has something improved in flight dynamics since the opening of this topic? Becasue i am not a real world pilot andi i dont know if soemthing has improved or not
I donât think it has, with the new CFD model the C172 has actually become worse, stall / spin behavior is now seriously wrong.
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Not a pilot here and I understand that MSFS is for a wide audience and meant to be accessible but I must agree that one of the basic feeling that could be improved is indeed the feeling of inertia vs mass on the 3 axis.
I think the (at least default) aircraft in general feel as if they are assisted by tech that compensates, predict and stabilizes them and make them somehow stable, coordinated and feel lighter than they areâŠ
Twitchy behavior is noticeable sometimes indeedâŠ
I believe that inertia and less stability or less feel of coordination, could improve the behavior of the aircraft and make them feel more like heavy floating masses⊠Except for high tech aircraft that have tech that stabilizes and overrides basic inputs (aka FBW)?
Agree on the lackluster high AOA modelling of the 172 that tends to emulate steep turns and stalls (non accelerated),
As mentioned on another form posting, Iâm wondering if the model tends to represent this as a linear response and not as an inverse exponential.
Get rid off FSX code flight model
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The issue is that the (âmodernâ) flight model is not based on the FSX code 
I wonder if it would be better if it did.
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Hi,
Sorry to resurrect this post. Iâm new to the forum so canât post a new topic, but as Trim is mentioned here, I thought Iâd ask the question here.
My Trim doesnât work as Iâd expect, whether using keyboard, or bound to hotas buttons.
When I press and hold trim up/down, I see an initial microscopic movement on the trim wheel, then a pause, and then a continuous movement. Iâd expect an immediate continuous movement of the trim (and trim wheel) when the button is pressed.
Itâs exactly the same input as youâd see when typing on a keyboard - if you hold down the F key you get F then a pause then FFFFFFF⊠And the trim in MSFS behaves the same. Iâm assuming you guys donât have this issue? Because itâs unusable. The trim wheel should move continuously as soon as you press and hold the input.
Has anyone seen this? And worked out a solution?
Iâm on PC, Iâve got VIRPIL controls. (âŠIâm a CPL, with 30 years flying and 30 years of flight sims - so I understand what should be happening with Trim, I just canât work out whatâs going wrong with the input)
Thanks
Oh yes, trims are a pain here. I am a bit luckier as I can use a physical wheel of my G940 joystick for the elevator trim (trim axis), bit when it comes to electric trims⊠Also, from the first versions, like FS9, FSX , MSFS does not have axes for aileron and rudder trims for the reasons my poor mind is not able to understand. I also do not see a way to adjust fixed trimtabs.
There is one thing that helps me a bit - my G940 is a force feedback joystick and I use a SimFFB utility with it and in this case my trims work without accelerations.
Are you saying that is how trim works in MSFS?
An initial input on button press, then a pause, and then continuous until button release?
This canât be true surely!?!?
off topic question- does SimFFB read variables from the game? Is it any better than XPforce?
It is indeed the case. The only workaround I found is using external applications like SPAD.next or Axis and Ohs etc to bind it. I only found this out a few days ago and now I have linear trim response. However we shouldnt have to go through such workarounds.
I cannot believe that one of the most important control surfaces (I know MS list it as secondary) behaves like this. (watching someone fly irl out of trim and youâll soon realise it is one of the most important control surfaces)
Even PC simulators from 20 years ago got this right. It makes it unusable (for me anyway).
All that effort of graphics, and none on basic flying? (Basic flying being stick, rudder, throttle and trim).
I had assumed I was doing something wrong.
Back to DCS for me thenâŠ.
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It is indeed frustrating that some of the most fundamental basics have not been worked on in these last 3 years. I know there are complex things to work on like weather but things like this are easy fixes, especially since it already works if you bypass the sims controls interface. Inexplicable really.
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I can not compare, I did not try XPforce.
Hereâs a post explaining this
(note that the acceleration got removed, but the âstep/pauseâ is still present)
I believe this is a leftover from FSX. Same thing with all primary flight controls if using keyboard.
No idea if itâll ever be fixed, I ended up building my own arduino/3d-print trim wheel because of thisâŠ
I think this demonstrates a complete lack of understanding of basic and core aircraft systems on the part of MS.
And maybe a lack of input by the community here about such basic errors?
Every other modern flight sim on the market can handle it - DCS, XplaneâŠ
Itâs not a programming issue. Somebody, somewhere has literally said âI donât care if every aircraft works like that, and every other flight sim can model thatâŠ.we are doing it differentlyâ
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They removed it for a short while but with a trim speed to high, making people who were used to trim with single button increments feel it was much to sensitive, complaining enough to have the devs just put the pause/step back like it used to be and called it a day.
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I wonder why every other sim since 1997 has been able to do this without any issue?
feels like MS got a few programmers in a room whoâve never seen a trim wheel irl, and never considered consulting someone whoâs actually used it. They then change it, after a few negative comments by people who have also never seen or used a trim irl.
i presume they think that every other sim on the market has got it wrong but theyâve got it right?
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As far as severity of issues is concerned, isnât this one relatively low on the totem pole though? I mean I can empathize that trim sucks if you donât have trim wheel hardware like on the Honeycomb Bravo, but there are so many other flight model problems that need fixing too and Iâd venture that theyâre bigger problems than wonky trim response to joystick button presses?
It depends what youâre looking for in the sim/game. (Is it a simulator or a game)?
As a CPL with 30ish years flying and 30ish years of flight simulation (from PC to level D commercial simulatorsâŠ.and being a software engineer), I have a good understanding of what a PC sim can/should be doing. importantly, I understand the differences which cannot be modeled accurately (turbulence, force feedback etc).
As an absolute basic, for any simulator - inputs for stick, rudder, throttle, and trim should work.
The trim input is the control input issue which I immediately noticed, and for which there was no obvious workaround, and for me makes it unusable. On a light twin, its the most used button on the aircraft. The most used button on the aircraft is modeled incorrectly.
Other people, who are there for the pretty graphics, and fluffy clouds may not notice the issue.
But Ive noticed the term âstudy levelâ creeping in more and more these daysâŠwhich suggests MSFS is trying to be a sim. But to have such a basic flaw in control input whilst using the term âstudy levelâ is frankly false advertising.
As you say, itâs about priorities, do they spend time making the clouds fluffier? Or do they fix the fundamental and basic control issues?
Clouds, every time, theyre sooooo flooofy!
Study level cloud floof maybe. Study level aircraft, I think not.
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