As I said previously, I have now been offered a refund, although I have promised to at least try their suggestions (which I’m 99.99% sure won’t make a jot of difference).
But being told three refunds for sub-par content is excessive is insulting, and subliminally suggests that the issues are all in my head. Since MM’s EBLG I have made two purchases, both of which function as I would reasonably expect (i.e. they work fine). This whole Xbox memory limitation is becoming a great excuse for MS not to issue refunds but the consumer should not be having to delicately balance their storage space in order to prompt poorly optimised products to half-work. MM’s EBLG might be fine on a top-of-the-range PC but it is a poor product on console — I know it, and they know it. The argument about receiving no other complaints carries little weight because most people will write off the £12.99 rather than make a fuss.
I want to be able to buy from the MP. Being an Xboxer, I have no choice, so I need some sort of buyer protection/support. It’s bad business practice to blame the customer and hang him/her out to dry when you know full well some of the products you’re selling are not compatible as stated.
It is not unreasonable to expect a product to work alongside 60-odd other, similar products that don’t present the same problems.
Early on, I was a big fan of the Marketplace. But quickly, the disadvantages of it quickly began to outweigh the advantages. Since then, I’ve bought my stuff either from the source or a 3rd party seller.
In all honesty, I would much prefer to buy from the Marketplace. The ability to have everything in 1 place with the ability to update and have the latest and greatest at all times without having to have a zillion logins to a bunch of other sites is a HUGE plus and really the only reason to do so.
For me, one of the biggest down side is having airports encrypted so 3rd party tools like Little NavMap, P2A, etc can’t access the airport data. That’s a 100% deal breaker for me.
That’s the current issue when LNM scans the Airport files, and finds the Premium/Delux airport are encoded, so cannot read them .
Not that those airports any longer rate as PREMIUM. They might had done so in the past when MSFS was first released, but now they are pretty sub-standard compared with other major airports in the sim.
This is one of the reasons why I rarely buy in the ingame marketplace.
Maybe a local legend or a famous flyer.
But other stuff?
No way!
To be honest I have absolutely no faith in the marketplace.
If it would be properly implemented, MSobo (or better the MSFS) would know which products you have bought and which of the products have been refunded.
But no!
You can by a product, get it refunded and you have it still functional in the sim.
In theory they need to adhere to local Law and as you correctly pointed out, the UK Law specifically also covers online purchases.
however how are you going to take on MS who will just refer you to a developer who will simply ignore you?
So support the push for a ‘try before you buy’ feature. That would benefit everybody WordWide.
We need to get the rubbish developers out of the MP.
You say correctly that customers will vote with their wallet, alas that is after the horse has bolted.
So trying before we hand over our hard earned cash is the best way.
IF Microsoft is remotely interested in keeping faith with its customers and wants to improve the quality of the content on the MP then they should support this.
isnt it simpler to just be able to try it first and if you dont like it, dont buy. Seems simpler than having to go through the hassle of trying to get your money back from the credit card company after the developer has simply ignored you.
We have had this discussion before of course.
In the UK there is a simple definition of ‘fit for purpose’ that basically means it needs to work and needs to work for a sustained period.
The goods should be fit for the purpose they are supplied for, as well as any specific purpose you made known to the retailer before you agreed to buy the goods.
What I really don’t get about the Marketplace is that they add garbage products all the time, but the really good add-ons can take months to find the marketplace.
The contract is between vendor and buyer, not manufacturer and buyer. As the seller, Microsoft is liable for what it offers in its MP.
Worth also adding that the product must function to a reasonable degree as sold — in other words, they can’t just tell you to wait for a fix from the developer.
To be fair, they have dealt with my complaint professionally and have (apparently) elevated my grievance to the MP team so that the product in question can be further investigated. But that initial “you have too many airports installed” line doesn’t quite wash when the three I’ve bought since Liege work fine.
As I said, UK law has me covered. But I feel for those in other places as I can imagine Microsoft not being as easily pressured into offering a refund if the law doesn’t demand it.
It sure is easy for PC fliers. Just go on youtube and there’s sure to be at least 3 or 4 in depth reviews of all new planes and most all airports. I guess Xboxers aren’t Youtubers for the most part.
Compared to the autogen airports at launch, they were quite a step up. Nowadays, not so much. But it’s less about their look and quality for me and more about their data. I’m not terribly picky about my airports. As long as they look good and at least reasonably realistic, I’m content. I spend most of my time in the air, not on the ground.
The ATC experience is what kills me. Default ATC is trash and I haven’t used that in going on 2 years now. Pilot2ATC can’t navigate me through MP the airports on the ground correctly since the data in those and all MP airports is encrypted. LNM and other 3rd party tools can’t read the airport data so show incorrect data. It just kills the actual experience for me.
It’s unfortunate that they don’t decrypt at least the base nav data for 3rd party airports. If they did that, I would 100% without fault buy all my 3rd party airports from the MP. As it currently stands though, the only thing I’ll buy from the MP is 3rd party planes I want that are MP exclusives. And outside of Carenado planes, those are few and far between.
I’m very picky about what I download from the MP especially given a lot of it is below standard.
Optimisation is also an issue on Xbox where an Airport or livery add on can cause chaos. It can be fixed if the developers update their products but some don’t, which is also not acceptable. If the product was of good quality and stable then I would not mind no further updates, apart from optimization updates for Sim updates.
I mostly have Carenado aircraft, 4simmers liveries (working fine) and some airports from UK2000 and MK Studios including a little gem, by Simultech LFEC Quessant Airport.
I’ve rarely have black screens or CTD but they have happened. Mostly my laggy mouse is a constant issue. I’ve deleted add ons and done a full reinstall and still the same issue. At least I know it’s not the add-ons that are causing the mouse issue as some well-known add-ons such as PMDG give a lot of issues on Xbox, not their fault but still very annoying for a €70 aircraft. I also performed an Xbox reset!
I agree there has to be a certain standard met, I would rather have a basic aircraft that looked and performed well, rather than an expert level that isn’t up to what we expect.
I’m really looking forward to the A340 but I hope its at least Carenado level?
I want to raise a similar issue. I bought Acapulco International Airport by DXR and Cancun International Airport by Macco Simulations on the same day and installed both on the same day and my system crashed. Has anyone had a similar problem with these products and/or designers. I was concerned to find out that there is no QC control by MSFS over products in the Market Place
You’ll ideally need to do some controlled tests to see which one is causing the problems. When you can narrow it down precisely - and have supporting evidence (such as in-game video) - you’ll have a much more solid case.
Whether you have a case at all, however, depends on where in the world you are…
I am not interested in presenting a case (I am a US barrister equivalent) but rather am apprehensive of re-installing these two airports because the system crashed after I initially installed both and is now working perfectly without them. I was simply curious what the group experience is with these two designers as I never heard of them.
