s what it does. I never would have found that if we weren’t having this conversation!

The Honeycomb is great, from what I can tell. I think it is tied with the Virtual Fly YOKO+. Each of them has pluses and minuses, in my opinion.

The Buttkicker is a haptic feedback system. You attach it under your chair and then you can feel the engine vibration in your chair. By default, it hooks up to your soundcard’s speaker or headphone jack and any sounds that come out vibrate your chair. That’s the base configuration. What really makes it worth it are those two other Simshaker software packages I mentioned. If you get that and get a dedicated sound card (a cheap USB sound card would be just fine), you can then configure it so you feel the landing gear deploy or the flaps extend or extra drag on your plane when you turn. If you get multiple Buttkickers that can attach at different places on your seat, you can feel yourself touchdown on the left or right landing gear first before touching down on the other (you would need a surround sound card for that, though).

There’s a really long discussion about it here:

Haha glad I could help with the profiles Can’t wait for this thing to arrive now!

Wow ok def gonna pick one up. Looks like my local micro center has a few in stock. I don’t use my on board sound surround capable card so I guess that could work out if I go the multiple route. Just some minor research I’ve put in it seems the buttkicker adds a lot to the experience so this might be an exciting weekend of flying!

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Oh.
Wow, maybe you might want to hold off on the Buttkicker for now. Or at least read this linked thread first:

I’m going to reply to it because I can see the Sound Module on the website.

Oh man, right as I arrive home with it! lol I actually tried to load the site and couldn’t. Oh boy…

I saw your other post. Glad you got to the page!

Yep! Having issues checking out though but working with Andre directly to sort that out. Ive done some basic tests and the butt kicker seems cool, hopefully unlock the full potential once I get the license!

Yes, it makes a world of difference when you add the SimShaker software!

Finally got the license stuff sorted out. Did some pattern work in the 172 and a flight in the cj4. Wow! I think the cj4 was most impressive with the gear, flaps and touchdown/rollout. I had to tweak the g effects and engines feedback only as they seemed excessive at 50. I think g effects are a 2 now and engine at a 10. So far so good though. Pretty awesome feeling in VR especially!

So this came quicker than expected…! I haven’t messed around with it too much. I loaded a quick online profile for the 172 and so far Im pretty blown away. My question is how do I know which yoke these profiles are for? Is the software matching to my specific yoke or is this pulling down any profile folks have created?
Edit: Im using one of the 172 profiles from the cloud, however when I put the AP on in the 172 the controls go crazy. Am I doing something wrong? Might need a whole sep post for the rabbit hole Im about to go down lol.

Quick impressions aside from AP, the turbulence effects seem over done, but since this thing is super customizable I’m sure I can get to this to be better. I also tried in XP11 and it felt way more natural so this is either the sim or the profile I’m using. Ill have to spend some time with this later/tomorrow.

If I order one of these shipped to me in the US, will it be compatible with US electrical outlets, or does it need an adapter of some kind?

100%. The power brick has your typical PC/Monitor type AC connection but in the box brunner sent the appropriate cabling. No issues!

I will say after sorting out an issue with my profiles, this thing is incredible! Can’t wait to sit down and tweak a bit more tomorrow and get everything dialed in. I actually used my honeycomb clamps and it holds it to the desk really well. Only issue is the pitch force can be so strong that my desk actually moves lol.

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Thanks, also interested to hear if you get the AP issues worked out, I think I saw a post elsewhere where someone else reported that same problem.

Ap issues are sorted! There was a setting I had enabled that was conflicting. I’m gonna sit down and read up on all the settings ect today and really put it through it’s paces. This is certainly not just an “plug and play” device and rightfully so. Each aircraft flies differently and the yoke will need some tweaking to get to where it feels right. I only have 172 and some warrior experience irl so I’ll have to rely on the online profiles for something like the cj4 ect as I have no idea how an aircraft with hydraulics would fly. All things considered this is the most realistic flight sim experience I’ve ever had - and that’s just with using it for about 2 hours of messing with it. I’ll probably make a separate review post in a few days just to have all my thoughts in a clear easier to read/find place.

Glad to hear that! I’m pondering the yoke, the joy stick, and the pedals which would be awesome but quite expensive. Are you in the US, did you have to pay import duties?

Any Brunner users have multiple devices? I’m considering getting all 3 of these:
CLS-E MK II YOKE
CLS-E FORCE FEEDBACK JOYSTICK
CLS-E MK II RUDDER with Toe Brakes

but I wonder can I have the yoke and the stick both connected but only 1 enabled per aircraft? Or do I have to plug and unplug anything to switch between using the yoke or the stick?

I gather the yoke would be connected to the rudder by a CAT-5 cable, can the stick be connected at the same time like daisy chained or not?