My experience is that the base sim AIRAC and airport procedures have more errors than Navigraph. So it really seems like having Navigraph is the best case situation.
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Cool stream by @KipOTG using BATC
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I would imagine as we get closer to release, more YouTubers will be streaming with it, then we can see exactly how the Early Access version is going to work. Iâd also like to see what exactly happens when trying to fly from or to a default airport. At present it sounds like it just wonât work if data is missing or wrong.
I just hope the current version of Maccosim EGCC works as thatâs basically my base airport in the sim. 
Weâll see.
Navigraph subscription is expensive at 81 EUR per year & this is an invest that will have to be done every year by whoever wants to use it.
Just to give a perspective it is like buying Fenix or PMDG 737 every year with a higher price tag. I will like to consider myself a serious simmer and have made a lot of investments on hardware and software but donât have the appetite for Navigraph, specially with the subscription model that is in place.
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I do understand that we all have to make financial decisions and make ends meet, however if you have the means then Navigraph is a serious simmers best friend. I personally couldnât go back to simming without Navigraph.
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Exactly, those are the same people that really need to zip it and go create their own product if they donât like it just a bunch of miserable individuals, as if theyâre forced to purchase it lol 
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Yes. Everyone has their own idea of what âexpensiveâ and âgood valueâ is. For me, Navigraph is part of the cost of doing business for my sim, which also includes a significantly more expensive ForeFlight sub and a bunch of other annual and ongoing costs. Itâs worth it to me because of what it gives me, and Iâm in the fortunate position that those costs are not expensive for me. But Iâm aware that Iâm in a privileged position.
Everyone has to make their own trade-offs and we canât assume that everyone is going to have Navigraph. Basing your product on that assumption would be unwise. I was slightly alarmed to hear Captain say BATC wouldnât use Navigraph, because I had assumed that you could use it to optionally update the nav data like you can with Pilot2ATC, for example, but since he then went on to say that BATC is querying the sim for nav data then if you replace the data source for the sim with Navigraph via the Hub, the effect will be the same, and as long as youâve updated the nav data in 3rd party products that use separate databases to the same AIRAC, everything should align except possibly the actual scenery.
Itâs a good compromise, I think. My bugbear with BATC continues to be going to EA without traffic and whether that will slow down the development of the traffic feature as the dev spends time supporting customers on EA. But I was outvoted and so I just have to accept that 
.
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It never ceases to amaze me how, despite clear information so many people start making and stating opinions that, frankly, are just uninformed and likely to lead to more misunderstandings. But I suppose that is the problem with social media!
Iâve watched all the videos, followed the Discord (which most of the time is totally irrelevant but occasionally entertaining), the latest explanation from Captain being as clear as glass.
Firstly, Navigraph. If you have a subscription it keeps the sim updated along with other addons that use it. If not MS updates the airac every month anyway so why should the data be out of date? But it really doesnât matter because weâre told BATC will use whatever it finds in your version of the sim, up to date or not, so it will be compatible with whatever youâre doing and still work fine!
Scenery. How can anyone expect this small team to be able to cover the mistakes and omissions of other developers who do not include all the necessary info when they release their addons? Captain has made this point very clearly and explained how BATC is going to handle it - okay itâs going to cause a few discrepancies but it looks like there may be a method of reporting and sorting in the pipeline.
Of course, there are millions of MSFS users out there who take no notice of things like announcements or forums, Discord etc. so when it is finally released there are going to be floods of complaints, âoutragedâ users and uninformed slagging off the devs for âbugsâ which are âruiningâ their experience. For heavens sake, the programme isnât even released yet and weâre seeing this exact attitude already! All credit to those Utubers who have produced videos showing BATC in action and trying to make it clear about what to expect. But âthere are none so blind as those who will not seeâ.
As i said when Captain did his poll, by releasing without Traffic IMO heâs going to spend most of his time âansweringâ complaints, bug reports etc so all the other âgoodiesâ are going to be put back even further. Unless he does as another highly respected dev has done and simply shuts down, but he doesnât strike me as that kind of guy.
That ârantâ over, like everyone else Iâm looking forward to release as soon as possible but you wonât hear me complaining if I come across problems that have already been clearly covered.
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Well because itâs only until recently the clear information starts dropping. I was quite reserved about all those juicy features. Even when they stated that everything would be more or less a peace of cake as soon as ground traffic handling has been figured out.
Transparency about the features is great.But even more so when itâs being applied from day 1 or when at least stating WHAT WILL BE possible and what wonât. I think their pitch was far too optimistic and enthusiastic when they decided to do traffic injection
My question is why they even did the poll in the first place. And my GUESS is because they probably knew the outcome and that it would be very much in their favor because they bit off more than they could probably chew. I find it tiring that these days even the most renowned developers seem to have no idea how to interact with their community. Or the fact that, with the best of intentions some of them OVERINTERACT with them.
Do your thing, drop an update every noe and then and donât let the customers influence your work or just ignore their ranting. Thatâs what PMDG does and their planes sell like hot apple pie.
Customers are NOT stakeholders!
Personally Iâll not jump into EA. I am going to wait for VFR which is generally what I fly. Will be good to see how the EA goes for what looks to be a promising product.
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I assume you only need the nav data subscription, not the ultimate subscription, which would be significantly less expensive.
The underlying issue is the stock airport file. If itâs dated compared to either AIRAC because it physically doesnât match the NavData (i.e., 05/23 but the AIRAC represents more recent 04/22), BATC is going to say the maneuver canât be performed - according to the video. Having Navigraph definitely gives you more existing approaches and updated data globally, but if that airport file is out of date, it wonât matter what NavData you have.
Even World Hub Gateway wonât solve this - the unspoken Fight Club rule is any airport changes/updates must match MS provided aerials. If those aerials are old, well, the airport still wonât synch with current AIRAC.
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I watched all the videos but it really isnât clear to me - will Beyond ATC work with default airports? I donât have the money to buy addons left right and centre, so I only own 2 payware airports and I do not subscribe to navigraph. If they are the only ones I can use BATC with, the whole thing is pointless!
Sorry, it wasnât entirely clear to me (and to others), and itâs totally fair for folks to raise honest questions about how the product will work before they buy it. But I agree we shouldnât make strong assumptions on how itâll work if we donât know.
The answer is that the product would likely work on most default airports, but you may run into issues on some default airports where there is missing or incorrect data.
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Indeed. And I donât think that âat the momentâ will change. Because GIGO⊠how could BATC ever work around that? Should BATC guess what the ârightâ data should be? Captain explains this quite well in the âExpectationsâ video.
My native language is not English so I may have misinterpreted something.
In any case I understood this:
- If BATC is compatible with SimBrief it will use the AIRACs that are active with the account used i.e. if you have an active Navigraph account, the ARAICs will be the latest, otherwise they will be out of date.
- If the airport has incorrect or missing data or the runways have changed for Earthâs magnetic NORTH (see LIML from 18-36 to 17-35 a few months ago) BATC cannot correct an existing error. On the other hand, if the airport and the AIRACs have the same level of update, BATC will be able to make you carry out the correct procedures.
- The use of AI allows for answers consistent with the purpose for which BATC was written and cannot make up for the lack of data or meaningless requests as I heard in a video of a beta tester.
Will I buy BATC? Of course, although now Iâm using FSHUD which has improved lately and handles AI traffic quite well.
I canât think of any software that would work (at least properly) if data were missing or wrong.
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OverKillSimulationsâ announcement of early access incomingâŠ
Quote of the day:
âA big shout out to Captain and his team of BeyondATC for announcing that Early Access is on arrival guys. Itâs not quite announced yet, but it will be soon⊠Thatâs all I am allowed to say at the moment⊠but soon is definitely soonâ.
Make of that what you will, but it sounds definitely neat!
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The real problem is the inaccurate data that is in the sim and this should have never happened.
Hopefully it can be fixed by the community through the World Hub.