Look I get it some of you are happy about a new version of the simulator coming out. It’s valid to be happy that another possibly better version of the sim is coming down the pipe. Maybe it’s a engine limitation or direct X 12 does not play nice with FS 2020.
I am personally happy that Microsoft/Asobo have confirmed that store purchases will be compatible with the new version. But just like any new iteration some things will likely not work in the new version.
Please understand why this is a worry for some of us hundreds of hours and thousands of dollars into FS 2020. Some players like me invested heavily into FS 2020 on the idea that it was a long term project. After FSX many of us thought MSFS was dead and was never coming back. But then a rumor of a new sim was in the works and later confirmed was a happy day for people like me.
When the sim launched the developers said this is going to be a long supported simulator. And even though it took them 2 years to fix the aircraft I wanted in the sim I was happy. I still wish that ATC could be reworked to understand SID’s and Star’s. Yes I’m aware of VATSIM and have no interest.
If FS 2024 is everything that FS 2020 and more then the concern will go away. But many major issues have not been addressed because of the voting system that has been used to determine what fixes should get pushed leaving gaping holes with no hope of getting addressed. Incorrectly labeled taxi ways is fine for the casual simmer but it’s not okey for premium deluxe buyers where many airports where labeled as hand crafted. How does a hand crafted major airport have mislabeled taxi ways? Also in the premium deluxe aircraft where considered payware level and did not get fix until AAU1 because of working title. And I’m not talking about the avionics I’m talking about the basic control of the aircraft.
So will this new release be the same engine and everything done so far with a new coat of paint. Meaning Raytracing, Jobs and the same old sim for $70 Normal - $100 Deluxe - $170 premium deluxe. Then have the same voting system where something YOU actually care about gets passed along because it never gets enough votes to get looked at until a modding team comes along and fixes it.
I feel like they should have waited another 2 years and really zipped up FS 2020. I’m currently only having one issue right now and that is great. ATC just cuts out on me in the middle of a flight and I have already submitted a bug report with video and have even posted the video on these forums.
If all the required internet connection for photogrammetry is in place and running for 10 to 15 more years that would help elevate some worry. By then I’m sure flight simulation will take another leap but please Microsoft/ Asobo let me have more time with my setup.
I’m under no delusion that they need money to pay everyone and keep the lights on. Flight simulation is a niche hobby in the gaming industry so I have no idea what the financials look like with the in game store and such. We really just need more information at this point.
Another topic that will only serve to bait more useless and repetitive posts. I understand your concern, but things have quieted down a lot since the MSFS 2024 notice. So why stir things up!
If you are unhappy with someone’s post then flag it, you are welcome to flag mine. I agree with WellREDBarron, moderation is best left up to the staff with regards to any of the forums including sub forums.
I’m not trying to cause trouble believe me. This is a reactionary post due to what I have been reading today. So I would say it has not exactly calmed down.
Again I implore everyone to please not discuss moderation. Keep the topic on the body of my thoughts and past the topic title.
Then perhaps you shouldn’t make a misleading title referring to forum moderation and making a plea in the body of your post for others to temper their attitudes?
I do agree with you 100% on this, though. Tons of this going on surrounding an announcement that was of minimal information.
I see no need for a user to create a post to remind other users of forum rules. Enforcing compliance with the rules is the moderators’ job. If you have any concerns that the mods aren’t doing their job right, you can message them with users who have made comments that you think have broken the rules.
Also, your thoughts on MSFS 2024 you can leave them in the main discussion thread.
There is no need to create more unnecessary drama.
I can not explain why I have posted this in this manner but I have legitimate reasons. This is how I have chosen to use my voice on this forum. You can ignore everything in the body of my post and judge me on the title I have chosen.
I would really rather you engage me on the subject matter in the OP. I have been put in a extreme disadvantage and I can not reference why and I am not going to do so.
So please.
What do you think about how things that have been broken in the simulator for most of it’s life time? What is your opinion of the bug voting system? Do you think it’s fair that the buyers of the premium deluxe version had a mostly broken product for FS 2020’s life cycle? What do you think about the current state of ATC?
This post is for everyone that has replied so far and have not addressed anything I talked about.
For the same reason that you find the so called drama you find the blind supporters who are more worried to protect the developers image and their future rather than their own time and money as customers. That’s another drama as well as developers don’t need to be protected at all. They work as any of us and have to deal with angry customers as any of us has to do too.
Many things have been done well in MSFS for sure, but others not at all. Developers don’t need to be clapped nor roasted. We just purchased a game so the only thing which should be important for users is that game works well. If it’s not the case it’s normal that people disagrees on the official forum and explains what is faulty or missing so that developers can get that feedback to improve. I don’t see that as a threat of any kind at but as something normal in any business.
When you see so many people complaining that’s because we really have relevant open issues here. If the issues were not relevant everyone would be really excited about the new game as we all were before MSFS was launched.
I don’t know if that is true. I think what you find are people who are genuinely excited for one reason or another. Whether that reason is lower expectations than others or just a different focus, I think I speak for several people who say that
a) I am genuinely excited by the future of this sim, just as I have been since the announcement in 2019. It hasn’t always been smooth sailing, but it has been better than not in my opinion.
b) The level of anger at this announcement is straight-up baffling. We’re still so dang early into it. FS2020 is in a really good state (not perfect) and if it left off here I’d be happy with it but am excited for what the rest of this year’s roadmap brings as well as for what the year 2024 might bring (to the current sim). So while I don’t expect everyone to share my enthusiasm (though admittedly some do) I also don’t expect the level of anger I’m seeing in some of these threads and am genuinely baffled by it.
I know you and I personally have been on opposing sides of the debate a few times, and while I can see some of your points, I don’t understand the emotion behind them. It truly is baffling to me that people can be this angry after an initial reveal trailer, a 3 entry faq, and a 30-second mention in a podcast. Like, we literally know nothing at this point, but people are already super angry. If as more information comes out it turns out that the future really is bleak, then maybe I can see some of it, but at this stage, it is, as I’ve said a few times now, genuinely baffling.
No, I am not a blind follower. I can think for myself. I just truly don’t believe in the concept of “No, all bugs must be fixed before you can move on”. Half the time in software, you move on specifically BECAUSE of the outstanding bugs. I summed up an example of where the community held up progress for the sake of “We were promised this would be working” in the linked post below. I see your viewpoint, I just don’t believe in it. However, its clear that for some people, you either agree with the negativity or you are a blind follower incapable of thinking for themselves. And that means they aren’t seeing my side.
Makes absolutely no sense.
You claim ‘legitimate reasons’ and ‘extreme disadvantage’ but refuse any explanation.
Also in essense everything you wrote in this post you decided to open here is already being discussed in several others, so it would be customary to go and post it there and not open a new duscussion.
In my eyes starting with the inflamatory title, the redundant post itself that bears no relation to the title, and your unsubstantiated claims of having legitimate reasons (concerning what? what reasons?), and being put at a disadvantage (how? from whom?), this whole thread in my eyes is just attention seeking => click bait.
And now - finally - we have arrived at ‘name-calling’. Maybe that was the whole point of the exercise…
Well, I won’t know whether I like a topic before I open it, will I?
The only indication is the title. And since in this case the topic has nothing to do with the title … I decided to point that out. Simple
Thank you
Provided than people don’t shout insults intense debates are always healthy, despite the opposite point of views. I also share many of the points of those who I called “blind supporters”. I also like game and indeed I supported it with thousands € in addition to be participating on SU10 beta for months and for free.
The balance between my efforts and what I got as product is not compensating it anymore to repeat the same process once more. It’s simply that. I can leave with game however it is. When it’s working better I will actively support it again. When they decide the content is the priority I won’t and I will just play less. There will be time enough to sell addons in the future.
In my understanding now we need consolidation, mainly to avoid the same mistakes from the past. Due to those mistakes they are developing a new weather engine for instance, as fixing the old was not worthy according to their own words. It will be good for game maybe but it could have been fixed in time as well if they were not focussed on content. If MS2024 means consolidation I will be happy to go in. If it’s just a porting of the existing bugs with some enhancements I prefer to let it become more mature and let others pay the party.
Sorry, but your topic is about „calling each other names“ and someone politely suggested to leave it to moderation.
That‘s very much on-topic. Everything else is just the umpteenth rehash of what has been dragged through the village a thousand times already.
So I agree very much with the sentiment that there is no more „meta discussion about previous discussions“ necessary, because every possible argument - based on the little-to-none-nothing we know so far - has already been made in any of the previous discussions.
So relax, enjoy the great MSFS 2020 throughout the year and let‘s all look forward to what is there to come and be announced.
If software is complex that’s not a problem of customers. They are just charged in accordance. But selling the idea of simulation complexity and then leave a ton of bugs unattended is just reflecting lack of commitment or a project too big for your capabilities. Some bugs are acceptable for sure but core features needed for the simulation basics which are not working well is not acceptable in my opinion.
If SW is complex you put costs on your side and solve it as any project does. Then release it and launch a new baseline later on to recover those costs. This is the normal way to proceed I have seen at industry. The other approach is also valid and some people will still support that. Others will see risks and don’t do it. It’s nothing else than that. Game can still live without a bunch of customers. I would just try to avoid that as you may still need their money at some point in the future.
And in the meantime avoid assuming that everything will be a disaster, that MS is out to steal “their sim” from them, find ways of charging them again for the same bug ridden content, gamifying (god forbid) their simulator, using xbox to usurp and eliminate the pc master race, admit that MSFS 2020 was just a beta for the real sim, dumb down the pc graphics even more for xbox and generally screw everyone over multiple times just because they fancy it and all the other myths, lies and conspiracy theories that have anounded this forum in an embarrassingly juvenile way if the last week or so.
