ILS Approach Waypoint runaround

Discussion Hub General Discussion
1

Given all the talk of bugs this could be a sim issue, but could equally be my ignorance.

I’ve been playing with ILS approaches, figuring it out as I go kind of, so totally possible I’m doing it wrong. That’s why I like Flight sim, I can play with stuff I have no business messing with and just figure it out. Everything goes well, I figured out how to load an approach up in the G1000 (or even the Airbus.) but it’s this weird transition behavior that has me puzzled.

I usually leave my approach on automatic in flight planning so AI ATC will give me an active runway and approach clearance when I get there, and it does, wonderful. In flight, after I get my “expect” clearance I tap up my approach options for the destination airport, find that approach, and activate. Here is where it’s weird, autopilot sends me on some figure 8 convoluted circle to go back to a waypoint behind me and before the one I’m cleared to and then lines me up to the approach entry waypoint, despite the fact I’m usually already headed for it.

It’s like the approach setup is set for a waypoint too early. Instead of direct to the approach entry waypoint, it’s using my current position to go to some other nearby point first then circles me back. I’m pretty sure real ILS pilots don’t make 2 180 degree turns to backtrack then realign with the entry waypoint they are already cleared to, they just adjust heading direct to that entry waypoint and fly the approach on in.

It’s difficult for me to explain since I’m not a IFR pilot, if I need to perhaps later I’ll grab some screenshots to show how it runs me around if nobody understands what I’m talking about. I think it would all be solved if I had a way to just skip to next waypoint in the MFD, but I have not found an option for that.

18 Likes
2

I get this as well. I am assuming it is user error. Any guidance would be appreciated.

1 Like
3

I have encountered the exact same bug. I don’t think it’s user error, as apparently it affects other aircraft as well. I am happily en route IFR and get my arrival clearance from ATC; as soon as I punch it into the MCDU the aircraft starts doing a 180 to whatever the previous fpl waypoint was before picking up the procedure. It’s very difficult to force it to skip that waypoint.

I have found by pushing a random assortment of “DIR” waypoints on the MCDU I can eventually get back to the original F-PLAN page and delete all the earlier waypoints manually (press “CLR” then the key next to the waypoint you wish to delete).

1 Like
4

Thank you! I thought it was just me. I have been trying to think how best to describe it so I could post here about it too, but you have summed it up perfectly.

Hopefully it’s just a bug that will be sorted out, I thought I had a good grasp on the G1000, but those 180’s back to the last way point when activating an approach had me stumped

5

Hello,

hope I understand your all problem. Pls for first one important thing, one is Load approach and another is Activating approach. In case you don’t activate approach, your aircraft probably will go to IAF and then turninig around with procedure turn, maybe to infinity. Pls take a look for first to teaching yourself with very simple trainings - t/o from airport with ascend to some altitiude defined for app, set FPL now with start and dest airport, then set required app and activate in close destination from IAF. You can everytime check MFD where you are and no hurry.

1 Like
6

It’s not a training issue, the bug affects multiple aircraft and even the MCDU in the A320 exhibits the same behaviour as the G1000. I can assure you the approach was activated. The aircraft is doubling-back to a flightplan waypoint which has already been overflown, rather than proceeding to the Initial Approach Fix.

2 Likes
7

I have never had this issue but I have preconfigured my approach. In the future maybe do that until they fix the autopilot bugs.

8

I don’t think your behavior is a bug. The approach procedures in the GPS / Flight Computer will always follow a route applicable for the approach you have selected. There are multiple approaches for the same runway depending on the Way point you are coming from. So you can’t just get close to the runway and then use the automate approach procedures. They are meant to line up all incoming planes from one direction and guide them over a specific list of wps down to the runway. if you are already past some of them and activate the approach you will move back to the first waypoint in the list for the procedure.
Two ways avoiding that:
1/check which is the start wp for the procedure and start your approach near that
2/skip the WPs in you flight plan you already have passed

for both I would suggest using google to get some charts for the approaches you would like to use.

2 Likes
9

Very strange,

to me with more G1000 types tested in more different airports with different approaches (GPS/ILS?RNAV) all was working perfectly. In case of user didn’t specify aircraft type but only G1000 I can imagine as good type for training C172. Maybe one point for attention, I never use generic ATC because impossible to fly with and no reality. If this component plays role here, no other way as cancel it and not use it. Training can be performed also with alone in air…

10

Thanks but I know what a STAR is, and I use the AIP or Navigraph for my charts.

I am still in the descent, well before any of the arrival waypoints or IAFs when the approach gets offered by ATC and I load it in the MCDU. The aircraft immediately turns round and tries to fly back to the previous FPL waypoint that you have just overflown even if this waypoint is in the distant past and nothing to do with the STAR. From this point, the F-PLAN page is ‘locked’ and you can neither select or ‘CLR’ waypoints using the LSKs.

I strongly suspect this is related to how the ATC flight plan and the FMS flight plan are intrinsically linked in the new game engine. I have seen videos of successful approaches using the exact same ‘button presses’ as me on Youtube, but the common denominator is that they are all not using the inbuilt ATC. I will try to replicate this later.

7 Likes
11

All of mine with this issue have been with auto assigned approaches given by atc, not pre configured from the main flight planning map. Those work perfectly.
I have watched numerous videos but when loading and activating an assigned approach from atc the ap will have you fly back to the last waypoint. The approach loads correctly, the ap just flies back to the last waypoint flown over from the original flight planning and then follows the approach rather than heading to the initial approach fix. On one particular it had me fly 145mi back and then swung around and was normal after that. The flight plan locks too so you cannot simply select the next leg. Very strange with auto approach. I have been pre planning approaches now until it gets sorted.

5 Likes
12

Ive had this issue as well, in a variety of aircraft. Im a Private Pilot working on my Instrument rating. Usually, ATC clears you to the approach from a fix, and they give you that fix and you’ll head directly toward (or however you’re sequenced by atc, sometimes they already have you lined up with the IAF). Unfortunately in some of these aircraft, direct to a waypoint isn’t simulated, and when you activate the approach, in what seems like a desperate attempt to hit the fix (sometimes not even the Initial Approach Fix) it will toss you around any which way. Its like its inserting you into the approach through a predetermined waypoint when it should be setting you up from your current position. At the least, one should be able to assign a waypoint to fly directly to, not “take this predetermined path to”. Ive tried ILS, GPS, and nonprecison approaches and usually get turned around.

I say all that to say, its should not work how it is, but it isn’t just the fault of the nav system, this is a joint effort between the way ATC behaves and the nav system. Ive doneflightplans with no ATC and a predetermined approach, but these work fine becasue of the predetermined approach. Ive also tried changing my approach on purpose at the end of the STAR and bang, turns around all which way with no ATC. This will be an interesting issue to debug for sure. It may be that the approach is hard to calculate given when you set it

4 Likes
13

Sounds like it is not just me then. I literally spent hours watching videos of g1000 procedures and played around in some of the simulated ones out there and it is definitely off in the sim. I also noticed that if you try to request another approach from atc half the time you get no answer.
Workaround I have found is to find a marker more or less in the area and insert it. At least then it won’t fly you backwards 100 miles. Or delete the whole plan and do a direct to. The atc will then give you an approach from your current position.
I think you may be right about the atc and the calculations causing alot of it.

1 Like
14

Guys,

did another wonderful IFR flight with C208 from Bratislava to Krakow, absolutelly perfect. FPL set on aprone, with only required DEP procedure, t/o and before ARR first waypoint (MEBAN) set my RNAV ARR procedure with RNAV app rwy25. After half arr procedure to IAF simulated deleted arr and app data from FPL :smiley: Very quickly add again arr from PROC, set also RNAV app and after last ARR activate app. Perfect flight to full parking, also generic ground marshaler wait me (I must carefuly looking with taxi lines where he stay heh) and show me all what I need to do :slight_smile: Stop engines and that’s all. Perfect!

1 Like
15

Definitely a bug, has happened to me every time ATC gives me an approach, I have to fly by heading to avoid the turnaround and activate the approach when reaching the approach first waypoint.

2 Likes
16

Yes this works as well. The bug is when you wait and have ATC give you an approach. Loading either from the flight planning screen or before your first waypoint is reached it will work fine because you are choosing prior to arrival but if you load an approach after your first waypoint or when the ATC assigns you one the AP will send you back to your last waypoint.
The key here is waiting for ATC to assign you an approach then try to load and activate it.

1 Like
17

Yes, you guys have pegged what I was talking about. Glad it’s not just me.

2 Likes
18

Exactly same issues for me and my brother. This needs fixing.

19

Hello,

understand all but as I said somewhere else, I don’t use generic ATC for not reliable and not realistic. If you’ll fly maybe on Vatsim (as real we say) then all is in your hands and due ATC you need also change all what you have there completelly, this is real life, therefore I recommend leave generic ATC and drill, learn to be in problematic.

20

I haven’t had issues getting IFR & ILS approaches to work, but I do it differently than you. I dial in the localizer frequency (from the appropriate ILS Approach chart) into the NAV 1 radio. Whenever I pass the waypoint during the Approach that allows you to pick up the glide slope (has a star symbol or something on the approach plate on the chart), I switch the AP to Approach mode and change the CDI to VOR 1. The AP picks up the glide slope and all I have to do is manage the throttle and flaps. I take over just before touchdown. Practiced today on some night flights and live weather, and had great success with it.

I am new and learning something with every flight, but this seems to work well.

2 Likes