Are you using Developer Mode or made changes in it?
NO
Have you disabled/removed all your mods and addons?
Yes
Brief description of the issue:
Aircraft is Cessna 172. I did a 30-minute flight plan in Garmin 530 and asked ATC for IFR clearance and take-off. I got clearance and a runway for take-off. After the take-off ATC tells me to climb as high as 9,000 feet which is totally unnecessary because there is no mountains in the area. However, I started gaining altitude and at around 7,000 feet ATC tells me to descend to 2,500 feet. I started to descend and at around 3,500 feet ATC tells me to climb to 5,900 feet.
The way around: you can create a flight plan with pre-chosen altitude in Little Navmap and export it into MSFS format. Then load the flight plan in the game and fly. The ATC will work correctly with assigning altitude.
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Detailed steps to reproduce the issue encountered:
Cessna 172. Just use Garmin 530 to create a simple 30-minute flight plan around any airport.
PC specs and/or peripheral set up if relevant:
Build Version # when you first started experiencing this issue:
Sim update 9
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Do you have the same issue if you follow the OPâs steps to reproduce it?
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Actually it is quite random in my experience these bizarre uncoordinated attitude changes. I had it this morning, told to descend to 4000 feet then climb to 15,000 feet a few miles from my destination airport. But this afternoon it was fine and stepped me down from one waypoint to the next for a perfect ILS approach. The point I am trying to make is that it may not be that easy to replicate.
Did you create this flight plan in the World Map? If so, what value did you put in for cruise altitude? How exactly does a flight plan created in LittleNavMap differ?
No, I started without a flight plan. I created a flight plan when being inside the airplane on the ground at parking. I usually create my plans in Little navmap and then load them into sim. Iâve never had any ATC-issues with assigning altitudes when I do flight plans this way.
Yeah, if you created a flight plan in the World Map with a cruise altitude, this would get you the same situation as with Little Nav Map (plus itâs included for no extra charge!)
@SaucierPen464 is correct. I thought the âridiculousâ altitudes you were talking about were the constant fluctuations due to airspace.
If you just mean that your 737 is assigned to fly at 8000 feet, thatâs because you were not using the World Map correctly.
We assume that a flight plan file is generic; that is, all flight plans are the same or at least should be the same. But they are not. Flight plans generated by 3rd party apps such as Navigraph or LNM are different from each other and different from MSFS. MSFS does not provide compatibility of flight plans not generated by MSFS. Nor do 3rd party apps guarantee their flight plans work correctly with MSFS ATC.
One of the problems with MSFS ATC was that it was giving random and unrealistic climb and descend altitudes. Asobo fixed this problem several updates ago inserting waypoint altitude and speed restrictions into the flight plan file generated when using the World Map flight planner. MSFS ATC has been using the altitude and speed restrictions in the MSFS created flight plan for the climb and descend instructions to aircraft.
However, none of the 3rd party flight plan generators include waypoint restrictions in their exported flight plan files. If a 3rd party flight plan is used, then ATC has no waypoint restrictions mostly using the âcruising altitudeâ as the waypoint restriction. This is why ATC issues âclimb to 38,000 ftâ when 10 miles away from the destination airport.
Is MSFS ATC broken because 3rd party flight plans donât contain the information ATC needs? Will MSFS âfixâ their flight planner to work with 3rd party apps? Will 3rd party apps âfixâ their flight plans to work correctly with MSFS ATC?
EDIT: SimBrief download instructions for MSFS âfixâ their flight plans so they work correctly with MSFS ATC.
There are only a few options available:
1. Use a 3rd party flight plan or manually enter the flight plan into the FMS. Use an alternative 3rd part ATC.
2. Use a 3rd party flight plan. Use MSFS ATC. Ignore ATC climb/descend instructions.
3. Use MSFS World Planner flight plans. Use MSFS ATC.
4. Donât use any flight plan. Fly VFR using visual navigation only.
Because several 3rd party aircraft do not use MSFS flight plans, the only ATC alternate is to use a 3rd party flight planner or manually enter flight plans into the FMC and use a 3rd party ATC. Currently there is no ability to âuploadâ flight plans in the FMC to MSFS ATC.
Another issue with MSFS ATC is when it issues a âclimb to 38,000 ftâ to a Cessna 172. This is because the flight plan has a cruising altitude of 38,000 ft. The flight plan file contains no aircraft information. Each flight plan should be checked to make sure the cruising altitude is not higher than the aircraftâs altitude ceiling. Because aircraft info is not in a flight plan, it is possible to fly a 747 using a cruising altitude of 8,000 ft (although not very fuel efficient). ATC will still honor crossing restrictions.
I still have unrealistic ATC calls while loaded a flightplan from simbrief.
10 miles from EHRD and on final i get the call to go to a altitude of 14.000 ft.
About 2 miles further ATC tell me to go to 2000 ft.
Currently manually entered flight plans and altitudes are not sent to ATC. The Garmin G1000Nxi should have this working in SU10. Not sure about other FMSs.
Flight plans created by SimBrief do not contain the waypoint altitude and speed restrictions used by ATC that are part of flight plans created by the MSFS World Map.
I noticed in the SimBrief download instructions a note that says âAfter import, you may need to reselect your SID, STAR, or approach using the provided dropdown menus.â If this is done, then the necessary waypoint restrictions are added to flight plan for ATC instructions.
Try these instructions and see if your SimBrief flight plan works correctly with ATC.
The problem with ATC altitude assigning comes when manually inputting flight plan into Garmin while being in a cockpit.
I think in this case most of the problem is on you. How do you enter the flightplan in the GNS ?? It is missing an altitude component so you only have the routing.
And there MSFS is probably using some MSA data.
You are in that scenario also flying VFR, because I am not sure how you get an IFR clearance this way.
So altitude is PIC discretion (for the most part)
Iâm having the same problem, irc this has always been an issue, flying a Blackbox simulations Islander today from Alderney to Shoreham, I set a IFR plan using the world map, set my cruise altitude at 6000ft, which is a more realistic cruise altitude for the aircraft I was flying. no problem crossing the channel but as soon as I reached my first waypoint, 56 miles from my destination I am instructed to climb to FL180, Iâm in a Islander, duh! it was frustrating hearing please expedite your climb I found if I kept asking for an altitude decrease it wouldnât let me, without first climbing to FL180. Iâm not going to complain as it is probably something I am doing wrong, for a start I havenât removed all my 3rd party stuff, and I prefer VFR flying but its nice to have a change now and then and do IFR, I wonder if there will ever be a ATC that actually works. I suppose the only option for more realistic ATC is to try VATSIM although I find that a bit daunting!
The key is to make sure the plan, once inside the World Map Planner, makes sense from a routing, altitude and mission/aircraft capabilities check.
Most GA planes donât use STARs or SIDs, since altitude/speed restrictions on those legs are jetliner class (too fast, too high). If the plan is showing a SID/STAR, remove it. It may recalculate your route, thatâs expected.
Understand that if you are importing a plan directly into an FMS (i.e., typing it into the MCDU on a jet), that plan may or may not synch with built-in ATC in the sim, and may be dependent upon the currency of the NavData inside the MCDU (which is not a sim defect).
There are many nuances as to why this is all happening, not all are unintended/defective.
Its fairly aggravating when you realize that not only did the ATC from FSX work better than MSFS, but it also never routinely gave such ridiculous and repetative altitude requests but it also never just completely stopped working mid-flight with not even an option to simply do a simple freq change⊠MSFS is broken on so many levels itâd be laughable if they didnt steal $120 from the gullible folks who believed in their âpremiumâ packageâŠ
. quote=âR6point0, post:16, topic:539764â]
but it also never routinely gave such ridiculous and repetative altitude requests but it also never just completely stopped working mid-flight with not even an option to simply do a simple freq change⊠MSFS is broken on so many levels itâd be laughableâŠ
[/quote]
MSFS ATC gives the correct altitudes for flight plans created with the World Map flight planner. It is not âbrokenâ. Flight plans created externally and imported into MSFS do not contain the altitude information needed by ATC. This is causes MSFS ATC to give ridiculous altitude commands. The 3rd party flight creation apps are âbrokenâ, NOT MSFS. It is disappointing this same incorrect information is repeated over and over.
Of course there are many MSFS issues being worked on. Describing âMSFS is broken on so many levels itâd be laughableâŠâ is disrespectful of the men and women who develop and support MSFS.
It is not true that there are not given ridiculous altitudes when a flight plan is made in MSFS World map. I had it several times.
The last short flight from EBBR to EHRD the ATC called me to go to 2000ft because of going into the final approuch to RW 24 at Rotterdam (EHRD) airport.
About 7 or 8 miles before i reached the airport ATC calls me to go to 7500ft and that is ridiculous.
The flight plan i made in the world map was a complete flight plan with Departure/Arrival RWâs and Sids and Stars.
I think as is often the case there are a few statements being mixed up.
stupid and repeated altitude commands are usually issued by ATC to AI pilots. That I believe is solely caused by the AI not using correct barometer settings.
stupid calls for user aircraft such as changing frequency back and forth every few minutes. This usually happens if flying right along a horizontal or vertical ATC control sector. FS9 and FSX did that as well. Knowing what control sectors there are helps dealing with that. For example climb from 3500 to 5500 if the sector fence is at 3500. Change heading by a few degrees to get off the fence if it is a vertical one separating two sectors.
ATC assigned altitudes that make no sense for the type of AC or from the point in the flight. This can happen for example based on the approach you accept or select. ILS-Y to RWY7 may have totally different approach altitudes than ILS-Z to the same runway. So at the point where ATC gives approach clearance at 7000â when choosing one you may get no climb instructions to 10000â on the other one you will. Despite the fact that in both cases the aircraft never flies into an area where it needs 10000â to clear terrain or airspace.
The last two are quite hard for an artificial ATC to get right all the time. A human controller would keep the airplane riding on the fence on his frequency or hand off to the other controller if the workload there was lighter.
For example while flying practice approaches to KCNO ILS26R you theoretically fly through two or three controllers sectors and frequency. But typically if on initial contact you asked for multiple approaches the controllers would keep you on one or the other frequency and only switch you to tower and back. That certainly saved a lot of knob turning and button pushing as well as calls on the wrong frequency
Where MSFS is much worse in my opinion is using published altitudes for guidance even when the aircraft is flying on a low altitude route.
And even worse if you are not following routes but rather simply planned VOR to VOR or worse yet GPS directđ
Iâm not sure what your entire flight plan looks like. I created one that includes ILS RWY 24: EBBR/19 HELE6L HELE4R EHRD/DOFMU.I24-Z. Cruising Altitude is 8,000 ft. ATC gave me step descent instructions from 8,000 to 2,500 to 2,000 for the final approach. If you were 7 to 8 nm from the airport on the approach, you should already have been in contact with the tower and given clearance to land on 24. I have no idea why the tower would be giving you a climb instruction after clearing you to land. There shouldnât be any other communication with the tower until after landing or to go around.
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