Don’t be to harsh…here’s why you shouldn’t

Discussion Hub General Discussion
43

cross platform isnt as much of a problem as shared multiplayer servers and unified controls.

It would require seperate sims to seperate console and PC players on the servers, or give us the choice if we want to be on a “PC-only” or a “cross platform server”

Same for the controls. We had perfectly fine working controls for PC.
I understand that console requires different inputs, but i do not understand why it has to be forced to everyone instead of making it optional via the settings.
They cahnged much more than just the Lock / Legacy cockpit interaction and none of this other changes can be reverted by switching to legacy control.

But what is the worst for me, is the constant CTD that came with SU 5 and the broken promise of improved CPU utilization the Devs presentend in a Video ( mainthread was no more at 100% constanlty and all Cores were utilized equaly) while the the reality shows, that one core is still at 100% while all other cores have very little load.
The Perfomrnace boost seems to mainly be reached by degrading visuals and have objects unloaded when out of sight. But this gave us now imersion breaking pop-ins when turning head. Especially in VR or with Track-iR this is a massive price to pay for a few rames more…

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44

Why would I care what you want to do?

45

Plus every 3rd party developer would need to support two versions. Every support question would need to specify which version the user is running.

Same issues (even more so) with the idea of non-mandatory updates.

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46

Lmao, you have the worst takes out of everyone. You are not a shareholder of the game. You are an end user that MS is paying for server time to use all of the data needed for the sim.

You are in fact a burden to MS and an ongoing cost. If they were smart they would charge you a monthly fee to play the game.

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47

All graphics card models are made only by two manufacturers. Nvidia and AMD and if we take Nvidia as an example 3 generations of cards takes us back to 2016 (the 10xx series)
All of which can use the same drivers released a week or so ago.

All processor models? Again. Just 2 manufacturers and of those Intel have been iterating essentially the same architecture since Sandybridge. Their first major tech change in years comes later this year with Alder Lake.
Sure, AMD actually shook things up. Their architecture is different and has actually also changed more dramatically from one generation to the next than Intel’s has however they both essentially play within the same field. (Please note that this also extends to motherboard chipsets)

All RAM? Again, ALL ram is made by about 3 manufacturers. As with gpu’s all the OEM’s are doing is buying somebody else’s silicon and slapping it onto a PCB.

Storage? Yes. There is a little more variety here. While getting rarer mechanical drives still exist (although most of us now use these only for deeper storage) Sata ssd’s and pcie nvme ssd’s and rare as hens teeth the Intel/micron 3d xpoint.
But all of the above use the same couple of interfaces, and once again there is not as much variation as you might think by looking at brands. Under the labels a lot of the components are made by the same few manufacturers. However, of all the components you list the variation with regards core technologies and controllers is the largest.

There are of course OS/config variations that have the capacity to be wildly different and indeed poor choice of settings on several levels can and will have a very big impact upon performance. So this, rather than the hardware itself is the single biggest challenge.

That said, all this changes this year and to a degree next year also when Intel and AMD both shift to new sockets and introduce DD5 support as well as a raft of other changes which combined represent the biggest change in PC tech in a pretty long time. (Thanks to Intel effectively having no competition and basically sitting on their hands for about a decade.)

As for internet connection
Yes
So much of the FS2020 experience is streamed that indeed access to the servers is central to performance.

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48

errr, it is optional under the settings

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49

Exactly. I can’t believe some of the bad takes being spread here. They want their $60 to support two versions of the sim and all the costs for Azure cloud services.

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50

I agree with you. They will most likely be casual players, however, MS has their $$$ now and that is what this is all about and it is working very well.

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51

I bet you were the same guy who predicted MSFS would be a failure at launch.

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52

“Do you understand the difference between monthly and a one time payment?”

you don’t understand that i did not make one time purchase and was not intending on playing without purchasing additional content + the hardware in which MS have stakes in

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No, you made a one time purchase like everyone else. Asobo has no stake in whatever hardware or 3PD software you were going to or not going to purchase. They have a contract with MS.

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The mandatory update that has destroyed users experiences had an “eh, no thanks” option in the settings?

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55

is it?

No it is not!

the only thing that can be toggled in the menue is the “cockpit interaction” between Lock and Legacy.
But there were many other changes that are obvioulsy necessary for console and are now forced to PC as well.

EG: so far I was using the same button for “pause” and bring up the menue in flight and then for “Resume” again.
Now this button only brings up the menu, but for resume I have to use the mouse and click “Resume”.
Just one small example of many more…

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56

You are right I’m sure with all this, but 2 (GPUs) x 2 (CPUs) x 3 (RAM) x 2 (SSD/HDD) x 4 (O/S versions - say, I’m guessing) still = 144 variations. And that’s before you consider what else is running in the background on everyone’s PC, failed windows updates that people may have, anti-virus software variations, internet variations, monitors, pheripherals, audio drivers, bluethooth configurations, 3 different USB variants… it’s still a lot of variability to test

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57

Starting to receive several flags on multiple posts within this topic. It has been temporarily closed, and will reopen after a short period. When it does, please keep in mind there is no room for discussion on who is considered a “real simmer” and who is a “casual x-box player”. Any and all playing styles are welcome and encouraged to enjoy the sim however they like. Regardless of experience level. Ongoing messages directed at each other (rather than discussing MSFS) are not needed. Thanks for understanding.

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This topic was automatically opened after 9 hours.

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Well I wake up this morning and realize that I opened Pandora’s box with my initial message :rofl:

I absolutely did not want to start a debate on the different types of players and who deserves what. I was only talking here about development, which is a titanic task, which deserves respect and patience.

There is also another aspect, which everyone forgets in my opinion (you go and see, it will seem weird to you when it is serious.)

We are in the IT business. How many times have you experienced very random problems on your PC, in all areas combined, which were resolved with a simple restart? Sincerely? Me, hundreds. It’s the same with anything mechanical and / or electronic. Sometimes you just need to kick it and it works, and yet NOBODY can explain why. I’m not saying to kick your PC! Don’t make me say what I didn’t say :rofl:

I’m just trying to stress that YES there are some unexplained things that must be even more frustrating for developers than gamers. When developers see that a player with a 3090 only has CTDs while the one with a 2080ti has the smoothest experience, he must be helpless. Especially when other players with a 3090 have a smooth experience though!

By the way, if a moderator comes by here and can bring up the following question for the next Q&A :star_struck::

“How can we explain such a disparity of experience and performance on machines that are sometimes very similar, and on top of the range?”

thank you !

60

Just want to say this: Simming has been testing your rig since the stone ages.

It’s never been different, it will never be different and the reactions on foeums will also never be different.

Wanna be a flight simmer? Be careful what yiu wish for.

:wink:

All the best!

61

The debate about having 2 different versions, one for XBox and one for PC, is non sense. We have 2 different version already (I’m a dev too).

Does the XBox player can change object LOD distance? Can they change the AA type? Can they change Render Scale? Do they run on DX11?, did they have access to VR menu? Nope, nope, nope, again nope and re-nope.

That mean we have here 2 different branches, or a big one with big chunks of codes hardware dependent been linked specifically for PC or for XBox version and/or a bunch of #ifdef #else in code (programmer will understand).

No way it’s possible both codes are the same, and executable are the same, no way. Obviously some big part of the code are common, but a ton are dependent of the target.

So they can change tons of things specifically for Xbox or for PC users, just adding some “if then” like they did, and they already did it at least for settings, for DX12 on Xbox and not on PC currently, etc.

Now, I’m part of persons seeing the glass full empty. I didn’t fly those last weeks hoping for this new update, so I tried to watch it as a newbie, like if it was the first time I launch it. I think about people which bought it yesterday or today, how lucky they are, installation problems apart :wink:

I launched the Discovery tours and was amazed by the quality and the smoothness of the sim. My monitoring tool was launched in my Android phone so I immediately saw the huge amount of headroom my GPU have, the lower CPU usage and the solid 60fps I had everywhere vsync ON (barely 60 previously). So I cranked all to Ultra (1080p 42" TV) and saw the sim didn’t take a hit, solid 60fps everywhere.

How beautiful is the World, how beautiful is this Sim right now, (if you forget it could be better if you launched it weeks ago) Fresh eyes, it’s the best I flew by far! Do me a favor and try the Bora-bora tour or the Egyptian one, or Naples, or any of them!

No CTD for me, more than 12 hours in SU5, I guess I’m lucky and understand the frustration. For me only little problems needs tuning (trim, music during discovery tour, altitude problem, etc.) but this apart, the render is perfect from fresh eyes, I didn’t experiment lot of pop-in or I don’t note them (used to it, lot of sim and games do that), Trees appear at a distance, and what? I’m baffled by the performance, simply amazing!

So for sure they will fix that and having the sim also on console will not break our experience at all (2 different version I said), they will add new options for us PC users to push limit of our machines, we will be able again to complains about performance going down for sure :rofl:, and we will have the best sim ever.

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62

it was the hopeless way it was delivered.