@FlyerOneZero
It seems we are not on the same page when it comes to defining what a software platform is. So, you assume the flight simulator series is successful because it is an open platform, and hence iOS and Android are unsuccessful because they are closed platforms. Please reconsider what you are saying.
A platform should be extendable while providing control. The most beneficial aspect of a platform is the synergy it provides to the stakeholders. (Platform owners, vendors, and users).
Asobo missed a large opportunity, as it seems they did not want to take responsibility for managing MSFS and controlling MSFS as a platform, but rather a game that supports mods. Please explore a large business concept called the platform business model, as only a small percentage of people fully understand that.
My PhD in business is in organizational design models and organizational alignment.
I have stopped using FS2024. I think the premise we were all given was that this was going to be the be all, end all product. This was going to be the ultimate flight simulator and was going to make us go WOW!
Well we did all go WOW! but it was because what we were promised was not what was delivered. What we got, instead was a late ALPHA early BETA software that had problems even getting downloaded.
I fly FS2020 and X-Plane 12 and have NONE of the problems with them compared to FS2024. The control setup is INSANE in FS2024 why they did not make it easier remains a mystery.
I have a very fast 700mb connection to the internet and yet I had problems from the start with FS2024.
Every once in a while I will open FS2024 to see of the problems have been solved but so far have been disappointed.
I fly mostly GA aircraft in VFR and enjoy looking at the scenery in different parts of the world. I have not spent a lot of money on peripherals but I do have some cash involved. My hardware works GREAT with FS2020 and X-Plane 12 BUT it just takes too long to set it up in FS2024.
I would like to see the ācreatorsā address the ongoing problems and make the setup for the hardware easier for someone without a degree in aeronautics and computer programing.
Thanks to the OP for starting this thread.
Letās hope that things will get better and soon.
I used to work for MS, and part of my job was managing the channel partners for 6+ years, and then managing a company partner with Microsoft. So, partners must always say yes as they have no choice, and the principal companyās strategic decisions limit their success. So, PMDG has no choice; staying silent that way is a clear message.
Now, about the architecture. The choices made limit the potential of MSFS 2024. Technically, MSFS is not like Netflix, where you distribute the content on multiple servers and users stream. A true global multi-user must dynamically assign servers based on usersā choices. This makes it more complex. Also, my internet link is 1 Gbps, which is not the case for most users, and I still cannot run the sim. Also, the future is about VR and on-the-go usage. All this means is that the choices for streaming, especially how it is implemented, will not take MSFS that far and are a very high risk. More risk should be accompanied by more careful implementation, which is not done well, obviously, here.
Thanks for sharing your experiences and the years of experience you bring on board. I hope people in Asobo make wise decisions and fix things quickly. I also hope they read those posts and get something from them.
Thanks for sharing your feedback. I guess one day everything would be fine, and I wanted to create a strong wave to deliver a message to Asobo to reevaluate where they stand.
Many organizations may get disconnected from reality and live in their own closed worlds, feeling achievements only during internal meetings, rather than listening to their customers.
That is the most considered and fair assessment of the FS situation I have seen to date. An excellent post.
I am so amazed about this entire saga, I only wish I was looking on chuckling, instead of having spent loads of money to actually be part of the farce.
I truly believe the ongoing problems and failure to act quickly have damaged the franchise beyond repair for a lot of people.
For my use case, 2020 is still excellent. I just hope that 2024 works before they decide to pull the support for 2020. An unthinkable outcome. But it was also unthinkable that one of, if not the most successful software creators of all time - could make such a huge mistake in releasing 2024ā¦ So I wonāt hold my breath.
Even though you brushed off FS2020 lightly as not being the issue here, I beg to differ with your assessment:
I have been using FS2020 since it came out, and over the last 2 years it has matured into a very stable and reliable platform (for me!), including VR. In fact, it is so good now that I have no problem whatsoever to keep using it on a daily basis. FS2024 is on my SSD, ready to become my go-to flight sim once it is ready. But I agree, it is not there yet.
Final thought: I donāt seem to be alone with my positive FS2020 experience. My friends who do flight simming have no problem with FS2020 either, nor the majority of users on this forumā¦
āPlatformā is, frankly, a much-abused term in software. When I talk about a flight simulation platform I mean the base software onto which add-ons and mods can be loaded. If that were locked down so that only add-ons from the marketplace were allowed - and for this to happen all add-on packages would end up being encrypted - that would break existing add-ons such as GSX. Thatās just for starters; what about weather add-ons like Active Sky? What about Chaseplane? As far as I know you cannot distribute anything other than a package via the Marketplace, so anything that needs to run outside the sim as an executable, for example, would no longer be possible.
Right now, anything that connects via SimConnect can control the sim and affect the user experience. Thatās not control. Would you propose removing SimConnect? Or somehow making it require authentication so that Microsoft could turn off the access at will? Thatās control. I donāt regard that as desirable.
Thatās putting words in my mouth that I did not say. I was talking about a flight simulator, not a mobile OS. Yes, iOS and Android are successful as walled gardens; but that depends on what your criteria of success are. Market share, revenue etc - sure. They completely dominate the market (to the exclusion of any competition - usually weād call that a duopoly) and they make a lot of money for Apple and Google. If iOS or Android were completely open - install any app from any source at any time - it would result in a worse experience for the end-user, because there are many rogue actors out there who will plant malware in apps. Plenty of borderline-malware apps still end up in the official app stores anyway.
But a mobile OS is not a flight simulator.
Control == exclusion of those who want to do things the platform owner doesnāt approve of. Thatās not a place I want this sim to go.
My definition of success for a flight sim is whether it enables what its users want across as many use cases as possible. I only ultimately care about MSFS making money in terms of it ensuring that the platform continues to be developed and the servers stay switched on. Microsoftās definition of success for MSFS will doubtless be different.
He has issues with both MSFS 2020 and MSFS 2024 crashing on him.
Both worked fine for me, then one day I did both a BIOS update and NVidia driver update.
There are many users reporting crashes with the latest NVidia drivers with many many applications. Both 2020 and 2024 would crash in random spots for me. It was driving me crazy. I then went and reinstalled all my low level drivers for my motherboard and installed the newest NVidia drivers. I donāt crash in either sim anymore.
So whether this is the original posters issue or not, I canāt tell. He doesnāt seem to even want to consider that the issue may be on his side, and that the sim is now doomed due to bad architecture. Where the issue is I have no idea, but it is conceivable that it could be server or client side.
I largely have to believe that if it was a server issue with both 2020 and 2024, then we would likely see many more complaints on the forums. Like when SU5 was released. If it is a server side issue, it is one that is likely dependent on which server is being used, internet provider, etc. I hope the OP resolves his issues.
I agree - thatās why I decided to stay with 2020 - which Iāve always been happy with, but more than ever since I got my Crystal Light - and return to 2024 when I feel ready for a challenge. I do still update as and when but tbh 2020 is scratching my itch perfectly for now. I sometimes wonder why I bought 2024 when 2020 is still doing so well for me. Still, itāll be there if and when needed.
Im 61 years old. I have diabetes, and an irregular heart condition, and get tired super easy. Going downstairs to put a load in the washer and coming back has me out of breath and my heart beating wildly. World travel is definitely out of my scope.
Hey, welcome to the club! Same age - donāt have diabetes but do have some very unpleasant health issues as well as the dicky ticker and have the same problems.
Without my flight simming Iād have gone dinky-dau years ago!
54 here, but I have the Type 2 and the irregular heart (ectopics and a-fib) so I feel you. Travel is definitely much harder for me than it used to be. Simming is a welcome escape.
Having been using FS2024 since release and participating in every beta, I think with SU2 (beta) things are definitely improving & getting closer to how they perhaps should have been on release day in Nov. Itās sad itās taken 5 months to get to this point instead of being like this on release, but hey ho, itās where it is at.
The main question becomes how do they convince people to move over after that trust was burned.
Myself, Iām enjoying FS2024. Iāve been using it since release and donāt currently have FS2020 installed any more on my system. If Iām honest I was a tad bored with FS2020, and FS2024 has engaged my curiosity towards understanding what the issues are and what bugs are there, as well as enjoying many of the new aircraft and improvements (like the EFB/charts etc). Itās been a journey so far for sure. Looking forward to more updates though.
I do still question how they messed up so bad on some things like the FS2024 marketplace. Not all add ons being compatible and many still arenāt. The marketplace front page in fs2024 doesnāt wow me or indeed convince me to go back and look any more, or convince me to buy things, and thereās the knock. My FS2020 content can only currently be streamed (as of SU2 beta) and I have no way to pre download it. Iāve seen what DRM does switching from FS2020 ā FS2024 and it handcuffs those downloads to one simulator. This again gives me a lack of confidence in MP purchases moving forward.
The MP of course is the goose that laid the golden egg for MS with FS but it took a hit (it having been down/not implemented for 3-4 months post release) and maybe itās been critically wounded in the process. I used to get excited about Thursday updates, seeing what was new and what had been updated. That has gone completely now. In total Iāve probably spent <$30 on add on upgrades and not much else in 7-8 months of simming, sales have passed me by, and Iām sure Iām not the only one. That canāt be good/healthy for the industry, and that is what worries me moving forward with FS2024. It needs to become as trustworthy and predictable a platform as FS2020 was for that spending confidence to come back again (for me anyway).
I stopped using it/playing about 3 weeks ago. I limit my time to 2 hours per day and 3 times in a row it was unusable with bandwidth too low and no chance of VFR flight on missions.
No need to mention other issues because they have all been mentioned before. I followed all suggestions in other threads to try resolve the low bandwidth message but I have no 3rd party installations so nothing helped.
In my opinion, there needs to be an option to download the game, how big could it be? I have 4.5Tb of 5 Tb M.2 drive space and I expect many other gamers have similar so the only way forward in my opinion is being able to download content.
Let developers like simu-masters.com to the marketplace, there are developers that are waiting for yearsā¦ just reject them or let them in, we want more content, those guys at simu masters spent 2.5 years building the perfect yf-23 simulation and are without a platform to sell itā¦ i with my own handās built the top mach studios F-22 model and textures, i renember that when we applied for the marketplace it took us 1 month to get it, and theese guys are waiting almost 1.5 year to get a single replyā¦ they spent thousands of dollars to develop a plane cause they thought that you are reasonable enough to let people with quality content in.
Hey I hear you, Iām also more into exploration than obeying strict flying rules. Have you tried the VR panel for LNM? It allows you to put a Google maps overlay in a little window while you fly, so at least you can tell where you are that way. Every āPOIā that Google maps has, which is just about everything.
And you can listen to local radio stations which can sometimes be very immersive.
Not the same as the bush trip mechanic, but maybe it helps!
Thx for pointing that out, I am doing the exact same thing by using my laptop while on autopilot and listening to local traditional music and having google maps opened reading about POIs enroute.
Is this a 3rd party add-on you are talking about?