Has anyone angled for a refund on their FS2020 License? [Xbox]

Having just sat through 3 hours of install-reinstall-CTD-repeat, I’m pretty much done with this. [Xbox Series X].

I spent over $1000 AUD (solely for FS2020) purchasing a console, Xbox Live, an FS2020 Deluxe license, and a load of addons from the MS store, plus a flight stick, and it’s unplayable.

Firstly, it IS better when I try it with no addons installed whatsoever… I experienced one freeze/ CTD at Heathrow, and other than that it seemed OK, albeit the framerate seems a little lower than pre-SU9. I only tried 4 flights, so a 25% failure rate is not exactly impressive either.

Where I have an issue is when adding a single third-party airport - I tried FlyTampa Athens, Bristol EGGD, and Macau, (as the only thing installed over the base sim) and they all cause CTDs in the stock A320.

After 9 Sim Updates, this is not acceptable. What exactly is the purpose of the MS Store if it is not to permit addons which have met Microsoft/ Asobo’s own standards in terms of stability? What are they actually testing for/ vetting prior to releasing these? Why are developers not able to test on retail hardware? Surely they should only be allowing addons that meet certain standards and are coded against the sim’s APIs/ best practice conventions?
Also surely they are testing these on retail hardware and therefore should be getting the same experience as users like me?

The promise of the MS Store was one of the key reasons I went ahead and purchased all the hardware/ software above rather than going down the PC route, as I have done with every sim since FS 5. It’s not unreasonable to expect vetted, quality addons that are actually compatible with standard issue hardware. The sim has not lived up to this - heck it is not even totally stable in its base form - hence the question in the thread title. Would love to hear from someone at Microsoft on this.

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Good luck with that. Doesn’t even happen on pc.

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Xbox users should have a stronger case. Single hardware platform, walled-garden addon ecosystem. Nothing should be broken.

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If purchased on Credit card try your provider

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I feel you. Same boat here. One thing, instead of canceling the whole thing and waiting for hopefully better days (I am…), you can at least try a refund on your airports. I did to. Only thing is, you can only get 2 refunds per year…

I agree totally, those 3rd party add-ons shouldn’t be allowed in the MP for Xbox. That really is a shame.

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Every SU breaks some third party add-ons and Microsoft/Asbobo provides little or no notice to the third party developers about what’s going to change in SU’s, or documentation about how to fix their add-ons or add new features the SU implements. Not the third party developers fault.

Even getting your copy of the game refunded wouldn’t help with all the money you spent on hardware, so at this point you may as well just wait it out for things to be fixed instead of tilting at windmills.

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So you can buy an unlimited number of airports but only get a refund on two?! Is that even legal?

Well here is Australia I could easily sell the XSX at retail and hopefully get refunds on some of the addons… So I will ‘only’ be a couple hundred $ down…

Also the addons like Athens never worked 100% anyway.

Yup. Third time I did a refund for an airport, it was rejected. Only 2 refunds per year. My “damage” are 3 airports and the Embraer’s which I can’t use. The Embraer’s get fixed, the developer is working on it.

I’m really really careful what I’m bying now. Only 3rd party airports from developers from which I know they will work, such as Pyreegue and Uk2000. I really wanted Renton and Tirana last week, but I know almost certain they CTD.

I raised a Zendesk ticket challenging this - I pointed out that someone buying two products can get a 100% refund, someone who buys every product and asks for a refund for three or more products gets rejected.

Despite it being a legal requirement (in the UK, at least) that goods sold must be fit for purpose, as soon as the word “legal” is mentioned, the Zendesk ticket is closed, with a standard cut n’paste reply mentioning that they can’t comment “on threats of legal action etc.”

I simply asked a question… I even suggested a system that would meet the consumer halfway (if you buy ‘x’ amount of DLC, you would in theory be entitled to ask for “y” number of refunds - they could still reject them if it was felt that the consumer was taking advantage), but got no further than the instant legal shutdown.

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I gave up with Xbox. Did the same investment route and wasted too much money just to sit watching reloads. I sold the Xbox series x and bought a pc. There have been a couple of crashes (VOR problems?) but much more reliable and fun.

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I only bought one add on airport. To me they are more trouble than they are worth, the default airports look pretty good to me.

Its not the airports that are causing the CTD, its a stability issue with the sim in Xbox. My advice would be to give it time. The sim is not yet working as it should but it will get there.

As someone has said, SU’s always end up causing a problem for some 3rd party addons. The core sim is Asobo’s responsibility, yes the third party stuff is sold through the marketplace but it’s up to the developers of the addons to work on compatibility following an update, this isn’t up to Asobo.

Addons will be updated in due course, I’m sure. But again, Asobo/Microsoft are not responsible for 3rd party content. They make sure it works with the existing version of the sim but they cannot and do not test third party compatibility when they update the sim.

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Instead of a purchase and refund process that’s a hassle for both parties and the financial institutions. I wonder, with a closed ecosystem like Xbox, surely there’s a way to give all their games a 1 hour playthrough demo for free that starts ticking when the app is opened after everything is completely downloaded. Once that 1 hour is reached the game locks itself and just make us pay for it to continue with it.

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But, i was thinking. Once you purchased an add-on, it will always be yours. When unistalled, they show up in the content list under unistalled items. Those 2 airports which i get refunded for, are still in my possession. Sure, i dont use them at this time because they CTD, but once updated (hopefully) i can start using them again. That means, i got my money back for those, so actually i’m playing them for free once they work again. Am i correct?

In short, yes.

Then in that case, i can understand why MS is carefull about refunding. They are not an philanthropic institution.

On this,

  1. The base sim still crashes occasionally

  2. The entire point of having an SDK, a set of APIs and so on is that platform changes (on the whole) should allow the addons to continue working. Given Athens and Macau never really worked properly, but are just worse now, means that either:

A) The developers did not write them according to best practice/ use the appropriate SDKs/ APIs properly. In this case they shouldn’t be in the MP.
OR
B) There are flaws with the entire development, testing, and deployment process that means that there is no guarantee of stability even when using proper tools and best practices. In which case, MS should be vetting things more carefully prior to releasing them to the MP, and proactively fixing the underlying issues (e.g. there is still no way for a dev to test their work on a retail XBox without waiting for release and then buying their own add-on - how crazy is that?!)

In reality I expect most addons are a combination of A) and B). In which case, why has an organization like Microsoft, that OWNS probably the world’s most widely used tooling designed to facilitate a CI/CD and automated testing (GitHub) and no doubt has extremely sophisticated development best-practice and tools in-house for its vast array of mission-critical, enterprise grade software, hardware, and infrastructure, not able to find a way to thoroughly vet addons after all this time? It’s absolutely ridiculous.

The MP, which is a significant component of the sim, and the base sim itself are STILL fundamentally flawed on the Xbox after over a year. That is unacceptable.

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I purchased/upgraded the deluxe version for the 787 from the free GamePass version. Given how awful the standard 787 is, I asked and received a refund. I’ve still got the 787 and other aircraft which came with the deluxe edition.