Eye Head Tracking alternative to VR? Absolutely NOT!

I have the absolute opposite experience – VR is constantly kicking me out of immersion with a thousand paper cuts. Nice flat monitor means I can look and move any way I want and never be taken out of my experience! :slight_smile:

Don’t forget that not everyone likes the same things you like.

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I don’t agree those of us with actual cockpits and who like to program and push switches and things VR doesn’t work. Plus personally I don’t like wearing anything on my head. I understand VR for some is the best thing since sliced bread but for me my setup is just more fun. I have a black surround around my pit that just pulls you into the monitors. If you are using head tracking I recommend the Tobii.

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You must have a well behaved cat. If my cat wants scritches theres not much i can do to stop him from leaping up on my lap while on VR. It’s a blessing and a curse…much like cat ownership overall

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well i cant disagree with you more
Ok my issues with VR
cant write down atc instructions or make any kind of notes , cant use actual panels, cant interact with a tablet to look at charts or moving map, cant actually see any controls you’re supposed to be using and weight of a weird thing on your head . the problem with VR is you’re locked into a virtual environment and cant actually interact .Head tracking while not as immersive as such is a nice way to be able to look around and down at controls while remaining in a physical world

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there are some apps to help alleviate the issue that you can’t take notes or look at charts or anything. But honestly. Using your panels in VR just becomes muscle memory and people make simpits centered around VR and the fact you can’t see the button you’re hitting. So they’ll 1 to 1 their simpit so that the button they’re pushing in game is physically being pushed on a real panel in that actual location. It’s really the top tier of simpits but nonethless, it’s all up to the individual as to how much they want to put into it.

Some try it once and never do it again. I play DCS exclusively in VR and learning a plane in VR off a youtube tutorial is not something terribly convenient for me. I’d play MSFS in VR more if there was some decent controller or hand tracking…probably

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Totally agree about the apps/plugins -
For charts - Navigraph is amazing in VR for charts/plates. Same with their moving map.
For writing clearances - all-in-one tablet has a great canvas for writing that works amazing in VR. I have no issue copying clearances using this. Great for jotting down ATIS info, taxi instructions, stuff like that.
For VATSIM - VATSIM Radio is absolutely essential in VR. Allows you to do so many things like seeing which controllers are online, switching frequencies, viewing ATIS (where available), and so much more.

Anyway, point is, there is nothing I can do in pancake mode that I can’t do in VR.

BUT - to each their own! VR isn’t for everyone and that’s cool obviously. Just like 2D isn’t for everyone. Best part about this sim - so many options!!

Cheers!

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Uhm … no. Head tracking doesn’t use 1:1 translation of the head movement. I can perfectly look at my monitor and towards the rear of my aircraft with TrackIR. All it takes is a minute head movement.

Please try to understand the concept of head trackers properly before bashing them. :wink:

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Interesting subject this one. It’s very subjective to personal preference.
I purchased a Reverb G2 last year and I was blown away by the immersion inside the Fenix VR cockpit. Later last year I upgraded to an Aero and this time I was rather underwhelmed by the experience. Why? Well I was expecting a leap forward in technology. But in reality the lenses and clarity were the big difference. The field of view is smaller. I spent years simming with Trackir and I recently upgraded that to Tobii tracker. Having experienced all these I still sim in 2d with the tobii now… VR has such a long way to go before it becomes an everyday day simming experience for me… there’s also not enough compute power to push that many pixels at a good frame rate without serious compromise

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Of course it’s not. Everyone who claims otherwise never tried VR or was paid by Tobii. The main purpose of VR is being inside the game, not controlling the camera. If I wanted to control camera, I’d keep my old TrackIR.

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I think sometimes I’d rather have a glossy photo of a car, then sit in a car with a foggy welding mask on my head. The sensation of depth and being in the image is neat, but not particularly useful, and so in the end it comes down to what kind of flying you’re doing.

Returned my Reverb G2 for TrackIR. Would love to try VR again someday, but I’m waiting for a major overhaul in the hardware and software. Maybe for backcountry bush flights in FS24 it’ll be awesome. But doing stuff on say PilotEdge with ForeFlight on the ipad going, it’s TrackIR for sure.

I also have intimate knowledge of VR and a Tobii. I ran with a HP G2 for 14 months, until my cable and goggles croaked. I have now been on the Tobii, along with the addition of 2 extra monitors on the sides in MSFS Experimental Mode. I can experience peripheral vision, without even having the Tobii enabled. But once the Tobii is on, I get a huge feeling of the turbulence, that I only used to feel in VR. I can move my head up/down/left/right, and change the views in the cockpit. I get the feeling of staying fixated on the runway, while the plane seems to move and gyrate around me. And I can eat a sandwich, jot down notes, and see my controllers with my eyes.

Would I go back to VR? Not anytime soon. The G2 only has a 12 mos hard end date warranty, and some have seen failures in as little as a month. Not to mention, my graphics are orders of magnitude better, using 3 x 2k monitors. And monitors “usually” last for years. And the side benefit of NOTHING on my head, except my old guy glasses. And the Tobii is not affected by eyeglasses in any way.

I agree about what others have said about using a single monitor. But I am COMPLETELY satisfied with my current three monitors, and the Tobii enabled, gives me the joy to move my head to peer around pillars, and see what I want, when I want it. CoPilot side instruments? No problem, Lean over.

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Wow! Never expected to get such a huge response to this subject. Obviously my Pico 4 VR detects my head movements 360* horizontal and vertically, and inside the aircraft cockpit my eyes can focus on the instruments or the external views. Despite all the comments about head/eye tracking I just can not see the sense of it using with a monitor, or TV? I suppose it saves using a mouse, keyboard, ect., to change your views. But my point is, if you move head or eyes just 45 degrees from the centre you are not looking at the screen? If you move your head 90 degrees left or right, your are looking at your room walls, up and down, your room ceiling and floor? Can someone just please explain the purpose of head /eye tracking? Very happy with my Pico 4 VR in FS, clear, sharp and good frame rates.

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NO, I am NOT bashing head/eye tracking. Maybe, if I had a demo of it, I would understand it better. It is not cheap, just to try something I may or may not like. All I know is, I am very impressed with my VR Headset.

In order to properly adjust head tracking sensitivity I point my nose at the left or right border of the screen, then I rotate my head until my nose points around 1 inch inside the border, and then I adjust head tracking sensitivity until my point of view in the sim has rotated exactly 180 degrees.

Then I look at the top or bottom border, turn back an inch, and set head tracking until my pov in the sim moves exactly 90 degrees.

This allows me to look directly behind me, above me, or below me. Once that’s dialed in, I adjust the X axis to allow me to stick my head outside of the cockpit easily, while still confining my head in the cockpit of aircraft that don’t have open canopies.

Once this is done, you forget you’re wearing head tracking, it just feels completely natural. But if you don’t properly adjust sensitivity, head tracking is a half ■■■■■ experience.

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It is not 1 to 1 ratio for movement with head tracking. If you want to move your view to 45 degrees in the sim, you would only need to move your head a couple of degrees, easily keeping your eyes on your screen. I have a 30 inch monitor and if I move my head pointing from center to the outside edge of the screen, on screen it does a complete 180. There is a little difference between eye tracking and head tracking but same ratio concept. I prefer head tracking because I can move my eye view easily from screen to keyboard for example and leave my head slightly turned for view control. Great for pattern work.

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By definition it’s an alternative, just like VR is an alternative to looking at a flat screen. It’s viability, or indeed suitability, is subjective.

VR would render all my physical controls useless, so I have not gone down that route, so for me, the Tobii 5 is a very viable alternative to give me a way to look around inside the sim.

I use both. Often most landings, take offs and maneuvers in VR. Then on the long hauls often I switch to my monitor as I lookup charts, read between monitoring my instruments, and VR just clear enough yet for me when it come to those tasks for any long period of time.

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Imagine a future VR headset where you can just flip the displays up out of view like a welding mask.

Some people (myself included) like to add a bit of a dead zone in the middle too. It allows small head movements in order to look at necessary stuff, without having the screen view wing all over the place while you’re doing it. And again, it feels completely natural after a short adjustment period.

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You already have passthrough mode(see the current environment instead of the VR image)… If that’s what you were saying

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