So much good with MSFS - but so much wrong

There is always a more painful game to try and play :wink:

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It doesn’t get much simpler than trying to run in a vanilla state and seeing if that doesn’t quell CTDs but here we are. :yum:

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By painful I mean time-consuming :wink:

Who says that there’s no memory leak somewhere (like there used to be) and it takes 3hrs to crash. Or the DC area bug when it crashed approaching the area. This all takes hours and hours to figure out without enjoying in fear of a looming crash. Do that with 3 addons and there goes your day. I don’t wanna know how much time was spent by the community doing exactly that. Now, some fellow simmers may have the stamina and will to do that. I don’t. I’ll just switch sims. And then come back every now and then to see if anything changed.

I prefer wasting my time watching cockpit instruments. And then actually land the plane.

Seems 90% of CTDs are caused by add ons.

9% are caused by hardware conflicts.

1% are caused by the sim.

MSFS is quite stable in vanilla state. For MOST users.

And you will not rule out the ONE STEP troubleshoot that would help the community isolate your issues with you and save you time by using group think to quell your issues.

You seem to understand that you should not be mad at Windows for these CTDs because you are running another program within Windows when you get said CTDs… but you seem to refuse to acknowledge the source of the issue is 90% likely to be a third party plugin you are trying to run within the sim. Not with the sim itself.

And folks here like to help… but we can only offer advice. You kinda have to do the fixes yourself for us to continue helping.

Back in your first post you said:

So, many assumed you wanted some suggestions for help.

Then you said you didn’t want help debugging… which makes this feel like it was just a rant.

Anyway, help abounds if you would ever be willing to spend the kind of time you have spent in your thread today by spending similar time following the sound advice people are freely offering you for fixing and debugging your issues within the sim. We all want you flying! And trust me, we have ALL been at our wit’s end with this sim on more than one occcasion! :joy:

It may not be there for you yet. And thankfully you have another sim that is. But a bunch of your complaints are easily fixable if you do what you must do in X-Plane most of the time and make the adjustments to your settings yourself, instead of waiting for Laminar to do it for you… and by understanding how 3rd parties tend to add the most conflicts and crashes. Especially if the add ons are outdated.

Setting up any sim that first time is going to be a slog. There is no shortcut… except maybe playing on Xbox with a controller.

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You have a valid point that I may have contradicted myself, and spent some time here in this thread. I wanted to state my observations as to why I think the Sim is not (yet) a reliable platform, also bc of the other issues I stated. If I find the desire to tackle my issues, I will. Or I’ll wait, maybe even for XP12.

As for the platform: I acknowledge that Windows is arguably less stable than Linux and MacOS. That’s due to the fact that software tends to crash more often then on other OSs (more so back with Win 95,98, ME, XP). I also acknowledge that if there is no single program (or addon for that matter) that causes a crash it is more likely a general reliability issue with the platform as opposed to poor programming of said addon. If it were always with one addon, or one piece of code, or even one programming language, I’d get the point. But it always comes down to addons. And again, In my case today and yesterday I used the KORD from FSDT, the CRJ from AS and Navigraph cycles. That’s it. I don’t suppose that these addons show a pattern to cause crashes or instabilities.

I do however appreciate the vid you posted. Most of the settings are already OK but I’ll check the USB power settings.

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The only advice I can really offer you that I have never given on this forum is this:

Switching sims is ALWAYS painful.

I suggest finding a couple things MSFS does better than X-Plane (like say, VFR) and use the sim to do that stuff. Then you can learn as you play. Keep X-Plane alive for your study level tube liners.

And over time you will learn the new sim and pretty soon you will be able to transfer the more complex planes and forms of flying over to MSFS…

Just in time for X-Plane 12 to be the new sim, full of its own bugs and issues… and a long wait for study level planes to be released.

Besides, I always joke, ā€œIf you want a sim that works 100% of the time, fly TWO sims. Between the two, everything will work! You just will have to do half the things in one sim and half in the other!ā€ :joy:

It is always good to have a foot in TWO sims at a time, because a new one is always coming… and you can drop the oldest sim from your rotation and add the new one.

MSFS is NOT fully mature, but it is maturing, and finally the good add on planes are getting released.

But it will be worth having MSFS in your wheelhouse when X-Plane 12 becomes the immature, buggy sim with tons of potential!

The circle of life! :notes:

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Thats totally BS. I don’t like hearing it anymore either.
Yes, some (few) addons cause errors (not the more than 1300, which I use, funny).

FS is extremely sensitive to high AVX clocks. Even without overclocking. Separating the ring bus and AVX from the core clock can help. Faster memory clocks/timings can also be a cause. I’m not talking about OC here, I’m talking about e.g. 3800MHz ram that run so automatically, let only run at 3600MHz for FS. (That was my main problem stable with 3800 instead of 4000) But ok, the pc norm says 2100/2400. :see_no_evil: :see_no_evil: :see_no_evil: But let’s leave that. Both shows that FS was programmed hard to the limit without any headroom. Therefore, it also crash on the XBox.

Another problem, the servers. Before you test hundreds of addons individually, go into offline mode first… In some cases it says ā€œohh miracle, no CTDā€

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Sounds like you are part of the 9% with hardware conflicts.

Watch your tone, this isn’t a fight forum. Don’t want posts getting flagged.

That I’m going to try. Currently running 3600Mhz on my Ryzen 3.

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I had found and fixed the conflict after 2 hours. (before SU04) Since then I had another 5 defective addons (directly with SU05) and 6 CTDs caused by bad server connection (SU 06/07)

I would pay good money to have less than one CTD per month!

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Try a little underclocking on the CPU and RAM and observe. If you have further CTDs, you can rule out the hardware.

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I just updated…my last rig 9900K/2080 ti is available…CTD free! Good money would be $10,000! :grin:

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That Series X is quite a bargain!

I am jealous of your upgrade.

Oh I forgot a CTD because I plugged my phone into the USB to charge. Yes, USB devices should not be plugged in and unplugged. This completely messes up FS :joy:

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THAT was responsible for at least half of mine! :joy:

Sure felt smart when I figured that one out…

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In the ā€œgood old daysā€ plugging and unplugging anything with the 'puter on was sure disaster…we’ve gotten used to ā€œplug and playā€ these days and most of the time it works…but not always! I don’t do any ā€œplugging and playingā€ while the sim is running.

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As i say, programmed without any headroom

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I am on a laptop so I use a dock. If one thing goes, they all go. Usually because I accidentally pulled a USB cord while moving around the cockpit.

So then I must unplug the whole dock and plug it back in mid flight. Then the pause happens… you know the pause I am talking about… and you know when it pauses like that you have a 50/50 chance of continuing the flight or a CTD. Nothing better than the feeling I get when the game unpauses, and all USB devices are working again!

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Just had a blinding flash of the obvious.

Your CTDs are likely (at least in part) tied to your pedal issues and unplugging and plugging them back in mid flight.

There may also be a conflict with one or more add ons… but I suspect the pedals are causing more than your fair share. As we have been discussing above, unplugging and plugging in USB devices can cause frequent and reproducible CTD.

If we can figure out how to keep them connected (USB power settings are my best guess) you might start having a more, ā€œNormalā€ amount of CTDs! Which for me is like 1 or 2 for every 20 hours of flight… usually at the beginning (before takeoff) or end of a flight (after landing), or while in the menus (so less annoying because no flight is getting cancelled mid way). That seems to be when most add on conflicts cause CTDs. And I stubbornly keep a couple add ons that might cause CTD because they are cool. :sunglasses: