Kodiak vs Piper Arrows for GA and Sight Seeing

what about a cessna sky master? Hi wing push pull twin I’m thinking about getting one.

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The JF Piper Arrow package was my first payware aircraft for MSFS. I bought it upon release mainly because of the praise from Into the Blue Simulations. I was also attracted by the old school look and character of the Arrows. I can safely say that to this date it is my best buy for MSFS and the Turbo Arrow 3 remains my ‘old faithful’.

In terms of character only the Chancellor for Flysimware comes close and gives me a similar experience.

For me there is enough GA complexity in the Arrows to keep you on your toes, while it still offers great low and slow cruising. JF have been great at enhancing and keeping the aircraft up to date as well.

I believe there is a good deal on the Markeplace at the moment for the Arrow package?

Let us know what you end up doing :wink:

The Arrows are also on sale - to be clear JF’s site has a sale right now - directly from JustFlight, which saves both the marketplace hassle & the marketplace fees.

For the purpose of the OP which is sightseeing, then unless you fly them out of their envelope I still think the view is better from a high-wing aircraft:p

The Skymaster is one of Carenado’s better efforts, but it’s still a Carenado effort.

RE twitchy aircraft, I see a load of people mention aircraft I fly with a desktop stick ( admittedly with Hall sensors ) being twitchy when I find them fine, and I use linear stick profiles for everything except the Hawk which I made more sensitive. Is there something about one particular design of yoke?

"The Skymaster is one of Carenado’s better efforts, but it’s still a Carenado effort. "

cant agree more. Got it but sound is terrible besides a few other things, still a nice plane.

But i see myself flying the Arrow muuuuch more than the Kodiak. Its just more fun overall.

Yeah, I don’t actually have the Kodiak - happy with the BN-2s, honestly, they have sufficient engines! seems a bit close to a slightly smaller Caravan, which I’m not fond of at all.

The Kodiak is probably one of the best overall planes in the sim
but something on the arrows / c310r / c414 keep me coming back and the kodiak i fly once/twice a week

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I fly with linear curves, but I do have a fulcrum with 8" movement on the pitch axis.

The devs have said they originally calibrated it for long throw devices assuming people would soften the curves for other devices but because of the complaints are now recalibrating the plane in the next patch.

They have warned that longer throw yokes will now be too soft in pitch but most of us are used to that with most other planes calibrated for notchy combat sticks anyway.

I think it’s the third time you’re writing this after I’ve complained about the sensitivity of the Kodiak.

I get that most sticks and yokes have less throw than a real yoke but the problem with the twitchiness is mostly with the Kodiak. I don’t have this problem with other aircraft.

Well they have promised to patch it. Let us see.

That said, I doubt the patch will change the tendency of the aircraft to nose up, drop a wing and stall out if you take-off with too much throttle and then proceed to exceed the recommended 10 degree pitch on rotate - as that is likely realistic, the aircraft has 750 HP, a big prop and a lot of elevator authority.

The solution to that one is take-off with correct torque by the book, not maximum, ease back on the stick and let speed build before climbing.

However it hopefully will make it a lot easier to stay under that 10 degrees limit for people currently having pitch issues who find “easing back on the stick” currently impossible.

Ok, before I read everyone else’s reply, I want to give my answer.

The Kodiak is just overall a better plane. It is faster and flies anywhere. Like, if it is an airport, it can get there, land, and take off. The visibility is amazing. If you don’t mind a glass cockpit, it is a no brainer. For sightseeing? It is the one I have chosen to take around the globe. Thailand right now, about halfway there.

Now, there are two, two engine craft that I feel are superior to the Kodiak for almost anyone looking for a plane. The MilViz Cessna 310 and the Flysimware Cessna 414. The MilViz 310 has some amazing extra features. The Flysimware 414 is an amazing plane that competes with the Kodiak’s flight envelope. In this case I prefers the 310, but it is quite close.

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I agree and I LOVE the Kodiak.

It’s a ridiculously powerful engine on a weird frame. It is kinda why I love it. Gives it maneuverability and easy access to short, tricky airstrips. But it is like a race car. Too much power and the handling is not easy.

Took me a while before I stopped feeling relief when I switched the AP on!

But to me, that keeps it unique. It is NOT a 172.

Both are good planes, but neither are best for sightseeing. Choose an aircraft with better visibility.
There are a few stock ones like that included, no need to spend money. Just test them out with an eye to which have the best cockpit views for sightseeing visibility. High wing vs low wing vs cockpit canopy design.

Kodiak also has a bunch of flight model issues at the moment (still), which they look like they have fixed with a FM overhaul, but they are not going to release it until after SU10 release late August.

Instead of the Kodiak use the stock C208B with Cessna 208B Grand Caravan EX Improvement Mod » Microsoft Flight Simulator

By actually testing a variety of planes you’ll discover your own preference for sightseeing vs cockpit visibility issues, rather than take people’s advice (even mine) that might not actually suit your style.
Choose a location you know has some interesting things to see and test all the planes there to compare.

There’s also a variety of freeware light GA aircraft on General Aviation for Microsoft Flight Simulator | Flightsim.to with great visibility.

Other payware options with great visibility include:
. LongEZ
. VelocityXL
. Fox2
. Socata TB-30

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In terms of visibility the Pipistrel Virus that comes with Premium Deluxe is excellent and a gem to fly with auto-mixture a CSU and even an air brake.

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SWS Vans RV-14 is hard to beat for sightseeing. Fast, very manoeuvrable, superb visibility. Much more polished than the Pipers.

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When sight seeing in the Kodiak, dont plan on steep climb rates like in the mountain valleys and such. I dont feel its all that powerful. I personally prefer the TBM 930. It gets me where I need to go fast and slows down enough for sight seeing. Not the best visibility from the cockpit, but thats what other views/ perspectives are for. And the G3000 is awesome. I honestly dont get excited much over my Kodiak. Wish I hadnt bought it.

When I really want to slow down on short sight seeing trips… I love my Kitfox! Great visibility… and you can land wherever.

Maybe the Carenado Pipers… I had high hopes for the RV14 but it just ended up another generic lightweight MSFS GA plane with all the usual problems of feel. The JF planes might have an issue or two & some less clear textures, but hands down better to fly.

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Would disagree in every way but, we all experience MSFS differently which is what makes questions like ‘which is better’ so difficult.

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I own both and i’ll say that it mostly comes down to what you prefer system wise.
The Arrow is steamgauge and a fantastic handflyer. No antiice btw!
The Kodiak is a modern pit, super capable all weather STOL plane that is best flown on AP as it is quite twitchy on regular joysticks and non full pit deflection yokes. Though a workaround is being worked on and ATm she is severely underpwoered, also being fixed next plane update.

For me, i have hundreds of hours in both i the sim, i find the Arrow 3 just handsdown the more enjoyable plane. The piston sounds great, it is just infinitely better to handfly and as a piston likes to fly a but lower.

Be warned though the Turbo Arrows, for me and a few others, does have a very annoying pitch behavior in windy/turbulent conditions that may break your immersion. The regualr Arrow 3 does not have that issue as much. SU10 should help fix that issue however.

When thinking of the bad and complete over-the-top flight dynamics of the Kodiak (every flight is just clenching the Joystick trying to prevent the unavoidable crash, never-ending trimming like crazy, no real flying but only trying to prevent tumbling and spiraling into the ground), I recommend the chilled and easygoing Piper Arrow for sightseeing.

The Piper Arrow has a realistic flight model. and is therefore beautyful and easy to fly. Just like a real GA airplane behaves.

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I don’t have the issues at all with the Kodiak, something doesn’t sound right on your end. Check the sensitivity curves and responsiveness, they sound like they’re set way to high. The kodiak requires a little flight control fine tuning but once you get that sorted out it flies great.