[All aircraft] Crosswind takeoff/landing physics very flawed since release

They played with wind gusts some more in SU10, but the main source of the 172 crosswind issues are those 2 lines of code.

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To be a bit more on spot they fixed two issues on SU10:

  1. Gust was completely cut as soon as an aircraft sat on its wheels (which was ever since the case in every iteration of Microsofts Flight Simulator!)
  2. The lines mentioned above are there to tune the behavior - if you remove them everything will be FSX again (gusts not affecting behavior on ground)
  3. There are even more lines to control ground behavior like wheel friction. Asobo added these just on the C172 as their testbed to collect feedback and to try it so clearly it needs some tuning

Instead of removing the lines just make lower the values, especially may speed. Go with 100 or 10 maybe and see if it improves the situation for you.

PS: Linking the beta phase thread about gusts and crosswind would make some sense I think, so here it is:
https://forums.flightsimulator.com/t/anyone-tested-if-the-awful-crosswind-physics-is-changed/530363/148?u=delta2k5

Is there a universal flight_model file, or are you referring to the flight model file for each aircraft?

THanks

For each aircraft, though to my knowledge the 172 G1000 variants are the only Asobo aircraft to include the new lines.

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Chiming in late, but yes, the weathervaning effect is overpronounced on tricycle-gear aircraft in the sim. Whereas weathervaning will have quite an effect on a taildragger due to the large surface area behind the main wheel pivot point, a tricycle resists that due to nosewheel friction as well as less surface area behind the mains, which are usually farther aft than those of a tailwheel aircraft. Yes, the weathervaning moment is still there, but should be far less than simulated.

Additionally, as airspeed increases during takeoff roll, the relative wind gets to be more and more on the nose in proportion to the crosswind and the weathervaning effect decreases.

In my RL flying, I’ve never had to use left rudder to maintain centerline with a right crosswind. Ever. I’ve maybe had to use a little less right rudder (and requisite crosswind aileron deflection) and that’s about it.

Now, as you lift off and lose the friction, it will weathervane toward the wind a bit (maybe a degree or two) because going from a crosswind takeoff roll to airborne is in effect, introducing a sideslip - and weathervaning is part and parcel of sideslip dynamics (why do you think an airplane’s nose turns in a bank?). After becoming airborne, it will stabilize (while beginning to drift downwind) as it adjusts to the new relative wind and becomes part of the surrounding airstream, provided you remain coordinated.

But again, the big difference between airborne weathervaning and that incurred on the surface is the friction and pivot points of the aircraft wheels.

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came to find a thread discussing this. the rudder/nosewheel authority on the ground with any sort of crosswind is terrible. i have to twist my stick 75% of the way before it has much of any action, and then it over reacts and pulls really hard. IRL you don’t need that much pedal to keep you on centerline unless you have a massive xwind. the way it is in MSFS right now has me swerving down the runway like a drunk person

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My workaround is to not fly in cross winds higher than 3 knots. So little real time weather for me which reduces the immersion level a lot unfortunately, but I’m tired of the dire fight not to crash every touch down.

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Same for me (in spite of and after the Modern/Legacy workaround procedure for SU11)

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in real live you have a seperate Tiller and Rudder, not on X-Box :slight_smile:

I can’t speak for @SinfulDanTheMan, but much of the recent discussion in this thread concerns C172s. There is no tiller in a C172.

:slight_smile: … no for sure not :slight_smile:

While I agree that the ground handling of light aircraft in MSFS (and the modelling of propeller effects on yaw, and the yaw axis in general) sucks, I do think many here are probably also flying in conditions where you wouldn’t even untie the tiedown straps in real life.

Maximum demonstrated crosswind in a C172 is about 15 knots. Beyond that, while legal to try, you’re on your own. Cessna’s own test pilots only demonstrated the aircraft’s crosswind capability up to that ~15 knot maximum demonstrated crosswind during certification. 15 knots isn’t much.

I am currently doing flight training for my PPL. The process really has driven home to me how succeptible light aircraft are to wind and weather. We cancel more lessons than we fly. It doesn’t take much wind or cloud or precipitation to shut down a C172.

(And before someone says “weenie little students don’t fly when it’s cloudy or windy but manly men do”, check FlightRadar24 over a range of weather conditions and you’ll see how quickly the number of light aircraft flying goes from lots to some to none.)

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Exactly…nothing more to say !! Perfectly explained.
During my PPL it was exactly the same … more on GND then in AIR :slight_smile:

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That’s what live weather is giving us. I noticed winds to be consistently stronger than METAR and crosswind gusts to be wildly exaggerated in intensity and frequency. That makes C172 flying, besides the other things you mentioned, highly unrealistic. And that is a shame because after more than 2 years the product managers haven’t been able to make these core problems a priority.

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I have found this as well, local conditions as in outside my front door always seem exaggerated in the sim. I am aware there is a delay involved but allowing for that things always seem a little off and never calmer than irl.
No doubt LKFJP is also right about flying outside of parameters, but I find it hard to fluke a flyable live weather day.

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did you, or anyone here crying about a unrealistic behavior of small planes, sit in a real small plane ?

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Ahmm…no, i did not say ALL is relistic.
But its a Fact, a small Airplane like a C172, is not easy to control in X-Wind Conditions starting from 10kt and if you have Gusts, which you have most of the Times, it is much more difficult.
Flying a real Aircraft is not like using a X-Box :slight_smile:

Practically every time I land the PMDG 737 - even in very light winds, the aircraft is blown to one side of the runway or the other. I becomes a chore to keep it anywhere near the centerline. It will perform a full autoland and flare and remain on the center line, but if I disconnect the autopilot a few hundred feet before landing, or disconnect it on touchdown, I have to fight very hard to keep the plane near the centerline. Again, this is with very light winds. A 60 ton aircraft should not behave this way. There’s something flawed with the winds on the ground and it’s killing immersion big time, especially after a long flight.

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