FS 2020 - VFR Only Sim?

User Support Hub Virtual Reality (VR)
1

I’m starting to think so, for me at least. When I fly IFR, which inevitably entails a lot of ‘button pushing’, it’s just a matter of time before I’ll get a CTD to abruptly end the session. This behavior is worse after SU8. I am unable to even complete a 45 minute flight now before CTD. I typically use the PMDG DC-6B for the realism it affords, but the same behavior occurs with the stock 747. I use the sim exclusively in VR with Navigraph Charts as the only addon besides the DC-6…I do not have scenery mods etc. One sort of feels like they are walking on eggshells, so to speak - never knowing which knob or switch will bring a CTD.

The SU8 download and installation went smoothly for me fortunately. I’ve read where quite a few people could not get it downloaded, and had all manner of CTD’s just trying to start the sim, or go through the menus. Good grief! I’ve been fortunate in that regard, but it appears to me, that this software is just ‘brittle’ - it’s seem unstable. I cannot recall having a piece of software crash so frequently. I can fly around VFR without messing with the navigation equipment and other airplane systems, and it usually performs well without crashing.

I can appreciate that it is a complex program, so this is not intended to lambast Microsoft or Asobo over the matter. I marvel at the simulation when it is working correctly…how in the world did they put that together with a mouse and a keyboard? But I do wonder, are quite a few of you folks successfully operating complex airplanes without CTD’s using VR?

My system uses Windows 10, exclusively for flight simulation. I have noticed new issues with the mouse behavior in VR, post SU8. I reported these to the Zendesk. The mouse randomly just does not interact with the flight deck controls, like tuning a radio or turning on pitot heat. And then it works, usually if I ‘look away’ at something else. The mouse can also get very laggy. They sure fixed the previous issue where if the mouse was on an open Window, like the map, the controls would not respond. Presumably whatever they did to fix that, caused these new issues. I can live with all of this, but the increase in CTD’s…well, I can’t seem to complete a flight now. Touch and goes, sure, but not a ‘real’ flight. The stability of the sim seems to have gotten worse with each new update.

I just tried turning off Real Weather, and Traffic, to see if that would help. CTD just interacting with the in-game menu before even taking off. I have reviewed the CTD FAQ provided by Microsoft, and experimented with the recommendations, without success.

I have the Premium Deluxe download version. Most settings are Medium or High. DX11. nVidia Driver 511.79.

I9-11900K/3080ti/64Gb/No overclock/Varjo Aero using the Varjo Base Software OpenXR. I do use the OpenXR Toolkit. I have Honeycomb controllers. I added deadzones to all controllers (to try to address the lagging mouse issue).

I’ve read with interest, many posts, and experimented much with settings and all manner of tweaking. If someone has a similar configuration, and operates a complex airplane in a similar manner…without any CTD’s, I’d appreciate hearing about that. Some folks have all kinds of issues with FS 2020; I guess I am somewhere in the middle. This behavior may come with the territory, meaning, it’s a VR thing. (??) I never use 2D mode.

So again, is the sim rock solid for those with a similar setup and operational profile in VR?

Thank you in advance.

Edit I would be particularly interested in people’s success- or not - using the PMDG DC-6 in VR. I do not use the AFE but rather do everything manually…lots of cockpit interaction…lots of opportunity for CTD. For me at least.

2

have also seen strange mouse issues. sometimes work sometimes no in VR.
but could not check in detail what is wrong. they f****d it again.

3

One person deleted his mouse profile and then recreated it, which fixed his issue, as he was using VR. I do not think the VR addons have all the bugs worked out. I do not VR. Also look for thread “VCRUNTIME140.dll” issues, see if that helps, it did for me.
Every update brings errors and problems, and errors and problems go away. Like you, believe this game is mostly for VFR flying. I can promise you “IT IS NOT AS REAL AS IT GETS” now, because I want to setup huge plane using IFR/ILS and it does not work well. I did complete my 1st ever one the other day, and have been siming since FS-95. Taught how to fly and navigate by MD-11 captain. Can do it in X-Plane fine, this sim is buggy.

4

Thank you MeridianSquid71 for the suggestion on the “VCRUNTIME140.dll” issue. It is not something I am getting but good to know. I should also mention that almost all CTD’s for me, leave no trace in the Windows Event Viewer. FS 2020 starts normally the next time, with no option to start in Safe Mode, as happens with other CTD’s. I occasionally have the more ‘official’ “Exception code: 0xc0000005” CTD, but they are rare.

I did manage to regain some stability, and reduce in-game CTD’s in the sim by using Process Lasso. I had purchased a license for the application back in 2017, though at the time, I had used the app to increase performance. I believe there is a free version as well. In my internet reading, I noticed more than one user attribute their CTD’s to Process Lasso, so I was wary of using it.

With the goal of stability, versus picking up FPS, I restricted FS 2020 to Cores 1-7 (“CPU Affinity”), leaving Core 0, for Windows and other processes that I think are more likely to use Core 0. I also set the “CPU Priority” to “Above Normal” for Flight Simulator. Processor is I9-11900K stock speed.

I still have an occasional CTD, but far less than before, when it was every flight. The new post-SU8 mouse behavior is annoying, but I can still use the sim. Before employing Process Lasso, I was about to relegate FS 2020 to a VFR only sim.

5

No trave in event viewer, that is interesting, as they should. I had to clear out all entries in EV so I could find the MSFS errors.
As a normalcy, I do not have CTD’s, yes a few. Some from a geographical file in sim, which caused them, MS/Asobo johnny on the spot on that one, as several folks mentioned it when flying into one area. Then I caused some myself with freeware plane and the VCRUNTIME140.dll one. Removing that file and then reinstalling C++2015 cleared that one.
If no aftermarket virus/firewall problems, and sure no virus’s, just not sure what is going on, your hardware seems to be well above average to handle sim. One post, and don’t know where it is now, said to tweak some things in Nvidia settings, and there is a YouTube on it, which I followed to some degree, and that then limits my FPS to no more than 30, that and SU8 it appears cooled down my GPU about 14 C from pre SU8 temps. As rule, the sim starts, and I can fly in it, and SU8 seemed to fix some things which bugged me to no end in the 747.
I do wish luck and hope you can figure this out.

6

MeridianSquid71…thank you for the additional thoughts on this matter. And yes, CTD’s with no record in the Event Viewer makes effective troubleshooting nearly impossible. Others have cited this shortcoming. It really comes down to ‘trial and error’ trying to track down the cause of CTD’s without some kind of error log. It appears to me that FS 2020 is just particularly vulnerable to crashing.

One thing I need to add regarding using Process Lasso and FS 2020 - Project Lasso (the way I have it configured) has to be ‘off’ when starting the simulator, or it will not start. I am no expert on Process Lasso but I can say, with Flightsimulator.exe restricted to Cores 1-7, it will not start on my machine.

On the menu bar for Process Lasso Pro, the first item is “Main”. I select “Stop Governor”, start FS 2020 and let it load to its main menu, and then select “Start Governor”. A person could probably also prevent Process Lasso from starting with Windows in the first place, and just start it after FS 2020 is at the menu screen. Odd, but that’s how it is for me. It is worth it as Process Lasso has greatly reduced my CTD’s. I hope this is of help to someone else.

7

Make sure your sim is running in full screen mode and your are not just closing it by clicking on the window close button (X) while operating mouse in VR.

1 Like
8

Regarding the mouse getting laggy, I had this happen again the other day, and found (in this case), the culprit. I have a Honeycomb Bravo throttle, and normally use all 4 throttle levers for the PMDG DC-6B. I decided to fly a twin engine jet, and removed 3 and 4 throttle levers, leaving just the attach ‘stub’ exposed, and pulled those back to the aft most position to get them out of the way. This is the position they must be in to install the rubber covers that come with the Bravo throttle for unused axes.

Well, the mouse pointer was just whacked out…effectively unusable. Big stutters, did not follow the actual movement smoothly. Hmmm. I pulled the 3 and 4 throttle axes forward to their normal minimum throttle position, and the mouse movement returned to normal. In that aft position, switch 25/26/27/28 are activated (in this case 27 and 28). I had nothing assigned to those switches, but their being constantly on…well…my wired mouse did not like it. USB controllers have been cited by others for causing mouse problems though most of what I’ve seen has to due with spiky potentiometers.

Oh, and anytime I forget to start Process Lasso, I get an early CTD. Starting the “Governor” after starting FS 2020, gives me a lot less CTD’s. If I forget that, FS 2020 reminds me by unceremoniously dumping back to my desktop. If any of you ever listened to Car Talk on National Public Radio, it’s the equivalent of a “dope slap”.

And thank you stekusteku for the comment on running in full screen mode.

9

In case I missed it, the Honeycomb Bravo and Alpha (assumed for alpha) is they both take over some actions which used to be done by mouse click, preventing double duty so to speak.

For months, I fought mine trying to figure out why I could not turn on certain lights and functions with my mouse as I used to do before HCTQ. After deleting sim, and reinstalling, I figure out, the Bravo takes over mouse control of anything that now has a switch or lever action in its configuration file.
It has a configuration file in the sim, which the sim acts on every time you start it.

I sold my Honeycomb Bravo and got a Virpil TM-3 Throttle, and now, like it should, mouse does what it’s supposed to, and TM-3 does what it’s supposed to. Double duty is also allowed, if I want to program a light switch, I can, and also still use the mouse. The Virpil software stores the calibrations in the device, not the sim. The sim just sees an action, which you setup in the Control Settings. I could make a switch for instance be a throttle movement. It is very easy to setup.

IF you should think it needs calibration (HCTQ or other device) in windows calibration DONT, as WC only allows 32 physical buttons. MSFS can see at least 132 buttons and actions. FSX can only see 32, so it needs a setting in Virpil software to make anything over button 33 work. There are some programs you can get which also allow more buttons, but MSFS does not need it, X-Plane 11 also does not need it. Only older sims and space simulators need help.

For me, the HCTQ worked fine, and I setup the most complex 4 engine jet first, because it was easier for me to delete actions, then add levers and then program them in. Having all of them already setup, means you copy that profile, renaming it for the type of plane, i.e., 2 Engine Jet-BA 787 for instance. Then just delete for instance throttle 3 & 4, leaving the spoilers and flaps setup where they are, and then everything else is done. Same for a single engine plane, but you do have to put in a mixture lever for instance.

10

FWIW, I am suddenly no longer having CTD’s, so I thought I would add to my existing post to bring closure to my issue. What, you may ask, was the solution? I wish I knew. Let me explain.

We are selling our house, and I had to disassemble my ‘man cave’. It wouldn’t look good in the photos I was told. Grrrr. This was several weeks ago not long after loading the new PMDG 737…which would CTD often enough for me to feel like I was always ‘walking on eggshells’. A single flight leg, perhaps OK. A second…well…likely a CTD when engaging the A/P or doing something with the MCP. My CTD’s were pre-dated the release of the 737, and would occur on other airplanes I flew, most often when using the A/P. All of this was in VR…I don’t use the regular monitor view.

Everything went back in their boxes, and I figured I’d just pick up simming whenever I got moved.

This weekend, realizing I might be in this house longer than expected, I decided to set up my computer and controllers in the basement. This is where it gets hazy. Same computer, but different monitor (HD vs. my usual UHD). I left one controller out (TCA Throttle). I still have my controllers plugged into the same powered USB hub, though in perhaps different positions. And the hub may be plugged into a different USB port on the computer. Finally, being in a different room, the computer is plugged into a different power outlet. I didn’t pay attention to how things got hooked up as I did not anticipate there being any difference.

This is all after SU9/WU9 which had all been loaded when they first came out, though I did notice when I connected this weekend after several weeks away, that MSFS installed a small update. I don’t recall reading that there was a hotfix issued. (??)

So now I can fly the 737NG to my heart’s content, complete with Navigraph Maps and Sky4Sim in VR, and perform all manner of A/P and MCP manipulations for multiple legs…no CTD’s. The sim is rock solid for me now for the first time since I started using it last year. Remarkable. I just wish I knew what it was that’s different that could account for the elimination of the CTD’s.

It reminds me in a way, of an old aviation saying: “There are three simple rules to making a perfect landing. Unfortunately, no one knows what they are.”

i9-11900K/3080Ti/64Gb…nothing overclocked. Varjo Aero with OpenXR Toolkit. MSFS 2020 Store Version.

11

This topic was automatically closed 30 days after the last reply. New replies are no longer allowed.