When do pilots input STAR approach in FMS?

[Sharpe2603]

Can someone explain how this works?

Is a certain STAR approach programmed into the FMS before the plane leaves the ground or is a certain STAR inserted in FMS once closer to the arrival airport?

Would an IFR flight plan include a STAR subject to change? How/When is all this decided?

[edit] Also asking this question because I can’t select or see a STAR on my Simbrief FP and wondering if that is intentional or maybe I’m doing something wrong? I see a direct line to the arrival airport from the last waypoint and so the track does not line up with the arrival runway.

[chatdorange123]

Usually the flight plan will include a STAR at departure, but it’s subject to change. Unless it’s a really short flight where you’re basically going straight into the STAR, I usually program an expected STAR in to the FMS while enroute, and change it if needed.

[xNate262x]

A flightplan can absolutely include a STAR if any are available. That’s the point of them. These will appear in the IFR clearance and are entered into the FMS before departure. Of course, if this changes en route (if different runways begin being used due to a wind change, for example), controllers will issue an amended clearance, possibly with instructions to proceed direct to a fix along the STAR.

[ShinobiShadow]

Yes, if there’s a STAR available for your destination, it will show up in the SB flightplan. That route would be what is filed and ATC would see your planned/desired route.

Yes, barring any sudden changes you would put it in the FMS before you depart exactly as is shown on the OFP and as filed.

Yes, it is subject to change on the ground or in flight and you may have to switch arrivals if the weather or some other factor demands it. In that case you’d load a different STAR right there on the FMC in flight (which would override the one you already had entered).

This is how it looks on SB: (Taken from a flight I did a few days back)

Or in the SB OFP…

In the example above, MALNR5 is the planned STAR (again, this is the PLANNED STAR, it’s subject to change)

Hopefully this helps

[lkowgli]

You enter it when you get instructions from ATC which one to use (if any, they might just vector you to the ILS).

[ForestalCrown65]

For me it requires a lot of ground training, to be able to program the FMS in flight, in a one pilot cockpit, while still aviating and navigating. It also involves understanding the altered clearance first hand, to look it up and reference it in charts. Even briefing in advance for possible changes, knowing alternative approaches.
I am still not able to really do it especially in VR - it is really hands full, I always hope there are no changes issued to my flight plan.

[ShinobiShadow]

Honestly the more you fly the easier it’ll become.

Preparation and organization are key. After you plan/file the flight, look it over thoroughly and brief it to yourself. Go over every segment of the flight from start to finish (weight and balance, weather, speeds and altitudes, frequencies, airport information / taxi charts, departure constraints, arrival and approach constraints, alternates, missed approach procedures etc.). Make sure you have everything you need ready and accessible before the flight begins. If you get sidetracked or confused and are in a critical stage of flight like climb or descent then you will get overwhelmed. So then dont get sidetracked or confused - be a step AHEAD of the aircraft at all times, have your charts ready, be organized.

It’s smart to rebrief (this goes under preparatation). People forget things, and thats totally normal. In addition to briefing the flight before I hop on the sim, I will also brief critical items in flight BEFORE they happen. This is usually quick (bec one can recall most of the information from the pre-departure briefing).

An example is the descent phase; during cruise, as the aircraft is nearing top of descent, I’ll check destination weather, plug in landing wx and landing perf info into the FMC/MCDU, and I’ll pull out the STAR and the Approach plate. I’ll give them a thorough look over, I will rebrief the descent, and will “put” the charts somewhere visible so that I can reference them. That’s it. That’s all you have to do. You are now prepared for the descent because you were proactive. If you are reactionary and not proactive. Then you will absolutely fall behind the aircraft, and it will drag you along the timetable until you land.

If you are prepared and organized, a flight should feel like less of a struggle and more of a sequence. Less like a sprint, more like a jog. Less like drinking water through a firehose, more like taking small sips. Then at the end you’ll feel satisfied and not like you were just curbstomped.

If you’re having FMS or other aircraft systems troubles, then that goes under preparation. Watch some youtube videos on it and practice it a bit and you’ll manage. It’ll be less of a chore and more of a saving grace. Like other systems, FMS/MCDU gets demystified really quickly if you set aside your worries and just devote some time to proficiency. After some repetition, it wont take much brain power to operate at all. Which then opens the door to being able to operate it on the fly quickly without any trouble at all. Stick with it, you’ll be alright.

I should probably include that I am NOT an airline pilot. I simply try to emulate real world airline workflows as best as I can because that’s what works.

[V1ROTA7E]

At work, we put the STAR in on departure. It’s always subject to change, but it helps with fuel planning. With legs typically being 10+ hours, anything we can plan for on the route usually goes in the box. 90% of the time we’re correct on the arrival and landing runway selection, unless we’re going into China.

[CaptMatto]

Can I add a supplemental question?

I’ve been using Navigraph / SImBrief / Weather apps to get an idea of what to expect en-route and landing and then choosing the best STAR for that; however the sim sometimes throws a curveball and the weather is different causing different runway etc.

What do the rest of you use to make the decision on the most appropriate STAR to use?

[chatdorange123]

Sounds like the RL pilots do it before departure which makes sense.

I’m usually rushing through my startup procedure so I can get in the air ASAP before someone in the house needs me for something, haha.

[V1ROTA7E]

In flight sim, I always try to use the most efficient from where I’m coming from. Dunno if you have quick access to charts, but I’ll just scroll through the STARs until I find one that makes sense. If the weather is VFR and I’m not flying on VATSIM or POSCON, I’ll just do direct to a waypoint that makes sense as long as there is terrain clearance. A lot of STARs have “runway transitions” built in to them. If you select a STAR and the appropriate runway, it’ll automatically select the correct runway transition.

[ForestalCrown65]

haha, I can relate to that.
I do it vice versa … I use every minute in between whatever duties are requested from my family for flight preparation - pretending I am not flying, since I am not under the Reverb … eagerly waiting for the moment I can actually undisturbedly take off … until then the flight is usually well prepared

[PaulG4791]

Ive often wondered the same, is there a way to find out what the runway in use is before you take off in Flightsim, because at the moment even with live weather enabled, sim biref and Fs weather dont seem to be the same?