Bell 47 out of control!

i bought the Bell 47 heli at takeoff it will raise up and just start going all over the place it does not move around like a regular helicopter it seems to be a very increasing pull going in every direction i had it set to realistic if this is set up after the real thing i dont see how anyone can fly it…the h 135 is easy to fly and the bell 47 sims to act in the normal parameters of a heli on easy settings except for the back and forth rocking. has anyone else been able to fly this bird on realistic???

1 Like

First of all the only thing the Bell has in common with the H135 is it’s a helicopter. The similarities end there.

The Bell takes practice… and getting your controls tweaked is essential. I have a completely different joystick profile set up for the Bell exclusively.

Dont be afraid to start off with it not on realistic mode. I ended up going back to halfway between easy and medium settings for stability and tail but with 100 sensitivity on the Cyclic. I found the less you have to move your stick the easier it is to control. You tend to over correct everything to start with but it soon starts to make sense.

Then i started lowering the stability and tail setting by 5% at a time every few hours of practice. After about 30 hrs in the Bell i’m at realistic settings and feel perfectly comfortable with it.

Forget everything about the H135… its a super modern, super stable, very maneuverable 4 blade machine. The Bell is whole different ballgame.

It’s practice, practice, practice for the Bell. Plenty of left pedal most of the time to keep it in a straight line and almost subconscious micro inputs from the cyclic to keep it flying how you want. Smooth collective inputs to counter the torque from pedal inputs.

Nice and easy on decent always keeping some forward or lateral movement so as to avoid getting into a vortex ring state and plummeting to your death :smiley:

I felt like you the first time i tried it. Thought i’d wasted £25. It was out of control! Dont give up though… learning to fly this has been the most rewarding thing I’ve done in MSFS.

5 Likes

Moved into #third-party-addon-discussion:aircraft

The EC 135 helicopter is a children’s toy helicopter.

The bell 47 helicopter has realistic flight dynamics, a great experience to fly with a helicopter. Use the FlyInside Heli Manager to adjust the sensitivity of the helicopter. Amazing model! Thanks to the developer!

4 Likes

Had very much the same experience, so for now running on easy, and to be honest really enjoying it.

There is nothing ‘wrong’ with it in my opinion.
In fact it has some of the best and realistic sensation physics wise of anything yet in msfs.
Takes patience and time, with minimal movements.
Id reccomend using the easy settings to get started. Id say its highly dependent on rudder pedals as well… which make a world of difference

1 Like

as I wrote in an other threat to fly the goldfishbubble is similar like balacing a wet soap on baloon. That can work only with very little movement.

1 Like

I don’t agree with you at all :thinking::rofl:

2 Likes

Hello There,

So we can understand better, are you a helicopter pilot in the real world?
If yes, are you a private pilot or a commercial pilot?
If yes, on which types do you now, or have you previously had, a rating?
If yes, do you have an instrument rating?

Hi @Stuthemoose

You are absolutely right, the B47 and H135 are very different in the real world. They have different roles and the technology is very far apart.

  • The B47 challenge in FS2020 is learning how to control an unstabilized helicopter.

  • The H135 challenge is learning how to operate a helicopter in difficult roles and missions, including landing on rigs and ships, poor weather, IFR, etc.

If you want to fly the H135 similar to B47, fail all AFCS and you’re back to an unstabilized machine that is a handful in hover and forward flight. It will always be inherently more stable due aircraft design and size, and so you’ll experience the difference a few decades make in aviation.

2 Likes

Hi @Gorilla6938

As suggested, for B47 use easy settings at first then make it progressively more “real”.

With H135 it’s a 180° experience, you start fully real (with stabilization and AFCS), then as you fail AFCS modes and features the helicopter becomes more of a handful to fly, progressively harder. But these are failure modes, so there’s no pressure to go there until you’re ready.

Good luck, have fun.

1 Like

I’ve never flown a helicopter in real life but I’ll share the most important little tip that I’ve learned from simming with them - mainly from learning the MI-8 and UH-1 in DCS.

For me it seems to all be about anticipating the helicopter. The more you fly the more you know what little movements are required when you adjust the collective or start a turn - eventually you do this smoothly without overcompensating and causing the ‘dancing’ and ‘shuffling’ we have all found ourselves doing.

Don’t be disheartened! I am easily frustrated and actually found flying helicopters like this and the UH-1 In DCS a really good lesson in patience.

For now scale down your movements and do everything slower. Do a takeoff like this and remember what the heli does as you slowly increase collective - then restart and do it again, remembering to slide a bit yaw and pitch in. The small and frequent movements required will start to become second nature in no time at all.

Don’t feel like realistic is a bad place to start. If my angry ■■■■-handedness can be tamed by this heli in realistic then anyone can do it. It will take practice and it will feel great when you notice improvement!

2 Likes

My friend tried the FlyInside Bell 47 helicopter. He said realistic, very well managed his flying dynamics. My friend is flying Bell 206, MD 500, EC 135, R 44, MI8 helicopters. Commercial pilot.

1 Like

Hi @hhelikopter4891

OK, it’s clear to me now.

I have flown pilot in command in military and civil aviation Harvard, MB326, Alouette III, Puma, S61, S76, B206B, B206L, King Air, 1900, B747, B748, etc. I have ATPL and ATPL-H with IFR. I’ve flown aeroplanes all over the world. I’ve flown helicopters all over the place and all kinds of missions (including offhsore, search and rescue, etc., etc.).

You don’t really know what you are talking about when you call it “like a child’s toy”.
If you don’t know, maybe better not to insult.
I am sure you’re a decent person, but this makes you look silly.

Helicopters in FS2020 are important for game development, and it’s great that the request for helicopters is second on this list. Microsoft and Asobo are paying attention. The two helicopters available now are both excellent. Let’s celebrate and encourage the effort, rather than saying things that are uninformed.

8 Likes

acyually i have flown 80 percent of all helicopters xplane has …i can say i have spent hundreds of hours flying those birds they all have different characteristics from the r44 to the big sikorsky i understand the physics of a helicopter . for a simple helicopter this heli really feels and acts wierd. but i will play with it and see what happens…

correct
this was the first helicopter lapd had in los angeles it is in our museum

are you saying that if you put all controls to realistic this is how the real helicopter would fly???

You should tune the controls in the Heli manager to fit your controller setup and preferences.
If you don’t have a extended cyclic controller setting it to full realistic might be a bit too much.
I can fly the Bell 47 very nicely without problems with a normal joystick with the governor on, as i don’t have a collective controller (what is not completely realistic as the Bell originally has no governor)
Of course it takes quite a bit of practice at first. but when you get the hang of it it’s very rewarding. :slight_smile:

Make sure your joystick input and corrections are very minimal as a lot of input makes it go all over the place.

It can get out of control too if you fly too fast (retreating-blade stall) or when you decent too fast (vortex ring state)
I don’t think these states are modelled on the H135 but on the Bell 47 they are.

If you have more questions I’m sure the guys at Flyinside are glad to help you at their forum: https://forum.flyinside-helis.com/

1 Like

I bought this helicopter right after it released, went straight to realistic settings, and took me more than 2 weeks just to somehow passably fly it. Almost a month in, it’s still a roll of the dice whether I can hover or not.

That being said, it’s been the most immersive feeling I’ve had in the sim so far. I’m new to helicopters and had no interest in them whatsover before I tried the H135 and B47, but now my eyes have been opened.

Each and every second of flying the Bell 47 is a joy thanks to its innate instability. I guess one can compare it to riding a bull and trying to control it at each turn.

The H135 is so much more stable in comparison, and almost feels like a fixed-wing plane in some cases, but I understand that is by design and thanks to technological advancements through the years.

Both are amazing in their own right. Looking forward to more helicopters in the sim, especially with official support from Microsoft.

It’s the closest we can get to that in MSFS so far.

This is a REALLY old helicopter - the first ever licensed for civilian use in the US- created before even the most basic stabilisation systems start appearing and with only the most basic understanding of how to create stable helicopters - even the earliest R22 has nearly 30 years of design progress behind it.

(The Bell 47 first flies in 1945, the UH-1 in 1959, less than 15 years later, but the progress in that time is astonishing)

2 Likes