Phantom control changes

Discussion Hub General Discussion
1

I have been plagued by this or similar problems for a month now.

I am in the Beechcraft G36 at Soldatna Airfield in AK. I’m on the runway but wanting to taxi to top off fuel.

I check the flaps visually. They are at 10 degrees. I use the keyboard to go flaps up. They go up, then immediately return to 10 degrees. I set them to full flaps. They move to full and immediately return to 10 degrees. I throttle up slightly intending to taxi and the throttle goes all the way to full, even though my controller is only at about 10%. I bring the throttle controller down to 0, but the throttle remains at 100%. I use F1 key to throttle down. It momentarily goes to 0%, then returns to 100%. I use the mouse to pull the visual throttle lever down to 0%. Visually, I see the throttle move to 0% and then move itself back to 100%.

Who is controlling this plane and why won’t it obey my command? This is making it impossible to fly.

I have also had this happen with several other planes, Cessnas and others, sometimes the throttle spontaneously drops from 100% to 0% mid takeoff with disastrous results.

I have completely uninstalled the whole program and reinstalled it with no change. I have no mods. There’s nothing in my community folder.

Thanks

2

What controller are you using to fly the plane?

3

Saitek X52.
But I don’t think it’s the controller since whatever is overriding my commands also overrides mouse and keyboard inputs.

4

Ok. Now we’re getting somewhere.

Do you have one of the switches on your throttle set to do flaps? And is it connected to your PC via a USB hub? If you answer YES to both those 2 questions, the simple solution is to connect the throttle directly to a USB port on the computer vs using a hub. This issue of phantom commands is a known issue with both the x52 and x56. I used to have the same problem with my X56, only in my case it was brakes and lights activating automatically.

EDIT: Regardless of whether you have flaps set to it, I would recommend just plugging it directly into your PC and your phantom control problems will disappear.

5

Yeah I now think it must be some issue with keyboard and controller combined. I can’t reproduce and I fly keyboard only.

Strange. I can’t confirm the keyboard flaps issue. I just tested Beechcraft G36, went outside. When I press Control-\ the flaps go back to neutral. When I press Control-] they go downward, I estimate it’s 20 degrees. Second time they go downward 80 degrees or so. When I press Control-[ then flaps go back same steps.. When I press Control-\ then flaps go neutral, in one step. It is shown how it is supposed to work.

Are you sure that also counts for the flaps issue ? Did you test the flaps in flight ? flaps don’t work ? when they behave like you tell us, they only work for a second or so.. you should be able to notice that.. what happens with other aircraft.. and are you sure you have set modern flight model ?

6

Ok, first let me tell you my latest test results.

I unplugged the Saitek controller, left everything else the same, released the parking brake with the mouse, and used F3 to up the throttle. All as expected so far. But then I hit F1 to drop the throttle. It went down to 0%, then back up to 100% on its own. I did the same with the mouse controlling the visual throttle and the same thing happened. The flaps also kept returning themselves to 10 degrees after I reset them.

Now, to respond to your questions. I have no custom settings on the Saitek. I always have controlled the flaps with the F5-F8 keys. Yes, the Saitek is USB, but not through a hub…directly to the computer.

I really appreciate the suggestions, but I don’t think we’ve licked it yet.

7

I thought we had it, because Saitek / Logitech X are known to do exactly what you’re describing. Sorry I couldn’t be of more help.

EDIT: Do you by any chance have your AI copilot enabled to control the plane?

8

Uh…I’ve never intentionally turned on the AI Pilot. Where is that done?

If you put yourself in the same situation…Beechcraft G36 on the runway at Soldatna, and you set to full flaps, do they remain at full flaps, or go back to 10 degrees?

I’m stumped, but don’t know where else to turn for help.

9

You wouldn’t happen to have an X-Box controller plugged in, do you?

10

I found the AI Control. “Control Plane” was and is turned off. No, I don’t own an XBox controller.

11

Yes, I do have it set to “Modern” flight model.

The problem is intermittent and unpredictable. I only recently noticed the flaps thing as I sat on the runway. Usually they seem to work correctly and I can normally land and take off ok. But the throttle problem is the real killer. When it’s happening, I can’t fly at all.

Thanks for trying to help.

12

Well one thing’s for certain @PaulChubbuck , there is some issue on your side ! Maybe it would help to assign other keys to the flaps ? Can’t help further, I’ve only keyboard here.. for me I never noticed issues with flaps and Beechcraft G36 in flight, when using keyboard.. inside or (now) outside.

13

Thanks for the thoughts.

14

Best of luck my dude. I’m completely out of ideas now. Hope you get it sorted out.

15

I cannot seem to find any way to contact MS tech support. Am I right about that?

And…thanks for trying. I’d buy a new controller if I thought that would solve it, but I really don’t think that’s where the clues point.

16

I unplugged my controller and changed to a different keyboard. Same problems still.

17

Is there any MS Tech Support for this product?

18

Keep in mind that just because you have something ‘USB’ plugged into the computer directly does NOT mean it is not conflicting with something else on the same ‘HUB’.

I do not have any issues with Saitek/Logitech myself but would suggest you try a couple different ports. Usually, not always, but usually front ports and back ports should be on different hubs.

I would follow that up by hopping into the control setup and typing “flaps” into the filter on the left side. It will list ALL bindings to anything flap related. Then check “throttle”. The only reasonable explanation for your phantom is either a binding that is causing it or the cat is sitting on your keyboard.

19

Thanks for the suggestions. I have tried using 2 different USB ports directly on the computer (rear), as well as one on the front. No change in symptoms. I’ve banished the cat. No change.

The only bindings are the following, as expected.

Saitek - Flaps
Decrease Flaps
Increase Flaps
Saitek - Throttle
Throttle Axis
Toggle Throttle Reverse Thrust
Keyboard - Flaps
Decrease Flaps
Extend Flaps
Increase Flaps
Retract Flaps
Keyboard - Throttle
Throttle Cut
Decrease Throttle
Increase Throttle
Arm Auto Throttle
Autothrottle Disconnect
Auto Throttle to GA

What is “autothrottle”? I wonder if somehow that got accidentally set to armed?

All of these flap and throttle problems are happening on takeoff. I know auto-pilot is off. Could there be some other automatic takeoff routine running which I don’t know about?

20

Just in case…I set a binding of Alt-d to “autothrottle disconnect”, and executed that first thing in the plane. No difference.

More investigation reveals that whatever is controlling the throttle and flaps (and not accepting my input) lets go of that control about 40 seconds into the takeoff. Then I am (usually) again able to control the plane.

So the sequence is this (at least on the Caravan).

Flaps 20 and it won’t let me change that. I manually release parking brake.
I push throttle to full. Rolling.
After rotating, I move throttle to 0. There is no response.
At 40 seconds after rolling, something moves flaps to 0, then 5 seconds later, back to 20.
After that, it releases control of both flaps and throttle and I can fly normally.

Any ideas?