Guys please stay on topic. I don’t want this thread to be closed because of a few people going completely sideways.
There are some interesting posts and maybe more to come.
So please stay on the topic Flightmodel comparison between XP and MSFS
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Sorry I was comparing flight model integrity between the two program’s military jets. There was no hint of sarcasm in my post that you referenced
Edit: I did not flag your post
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I know you didn’t and I understand your point. I guess we’ll just have to wait and see.
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Correct, but most - at least related to actual flying without the need to create or simulate a new, not yet build aircraft.
Also keep in mind that Austins post was from four years ago, pre MSFS official release.
Austin btw revealed one of XPs biggest flaws which actually is Austin himself - he is continuously tweaking everything and leaving 3rd parties behind.
PMDG also just released the DC6 and trashed all other plans, officially because there is not enough business value in the platform from simmers but I also think because it’s hard to keep up with changes made (so maintenance is pretty pricey).
I personally am pretty disappointed by the way XP12 simulates wake turbulence - they basically add some rotating vortex behind the wingtips. On one Q&A Seb previewed the 747-8i way to generate wake turbulence which is done by the CFD simulation in that case automatically. It’s not yet available out of the box but I think it’s the better approach in that aspect.
But as I said before: XP and MSFS cannot be properly compared due to different markets 
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Guys, stay on topic! is it so hard to understand? I don’t want to flag every second post and waste the time of the admins.
Yes I cede your points. Both Asobo and Laminar do genuinely want an authentic flight model.
We’ll only know for sure when MSFS is more mature and XP12 has been out a while.
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Yep, agreed. XPs flight model at heart is as it is since decades, tuned for decades. The MS flight model always was basic from FS98 to FSX with minor tuning.
FSX was only alive that long because devs were able to work around it using C++ code as .DLL files, using FSX just as a visualization program 
It’s been a long journey but the whole flight model was already changed for a better and I’m sure it will get still better. There is so much still not officially announced
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I have no doubt that within its lifetime, the MSFS flight model will surpass XP’s. It’s definitely going to take time. XP is far more mature. Their entire sim has been built around that flight model for decades and it’s been refined significantly. It’s a far more mature product. MSFS is in its infancy as it stands. We’re 2 years into a 10 year product lifecycle. And I have no doubt that there either will be a followup or massive upgrade at the end of that lifecycle to keep us all flying for another decade or more.
I hope so — but sincerely hope that whatever they do, the majority of mods will somehow be compatible. In another 8 years from now I dread to think what I will have spent on extras!
Austin Meyer strikes me as a brash and outspoken individual. Or at least, I’m not surprised when he’s dismissive about MSFS.
Personally, I wish Microsoft would just acquire Laminar Research and take the best of both to make the ultimate flight sim.
Imho that’s a bit over the top from my point of view it will evolve to represent a better platform for actual flight simming in the end without focus on a “flight model” battle. XPs flight model will likely always be superior because it’s intended to simulate new aircraft designs which don’t exist yet.
For this task more things have to be taken into consideration like a properly simulated multi wing stall behavior or the effect of multiple engines with different angles, rotating whole wings and crazy stuff like that. MSFS does not really need to simulate stuff like that all properly because we are talking about b2c and not b2b.
Anyway MS may create a new simulation platform out of MSFS at some point for military or professional training purpose (like ESP was). However right now that’s just guessing on my end and I’d be fine with proper aircraft handling in most situations when it comes to already existing aircraft designs only MS/Asobo knows what the future will bring.
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Man, in my opinion XP11/12 is dead. They are trying so hard to keep their heads above water. You can see that by how they throw jabs at MSFS by stating things like “flight model is not as real”. Yet, this is solely dependent on so many factors such as hardware and 3rd party developers. The only real flight simulator is one that costs millions of dollars.
When I fly the Fenix A320 it feels just as good or even better than XP Tolis or FF.
But MSFS has way better graphics. So to me XP is dead
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Well it is what I would also say if I was Austin Meyer.
Perfectly reasonable to talk the product up same as Jorg does about MSFS.
But as far as realism goes, you are still watching a static screen (mostly) sitting probably on an office type chair.
I mean it is all about your experience in that situation.
Are there many test pilots flying that way? I doubt it but X-Plane always has had
a good reputation when it comes to the flight model.
It is ‘their’ thing. But that isnt the whole Simulator experience.
So in the end it is all very subjective.
I have seen real pilots flying a plane in MSFS saying how surprised they are how well it responses.
Does that mean it is realistic? of course not. Neither Simulator is.
You arent going anywhere.
Personal choice.
You cant compare.
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You can say what you want but there is no denying that Mr Meyer is an expert in his field and he deserves plenty of respect for that.
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I think we can close this thread, a few interesting posts were there, but it’s sadly turning into one off topic after another, they don’t even try. Definitely was the last time I opened a topic like this, sorry for wasting the admins time.
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I totally agree with the quote that MSFS is “a good looking arcade game”.
Unfortunately right now that is just what it is. Either there are major bugs in the core engine or possibly as someone else has said - the developers are not taking full advantage of the available features to them in producing new aircraft for MSFS. This is why I have only bought a couple of payware aircraft since it was launched. I don’t see the point in buying an aircraft knowing it will suffer from the exact same issues as all the others, freeware or payware.
I never got on with Xplane. I desperately tried to like it but the flight modelling in FSX and P3D just seemed more natural. Yes the default aircraft were pretty cr*p but software developers like RealAir Simulations and PMDG showed just how good FSX and P3D could be. It was so good that I even installed P3D in PC’s at our flying school to help new students learn the basics of flight and navigation.
I’ve been a GA pilot and instructor for years and I live to fly. As it stands at the moment I think MSFS is basically just an arcade game with pretty pictures. The scenery is fantastic but they seem to have forgotten about the weather and the core flight modelling. For now. Hopefully things will get better in time.
I’ll certainly try XP12 when it is released - from the publicity it certainly sounds very impressive.
Thanks for starting this thread - it’s an interesting read!
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Thread closed at author’s request.