I hate to break it to you but you aren’t a “simmer” either, as this game is not a simulation of flying a real aircraft. If it was then airlines and flight schools wouldn’t bother spending millions on actual simulators. Enjoy it for what it is, and don’t presume to tell other people what they are and what they aren’t.
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The was not the question in focus.
Is MSFS 2020 being developed with the “person who likes to simulate complex aircraft systems” or the sightseeing XBOX flyer in mind?
2nd Edit: I don’t know why it can’t be both. I have felt they are not as much concentrated on the persons who want to simulate complex aircrafts/systems myself. Hopefully that can change going forward.
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Well… the actual problem is that from my perspective - boots on the ground and trying to start my engines - it’s not moving at all. Or one could even say: it’s moving backwards.
I’m willing to believe you, that they really want. I suspect no developer is happy about breaking stuff. But problems in flight planning, ATC, GPS, the userinterface, the live weather, AI-traffic… they have only worsened, not improved. That’s why I’m losing my patience a bit, after a year with this very pretty Google Earth. Not that there’s an alternative. We’ve all been hooked on the promise…
I really hope for some serious bug fixes a next update, in the core stuff, and not - once more - only some part of the planet painted over.
I am guessing that they have also dumbed down the landing difficulty somehow in FS2020 too.
With all options set to realistic I always manage to land my aircraft in one piece and pretty much on the centre line. In X-Plane 11 it was frequently touch and go whether I walked away after a landing. And yet I don’t really think that my siming skills have improved that much to be honest.
For me it is a lot easy to land an aircraft in FS2020 than it is in X-Plane 11 and I am not sure that FS2020 is as realistic in this respect.
That is a statement for great concern.
It is all relative.
But I had a Check Pilot at a National US Airline once tell me
that he could not believe that a computer “simmer” could
fly and land his simulator like he just witnessed.
Of course, that was his Multi-million dollar Simulator
and it was not a real aircraft.
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No, mastered the landing after fifth or sixth flight at all realistic. It is challenging, even found out you can put it on its noise and not get a crash. I have flown most aircraft and have 186 hrs in 5 months. I still find myself in the cockpit taking off going to airports I have really flown to and how realistic the scenery is
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That is interesting in “realistic”.
You are 100% wrong.
I was going slow, so it has something to do with speed and i was still on the runway, braked really hard
It can be both.
It should be both.
It must be both.
(and both those groups can be on either platform)
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I think it will depend on the amount of data able to upload and what the platform can handle.
Lots of opinion on here as to what’s a sim, a game, the right way to sim or the right way to play. All of it irrelevant. Microsoft and Asobo have their opinion. I’m sure they read the forums and take stuff on board and maybe alter their opinion over time. But at the end of the day, they will do what they want. So the choice for everyone is simple - enjoy it or not. And if not, then maybe you need to look elsewhere.
Something to think about though in the discussion about previous sims having lots of simulation fidelity and much less focus on visuals. If you were starting from scratch today with no previous sims, and could make the visuals that Asobo have done, what would your starting point be? Perhaps all those previous sims focused on the simulation aspects because they had nothing going for them on the visuals…what else was there to focus on? So maybe Asobo are redefining what a simulation is - at least for them. As above, your choice if you like that definition or not.
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A sim for simmers? What is that? It resembles the old study level aircraft discussion, which always makes me laugh, because no airliner is to be flown by a single pilot, yet that it what the core simmers are doing while simming. So how realistic is that…
If what you are saying is true, PMDG would be making a major mistake by going all in on MSFS. The DC6 is an example of what can be achieved with this sim, and more is coming.
Yes, MSFS has its issues, but MS/Asobo have said from the beginning that it will be a journey. Yes, they have broken stuff which leads to frustrations at developers and users, but they are committed to fixing it as well.
Now, I am not a long time simmer, and maybe not a real simmer anyway according to your standards (not sure when you would qualify), but I really don’t understand why if you don’t like this sim, you just spend your time somewhere else.
Bottom line: nobody is requiring anybody to like this sim. If you don’t like it, then PLAY something else. It’s all about having fun in the end!
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Don’t worry about what I am. I am not even real!
simulation - the imitation of the operation of a real-world process or system over time
Flying a CJ4 at 3000ft on 18 mile legs, is a million miles away from what it does in the real world, unless it is some kind of ferry flight. Sorry anybody who has a problem with that, just is not simulating in its definition. The C172 yes, but it is a different plane. The goal is to get close to the name of product.
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This is the oft-repeated view on these forums that I paraphrase as “it’s my sim - and I want it how I want it, and if you want to use it then you’ll have to use it the way I do - properly - none of your larking about here!”
It’s not your sim.
Other people are allowed and welcome to use it too and do whatever they want with it. It is their choice.
It is little wonder the flight sim community has been so niche and had only a handful of sims developed over the years.
MS/Asobo’s vision is a bit grander than that I’m afraid, and you might just have to get used to that.
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I dont care how people use the sim, or what they do with it, but my opinion is that is not simming, and sorry if it upsets, but it just isn’t. I dont have to get used to anything.
ASOBO have defined nothing, all they have done is make Flight more accessible, and this is the result!
Which is of course a terrible thing /s
If you don’t care about how people use the sim, why are you expressing an opinion about it then in a clearly disparaging way? Seems contradictory to me.
The result is great by the way, and many thousands even millions of people are enjoying it. If you don’t that’s totally fine.
As I said above, you have a choice.
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So, don’t use it then! Why being frustrated while there are apparently other sims (games 
) you enjoy more?
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You’re guessing, but I wonder how that would be accomplished. Suppose you’re a developer at Asobo and some marketing guy comes into your office and sais “look, we now release for XBox, all unexperienced users… can’t you make the landing a bit easier ?” I wonder how the developer is going to do that. When ground airflow simulation was introduced in december, users where complaining about the difficulty to get the aircraft touch down on the runway. Now you can change that parameter… they did… but would another change make the landing easier ? I think a lot of beginners fly MSFS with damage assistent on, they would not notice any difference…
I think it is more logical to assume you got more routine, in landing aircraft in MSFS… and now you perceive it as too easy…
This guy allegedly has been able to take off and land safely in a twin-engine plane in MSFS 2020 by using nothing but “careful manipulation of the throttle”:
I used the mouse and setup the throttles and flaps for take off etc and took off, then using careful manipulation of the throttle flew 12 miles away and landed at another airfield with no issue using nothing more than flaps and split throttle…no primary surfaces mapped…first go…wasn’t a smooth landing, very firm but none the less.
Just to be clear for 100%, I took off, and landed first time with just throttles and flap, no other inputs just to be clear, and the runway I went to was not dead ahead either, and first time I ever flew an aircraft like this in my life.
Source: Real World Pilots, please state your feedback about the flight model - #14 by MarkReyno1ds
They dumbed down a lot of things, and the flight model is just one of them. 
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