[ANNOUNCEMENT] FlyingIron F6F-5 Hellcat

I see the Hellcat as almost irresistible, and a couple of you guys have talked me into it! :smiley:

Which is your favorite WWII warbird that is out already? For instance, is one of the Spitfire’s better than the other, etc.

Thanks! :+1:

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As I mentioned in the post to Tom, you guys have talked me into buying a warbird or two!

Which ones that are already out are your favorites? I might not want to wait for the Hellcat…lol

Thanks! :smiley:

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If you want a characterful, challenging and nuanced flight model with a lot to learn and a lot to love (and with amazing sounds) I would highly recommend the Flying Iron Spitfire.

Get it direct from them or an external store (i.e. not the MS market) though, so you will get the machine guns etc.

Landing that thing is so different to any other planes and taking offf has its own complications. Flies beautifully and looks so darn sexy.

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Hi Baracus!

Thanks for the tip. I just checked out the Spitfire on the Flying Iron website, and it looks great. The Spitfire is the sexiest aircraft of WWII!

I also took a look at their P-38, and one of the screenshots shows an autopilot option on a pop-up menu. I see myself doing a lot of ferrying missions if I get a warbird. For barnstorming and short range mayhem, I have no need for an autopilot. But I also spend a lot of time using autopilots in MSFS 2020 when I’m in looky loo mode in external view enjoying the scenery on longer flights. Does the Flying Iron Spitfire also have an autopilot option? I don’t need anything fancy, just heading and altitude hold would do the trick.

Thanks! :smiley:

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Looking forward to this, Flying Iron have established themselves as a top tier dev of classic warbirds. I’m also looking forward to the Fw190 and Bf109 being teased in that blog post.

Fly them. Old warbirds are an absolute blast to fly and I don’t need a mission to enjoy them.

I own the Flying Iron Spitfire Mk IXc and she’s a great plane and sounds wonderful. I don’t own the Aeroplane Heaven Mk1a but from reviews and forum posts it seems a bit more divisive with the sounds being criticised a lot and whilst some love the flight model of it others have pointed out some weirdness with it. Flying Iron’s Spit is a joy to fly and looks and sounds great. If you love Spitfires (and who doesn’t?) then it’s an easy recommendation.

Other warbirds I have: Flying Iron P-38L Lightning is another wonderful plane, looks and sounds great and has a bit more fiddling to do with managing the engine heat which I enjoy. I also really quite like the plane in general as I’m a big fan of these weird twin-boom planes. Highly recommended.

Big Radials P-40B Tomahawk is also quite fabulous. Not quite as good as the Flying Iron efforts I feel but still really high quality and I love how she flies. Also sounds are really good.

Milviz FG-1D Corsair is another top plane. Graphically not quite up there with the previous planes but still looks and sounds great. Quite a bit of a handful to manage as well and you can end up with your windscreen splattered with oil if you’re not careful. Probably the most detailed when it comes to systems managment.

Aeroplane Heaven F3F-2. Not in the same league as all the prior planes but I still enjoy it. Sounds are pretty weak, graphically it’s alright but not as detailed, no complex engine managment or failures modelled but that aside it’s a unique plane and flies quite nicely. If only they’d improve the oomph of the sounds it’d be quite a decent plane but as of now; unless you’re a fan of the plane or of older more unique birds I’d give it a pass.

There’s also the Aeroplane Heaven P-51 which I don’t own but I’m seriously considering it. From reviews and forum posts it looks and flies great but again the sounds seem to let it down again.

Another one is the Swiss Milsim Morane D-3801, a French WW2 fighter. This plane would be right up my street as one of those more unique planes you don’t usually see modelled in flight sims but unfortunately it looks pretty dated as it seems to be a port of their old FSX version without any significant visual upgrades, like a lot of flat 2d stuff on the cockpit panel. Shame really. Also priced really high for what it is.

Now for even older birds:

Big Radials Nieuport 17: classic WW1 bird. Sounds good and flies quite nicely. Graphically not quite up there with their Tomahawk I feel, well textures are fine but the 3d model seems a tiny bit off to me but I still quite like it. Also you get a hammer you can use to smack seven shades of excrement out of the machine gun. A rotary engine as well which is a bit more unique, you have to use a blipper to rapidly shut off and turn on the engine again to slow down which makes it a bit of a challenge to land decently. I enjoy it quite a lot but probably not for everyone. Big recommend if you’re into WW1 aviation.

Realphysics Dorand: Another WW1 bird, French bomber and recon plane. Haven’t really touched it in ages. Model looks alright, think the dev just bought a 3d model from one of those sites that sell them and slapped a flight model onto it. Flies okay I guess but nothing special. Instruments are a weird mash up of old and new. Aside from the uniqueness of it there’s not much going for it and I wouldn’t recommend it.

Not quite warbirds but warbird adjacent?:

A1R Ryan STA Special: a sports aircraft also used as a trainer by various air forces. Really good looking plane and flies nicely. Sounds are alright but not great. No detailed engine managment required so more of a gentle GA tourer for me. I’m a big fan of the plane but that’s more to do with my fascination with the golden 1920s-30s age of aviation. If you’re also into that era I’d give it my recommendation.

DC Designs Stearman: another light GA sporty plane used as a trainer. It’s an alright plane. Started out a bit rough but the devs have been quite responsive and patched it up into quite a nice plane. Doesn’t look absolutely stunning but it’s good enough for me. Sounds are good. Flies quite nicely and is fun for a bit of barnstorming. Not top tier for me but a solid plane that’s worth the low asking price.

And for something a little bit different:

Wing42 Bleriot XI: Pre-WW1 bird from the pioneering heroic age of flight, first plane to cross the English Channel. Historically a very important plane. Also technically a warbird as it was used by some air forces and saw some use in the early days of WW1 but it was totally outclassed within a short period. This is a very unique plane for the sim and I like it a lot. It’s modelled really nicely and sounds good. The realistic version (it comes in a simplified, realistic and a version with an improved engine) is a real handful to fly and it’ll make you appreciate the skill and bravery of these early aviators. It has a very unique flight model as instead of ailerons it uses wing warping which is animated quite nicely. You’ll do most of your steering with the rudder however. A very challenging bird to fly but once you get it up into the air and figured out how to turn it it’s quite enjoyable in a weird way. Absolutely not for everyone though, it’s slow as sin and struggles to climb, but if you love aviation history and unique planes then this is a great plane. I love it!

So what would I suggest? Well that’s like picking your favourite child, I couldn’t say! I recommend you go with what plane takes your fancy the most. Can’t go wrong with most of them really. Okay my favourite is the P-38 Lightning but don’t let anyone else know. :wink:

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All our MSFS warbirds come with the FlyingIron tablet, which has the same friendly auto pilot included.

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I’ve never used AP on the Spit but a bit of a search seems to suggest there is a hidden one you can enable by editing the CFG file:

It’s not mentioned on any of their sales description - I will try it tonight if that helps?

EDIT: ignore me. The “tablet” answer above, coming from the horses mouth, says it better than I!! :smiley:

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well, this will be day 1 purchase. Flying Iron already proven their quality and hellcat seems great again. And already looking forward for Bf 109 and Fw 190. Keep it up!

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FlyingIron Spit IX, no doubt!

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The real spit doesn’t have autopilot, so you won’t find one in the cockpit here… as it should be! No repurposed switches
HOWEVER the tablet in the spit has a basic AP and it works well, if that tickles your fancy

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Sorry, coming back late to the party. Lots of great suggestions here already. So I’ll stick to just a handful of general observations about things to get used to.

First thing is managing torque, especially on takeoff. These were lightweight airplanes with huge, powerful engines. If you open the throttle, the first thing they want to do is flip over to the left and kill you. The trick is to dial in lots of right rudder, let the throttle in slowly (and not to full power), and then work the stick (start back and right) and the rudders to keep it straight. Takes practice - set up a start on the runway, and then “restart” is your friend. The exact setting will vary but in a single, this is always the general idea.

Second thing is landing - really hard to see over those long noses so a normal rectangular pattern won’t work. Curving approaches are best.

Third thing is they don’t like to slow down. Best (and most fun) way to approach is an overhead break - high speed down the runway, then a high-G turn to downwind to kill speed, gear out immediately, then into that curved approach.

Finally, there’s managing the systems, especially fuel tank selection (read the manual) and cooling. Late-war airplanes automated a lot of this but on earlier ones, there’s workload. Air-cooled engines, like on the Hellcat and the Corsair, mean working with cowl flaps, intercooler, oil coolers. It’s a study.

Exception to a lot of these points is the P-38. Because it’s a twin with counter-rotating props, torque isn’t an issue, And because the pilot sits way up front, there’s no issue with visibility. Finally, it’s got tricycle gear. It was specifically designed to be easier in takeoff and landing. The fuel needs management and the cooling does sometimes if the automatics aren’t doing the job.

Beyond that - the Spitfire Mk IX is the sweetest flyer and has great visibility, but takeoff and landing need practice. Systems are very simple - gravity-feed tanks one on top of the other, so no switching. Cooling is mostly automatic on the Mk IX (vs the Mk I and Mk II)

Haven’t flown the Corsair but by reputation it’s a beast. Similar issues to the Spitfire but more powerful engine and much longer nose, plus air cooling - which is robust in combat but it’s hard work.

Love the Stearman, BTW. Maybe a little tame on landing compared to the original (deliberate design choice by DC and a good one) but it’s nice to catch a break. Lovely sightseeing airplane with great sounds. Think local flights on a summer evening.

Hope all this gives you some stuff to work with.

Welcome aboard and enjoy your flights!

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Good summary here; really good, in fact. I personally own and have flown the FlyingIron Spit, the P-38L and the Miviz Corsair and so the comments made by @AlanA4643 are absolutely spot on. I do have something to add, however.

The Corsair was one I picked up just about 10 days ago and have flown nearly every day, usually exclusively, since then. It has a LOT going on and much of it manual, and if you don’t manage temperatures, you will do more than blow smoke and potentially knock out the engine: you will blow oil all over your windscreen and have to land that way. Unlike the FlyingIron approach, Milviz guys included no way to disable engine failures. Having said that, in some ways it’s easier to takeoff than the Spit, because the plane includes a pretty wide range of both rudder and aileron trim, plus a much more configurable flaps setting and a tail-wheel lock. Normal takeoffs, absent crosswind issues, are 20 degrees flaps, 6 degrees right rudder + 6 degrees of right aileron + locked tailwheel. That combo - to me - makes the Corsair easier to takeoff than the Spit. The P-38L is easiest of all because no torque issues to speak of and tricycle gear. :slight_smile:

Landings are also easiest for me in the P-38L because not only does it have the tricycle gear, it’s got 3 stages of flaps, plus dive brakes (which can be used to kill speed if you are descending too quickly or generally carrying too much energy). I’ve also got the most time in it of the three planes above, so that helps.

The Spit and Corsair are similar in landing technique. I prefer a steeper approach, followed by flare and rollout, trading height for speed, “space shuttle” style. This is much steeper than the usual pattern approach and was used a lot by actual combat pilots coming into short, primitive fields and aircraft carrier arrestor landings. The Corsair manual, in fact, advises pilots “to avoid flat approaches” due to visibility and the tendency to misjudge energy - with 50 degrees flaps and gear down, there’s a crap-ton of drag to fight. The same could be said of the Spit with its barn-door flaps, and the Lightning with full flaps extended.

Now having said all that, I think when the FlyingIron Hellcat is available, I will be much better equipped as a sim-pilot to fly and appreciate it, having flown all of the above previously. Specifically, the Hellcat is equipped with a very similar engine + prop combination as the Corsair, even though they’re by different developers.

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Have the spitfire and the p38 though I’m not enamoured with the p38 sound mix, it doesn’t have enough of that prop drone you expect and the engine can sound a little tractor like at certain rpms with a noticeable sound loop. Hope they look to improve this at some point.

The spitfire on the other hand sounds absolutely gorgeous.

One thing I hope they step up on is the representation of the prop discs. These birds have huge props and so far they just lack depth (one of the p38 ones is actually flat) and presence. They need to be a lot darker wider and more distinct be from the side. The carenado 337 has the right idea though the holy grail would be to approach DCS like effects. Hope the hellcat improves on this.

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Great summary. Another point in favor of the Corsair is its wide landing gear - similar to the Mustang in that respect (and to the Hellcat). The Spitfire tends to teeter on that very narrow gear, much like the Bf 109. A lesson learned in the course of the war was to abandon the narrow-track gear that retracts from the center outboard, and shift to wide-track gear that retracts inboard or aft. Gear track plus lockable tailwheel plus all the other features you mentioned seems to make the Corsair (somewhat) easier to manage - at least on the ground.

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The Allison V-1710 in the P-38 actually does sound a little like a tractor. It doesn’t sound at all like a Merlin - it’s quieter and has a characteristic whistle. It’s hard to translate from YouTube videos to the sim (and this is an exterior video) but it’s at least an indication. Not saying the P-38 sounds are perfect but they’re in the ballpark. The P-38 was known to be quiet.

Agree that there’s nothing that sounds as satisfying as a Merlin.

Here are some interior sounds with that whistle.

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I think the muted prop drone is what makes the sound mix feel off, during the flybys the prop drone is very apparent.

In any case the plane just doesn’t sound that nice at cruise power settings and external drone view flybys sound very underwhelming.

My opinion of course, sounds are a very subjective thing.

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Thanks for all this really great information, guys! :+1: :smiley:

My historical favorites from those available (guess there’s no P-47 right now) are the Spitfire and the
P-38. So I think I’ll start with one of those from Flying Iron. Off to watch some YouTube videos to decide on which one to buy first. Or maybe I’ll just get both at the same time for some variety…lol They are very different aircraft.

I really appreciate all the time you guys took in giving me all this information. Just goes to show, some of the best folks in life are aviation enthusiasts!

Cheers!

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This is the right answer. You already know it. :slight_smile:

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Same thing their owners do with them in real life, which is fly them without getting shot down. I’m flying the FlyingIron Spitfire around the world using the same route as the real-life Silver Spitfire.

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Thanks for this! This is a great “something to do” and new sights to see! I had not heard of the Silver Spitfire, but I’ve found their website and their route map! I’ve retraced Amelia Earhart’s failed trip around the world, and some other similar routes, so this is right up my ally!

Cheers!

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