Nemeth Design - Schweizer S300

I just did a short flight with version 1.0.5 (Marketplace), and did not experience the weird 45 degree cyclic issue I had since 1.0.2 or so. Definitely an improvement for me :slight_smile:

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I only encounter the 45deg issue if I leave the trim breaker in. The issue would appear to be still there. I have only ever had v1.0.5 (marketplace) so I can’t compare with older versions. It’s weird because as you suggest it seems like the issue is gone for some of you, but I had the same full bugged(trim) experience (as previously described in this thread) and I’ve only ever had v1.0.5. I just have to disable the trim breaker/reset trim before take off and I have no issues (apart from trying to re-engage the breaker without sprialling out of control when airborne!). I can’t think what triggers the issue for some but not others. It’s a great to fly once airborne though.

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Interesting! I thought the runaway trim (mitigated by pulling the trim breaker) and the 45 degree cyclic were unrelated. But nothing about the S300 should surprise me anymore. I am tired of it and the lack of communication/support from Nemeth. Now that Cowansim has released the R22, I vastly prefer that one in the light trainer category.

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I don’t have that one yet. I need convincing not to buy it. :wink: I think I have something like 25 rotorcraft now. I have a growing problem. lol.
For the sale price the S300 is still a good buy, but yes the historical issues should have been fixed a long time ago.
Same with the Shrike 530 (marketplace) and its tendancy to hot starting.
I guess devs get to some point where sales drop off and think too many resources required/not worth it - next project!

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Unfortunately, I got carried away by yesterday’s sale and bought this little, um, what should you call him - poison dwarf. I should have read this thread beforehand. If you stand in front of the helicopter and look at the movement of the respective control inputs, you will notice that the respective side inputs are not displayed at all - it almost looks as if the helicopter does not react at all to side joystick inputs. The up and down or back and forth inputs of the joystick are clearly visible. Added to this are the completely incomprehensible menus and the hundreds of different joystick input details in the joystick configuration. One wonders whether Asobo even understands what the dozens of strange input assignments actually mean. But I also have to say clearly that the control technology of the helicopter doesn’t really make sense to me at first glance. Maybe Balatu can say something about how the control inputs should affect the rotor. The up and down control causes the rotor to tilt in the longitudinal direction, the left and right control causes the rotor to tilt to the left or right. With this model it is apparently so subtle that it is not noticeable with the joystick… in any case, an animation for left and right is completely missing… All in all, wasted €9.99?

You can try this mod, some like it, some don’t. I liked it myself…

I was just coming into the forum to write what a great flight I just had in this in a canyon run!
If you fly this with the cyclic as is, everything is bad! Very bad! The worst chopper in the game, no question about it!
BUT if you turn what ever controller you have to the right, so the up is 30-40 degrees to the left, it suddenly becomes the BEST helicopter in the game! Its crazy!
It has NON of the crazy cyclic pulls to left/right that the 407 or even my darling the alouette has, just a smooth transition from left to right in the canyon run I did and no strange forces when pulling up or down, looks basically exactly like the behaviour of a real heli in the same canyon I saw a clip of ( hence the reason I found and flew the canyon ).

So just twist the stick a bit and voila!

But even better if nemeth could update this bird so we dont need to learn how to fly in the wrong way, like everybody does in the 407.

The animations are not always tied to the flight model. Turn on the CFD visualization(green lines) to see how the flight model is reacting to control inputs.

yes, in the most basic explanation of how the controls affect the rotor disk, the disk tilts in the direction that you move the cyclic.

There is a lot more going on, the reaction to the swashplate movement occurs at 90° to the input due to gyroscopic precession, but the controls are rigged to compensate.

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So yesterday I played around a bit with the joystick configuration and actually found something. At least with this setting I was able to take off, fly around for half an hour and actually manage to land

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curves are essential for helisimming if you do not have full size 1:1 controls. Also, it’s okay to start off with the assists on to get the hang of how a helicopter flies, and turn them off as you improve.

In the sim, you don’t have the benefit of an instructor sitting next to you, keeping you from making drastic mistakes.

I always switch off all aids in the flight simulator and set everything to full realism. On the 300 here I briefly switched off the crash detection for a while. But then switched on again so that I don’t get too used to the aids.

Just twist the stick/inputs.
Its all that is wrong with it

I don’t really agree. With small cyclic movements the inputs are quite okay. The weird 45 degree effect only happens for larger inputs, at least on my system. That is why I have stopped flying the S300, it is messing with my muscle memory.

I can’t reproduce the 45° degree control effect. The S300 flies really well with my setup. Although it has gotten a little less maneuverable with each of the last 3 updates. The developer has reduced the inertia based on feedback, and it is a little less snappy than it used to be.

I’ve never flown an S300 IRL, so I don’t know if it’s accurate or realistic, but it’s more stable than the R22. Which is what I expect from a 3-blade, fully articulated rotor system.

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I am afraid this 45 degree thing will forever stay a mystery. Some have it, some don’t. For me it has changed between consecutive versions in severity. Initially hardly there with small control inputs, then very bad, back to moderate. But the S300 is the only helicopter where I have this effect. Maybe in the 407 as well, but I never fly that one. Like I said, a mystery … I cannot even really blame the developer, bet it works fine on their system. But I wish they would communicate more to get to the root cause of this issue.

Are you talking about the twist in the cyclic I am talking about?

I dont know if this is new or has been here all versions but it doesnt come and go, its consistent.
But it might be depending on how much input you give of course.

Just started up to take this for a ride and play around with it and see if I can do something else with it to make it fly just as good but without holding the controller twisted.

Started and tried to just slowly fly forward, hardly touching the cyclic, crasched within 60 seconds. Its doesnt do anything even close to what I tell it to.
And I thought I flew with the controller set at Jetplane, and thats why it was hard, but after the second atempt did not go much better, but kept it from crashing, I looked what controller settings I had and it was -75 sensetivity!!
The setting I fly the nervous cowans with.

So gonna change it down even lower and maybe play with some other setting, but like I said, doesnt matter since cyclic is all twisted.

Gonna do quick twisted controller flight to see….
Yep! Now I can take off, flew a lap around the airfield and landed, not very gracefully but it does what you tell it do do if you find what direction is up on the cyclic and all other directions fall into place after that.
But hard to hover since I cant really reach my left antitorque with the controller in my lap, still controllable compared to not twisting the controller.

Well, back to trying settings, wont do any good though

Edit: setup -96 in sense, but can only get of the ground and then it just ends up crasching in a few seconds since the input is to small to counteract the forces and giving more input doesnt make anything better, it never goes in the direction of the cyclic input no matter how small input I give.

I am on xbox cloud and using a xbox 360 controller right now ( that is better then the one controllers) and maybe its just a xbox thingy, but then they need to fix it.
The cyclic cant be used as it should and as its used on all other choppers in the game and all real choppers.
And in this case its not the asobo flight model, as with the 407.

Gonna try a little more…

Tried these settings now after low sense and high sense was both a no go and it really calms everything down!
This chopper is already so slow in its reactions that having low sense its not good, it really flies best with no curve at all on the cyclic, but these settings make it seem flyable, but you still need to push ”northwest” on the cyclic to fly forward and push almost straight up to turn right, but using these settings you can at least sirt of get in to it and drift along, gonna see how this setting is with the cowans!
So its not a fix, but it makes it kind of flyable, but still need to adjust to the twisted cyclic, but if you dont already own this chopper, DONT BUY IT!
With the cyclic like this it really is the worst chopper in the game! No contest!

But if you own it and want to enjoy it, twist the cyclic on what ever controller you use and adjust it so the up is up and you can fly it no matter what controller settings!
It really is nice to fly in canyons and twisty bits with sweeping turns once you get the cyclic figured out.

And there really is a piston and turbine FM in this game, on the turbines they get this ”407” necksnapping turn to the left/right if you push up on cyclic, and it gets worse the more collective you have, but nothing like that on this!

This may be helpful info to the developer, because I don’t believe what you are experiencing is the norm.
With my PFT Puma on PC, this is a really good helicopter.

I am curious, just how many users are experiencing the 45° control offset bug.

I’m wondering why you would think that? How is a controller that’s is 4 generations old, better than a new Xbox series controller? (Xbox series x | s, Xbox One x | s, the original Xbox one, and then the Xbox 360.)
I’m sure the tolerances and specifications for the analog stick in Xbox Series controllers are much tighter than the Xbox 360. I would definitely try a controller from this decade. The original Xbox One was released in 2013. The last of the Xbox 360 elite’s were released in 2007. Your controller is coming up on 20 years old.