Fighter/Fast Jet Recommendations

Discussion Hub Aircraft
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I’m looking for a recommendation for a good jet fighter/fast jet.

I’d previously scoffed at using these in civilian sims, because there’s really no way to fully model the avionics of the frontline combat jets… but I recently picked up the Flying Iron BF-109, P-38 and Got Friends F4F to check out the current state of WWII Warbirds. I’ve been extremely impressed with each of them and love the little details they throw in (vibrating instrument needles and other features, great sounds, and unique flight model characteristics for each aircraft).

I’m wondering if there are comparable quality options in the fast jet world. My real world experience has been in T-38s years ago and what I’ve previously seen in MS Flight sim versions hasn’t really replicated the sights and sounds that well.

In DCS videos, that sim does recreate many of those: the airframe buffeting at high angles of attack, especially with jets without leading edge flaps/slats, airflow sound changes during maneuvering, the cockpit sound environment, and more closely approximates the flight envelope of fast jets.

I’m not interested in DCS for this. I’d like to fly in locations not available in DCS, I’d like clickable cockpits, and I’m not super interested in weaponeering and threat systems at this point in my free time sim flying.

The Asobo F/A-18 appears to have challenges during high alpha flight ops and has frustrated me a bit. The Asobo L-39s aren’t amazing quality either.

A developer was offering their payware Typhoon free for a short period a couple years ago. I tried flying it once or twice, but the flight model was rough and I deleted.

There’s now a lot of options out there from teams like IndiaFox, DC Designs, Top Mach, and the like, so I’m not sure where to start. I just know to stay away from MScenery, Deimos, Bredok3D.

Here’s what I’m hoping to find:

  • A fighter/fast jet that puts you in a fighter/fast jet environment similar to what Flying Iron and Got Friends does for a WWII Warbird environment.
  • A collimated HUD/weapon sight
  • A representative flight envelope (won’t fall out of the sky at 200 kts or at AoA the aircraft should be designed for)
  • Airframe buffeting at high AoA, especially for anything not equipped with slats/leading edge flaps.
  • Bonus, if the cockpit sound is like what you’d hear from under a flight helmet/headset instead of a microphone sitting in the cockpit.
  • To me, those are more important than era or type

I’d love for a quality T-38C to come out, but I’ll not hold my breath.

Thanks for any recommendations.

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Freeware Hunter is great for flying in the valleys, and there is the two seater available too. They’re free, so if you don’t like them, you just delete them.

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The Heatblur/IndiaFoxtEcho F-14 A/B Tomcat package recently released is by far the deepest and most-accurately simulated miljet in the sim currently, and I own a good number of those currently available.

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Thanks, downloading!

@DrVenkman3876, great feedback, thank you. I had been eying that one.

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I think you’ll enjoy it. The only limitation in the flight model that I’ve seen (but haven’t run into myself) is that currently a flat spin results in a fixed animation and is unrecoverable in MSFS (unlike in DCS, where it CAN be recovered from if you’re good and if you’re lucky). This is something they hope to improve but MSFS’s aerodynamics model doesn’t fully support supersonic flight, and some aspects of turbulent transonic flight like you’d encounter in a flat spin. But otherwise it’s very good. It also looks good and is a ton of fun, especially if you fly it out of someplace like Sundowner’s Miramar 1980’s (available from Miltech). The F-14 package itself comes with a set of static Forrestal-class carriers stationed around the world too, which is a fun bonus.

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Yeah totally agree. With probably the Just Flight Hawk coming in second place.

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PC User (Owns/Uses all DC/SC/CJ Designs, Iris, IFE, GKS, and MilTech modern military aircraft addons)

As with all the previous replies, the Heatblur F-14 is the most immersive addon for modern U.S. military fighters currently.

NOTE: On YouTube, you will see many reviews of other aircraft addons. When you evaluate their reviews (since you have IRL experience), notice where they comment on the flight characteristics of the addon/aircraft performance. Many times, they comment on how “well” an aircraft handles while they are at transonic or mach speeds. Use those videos to learn about features offered by an addon - not how the flight model is represented in the addon. Although I’m only a casual simmer, flight characteristics near corner velocity, max turn rate, approach/stall speeds, and roll characteristics are more revealing to me about an addon and if I’ll enjoy touring in it: since I’m a sim-pilot and not a real pilot (typically flying at fighting speed and not bugout speed)

You are already aware of the developers to avoid - relative to your stated requirements. Aside from the Heatblur F-14 and Hawk T1A: The DC/SC/CJ Designs, IFE, and Iris products in the modern fighter category provide fantastic “touring” platforms (with some compromises) within the MSFS world.

The thing about DC/SC/CJ Designs is that they provided a fantastic representation of modern fighters for the past 2 years, where there were no other “acceptable” options in MSFS. Their products still provide me with an enjoyable experience, and MSFS wouldn’t have been the same for me the last few years without them.

If you strictly intend to purchase only the “higher” fidelity addons after you try the Heatblur F-14 or Hawk T1A, your next future consideration might be the Blackbird Simulations F-15C and SR-71.

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I’d recommend any jet by DC Design.

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Blackbird - the artist formerly known as Milviz - has a T-38 in development. No word on timing, and their development timelines are quite long. But the FSX/P3D version was very good.

The freeware Hunter has an excellent reputation. I haven’t tried it. But if you’re a fan of Flying Iron (so am I - their Spitfire is my desert island airplane), worth noting that they’ve got a payware Hunter in the works. No release date set but seems possible for this year.

Hope this helps.

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Just the type of info I was hoping to get, thank you! I’ve been interested in that surprise F-111, plus it was made for low-level ingress… but it seems like the IndiaFox/Heatblur F-14 is getting the better recommendations. The clips I’ve seen do look impressive of the F-14.

@AlanA4643, I’d not heard of the Flying Iron Hunter, but if it comes out like their WWII efforts, I’d be really tempted to pick it up!

I’m going to be really happy with the Milviz T-6A when that comes out, along with the Milviz C-130J. If a T-38C ends up coming out too, that would be amazing.

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PC Version

I enjoy the GKS F-111E as it is, but it does have a few items to be refined as of it’s initial release. GKS related that they are going to release updates for both their MiG-21bis and F-111E. I am still hopeful that they can do so in the next few months as mentioned. I have been hoping for a MiG-21bis update for about 2 years now.

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So far, all they’ve shown is a backlit render. I would have expected it to follow their FW 190 but this pre-Christmas message by GotGravel on their Discord seems to suggest it might come first:

I believe everyone here has been a good boy/girl this year. To answer the 190…it will come but not that soon as our focus currently is on two other legendary aircraft: the Hawker Hunter and the one and only B-17G.
Hohoho!!

They should all be worth the wait.

You didn’t mention bombers at all, but worth noting that the Just Flight Avro Vulcan got a wonderful reception. I own it but haven’t had a chance to look at it yet - too busy getting to know the F-14.

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Hey @HerkDvr, looks like you already have some good recommendations. But if I understand what you are asking for, I’d honestly temper your expectations, unfortunately.

I don’t own very many fighters in MSFS, really because of limitations in items that you’ve expressed. I’ve heard good things about the Tomcat, and Heatblur has a great reputation in DCS, so that would certainly be my first choice. Though I don’t own it.

But, just judging by the fact that the Hawk is often considered number two, I say that MSFS still doesn’t do a great job at simulating the “edges” of the flight envelope…high performance jets particularly.

Having about 1000hrs in the T-45A IRL, I find that the Hawk (and fighters in FS in general) have overly strong stability, like you’re pulling a thick rubber band when you pull the stick back. There also isn’t much in the way of buffet at high AOA, wing rock, etc which again is pretty normal for MSFS.

Other fast jets in MSFS have similar tendencies from what I’ve seen, and IMO of course. :thinking:

It’s not that they’re not fun to fly. It’s just that they might not demonstrate the level of fidelity that you were hoping for.

Of course if you find something that you feel really nails it, I’d love to hear about it! :slightly_smiling_face:

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PC Version

@Deacon8tor brings up an extremely important point regarding control.

When flying airliners or GA type addons, your peripheral control axis settings are more forgiving. When you fly “high performance” addons such as fighters or helicopters in MSFS, adjusting your control axis curves are vital to your overall control of the addon - and thus your enjoyment of the addon itself. I find that (with my settings) the control inputs are still too sensitive for fine control (1 mm deflections), so I had to slightly reduce the sensitivity for Pitch, Roll, and Yaw. I don’t think MSFS will ever be as fluid as DCS, so I agree with @Deacon8tor. Flight Dynamics in MSFS are a compromise for all addons. Some, more than others.

To help with a possible baseline comparison within MSFS, here are the peripherals I use to base my opinions with aircraft addon experiences within MSFS (These sensitivity settings are the same for all aircraft/helicopters I use within MSFS):

The above peripherals and curve settings allow me to fly and hold position in a Parade Formation on someone’s wing. If you see me on someone’s Twitch stream, you’ll most likely see me in Parade Formation (about 30-45 degrees off the 3/9 line and about 10 to 50 feet wingtip separation). I know this is totally unrealistic for IRL normal enroute; however, I am able to “get to know an addon” better by flying it in formation on the wing of dissimilar aircraft addons from cruise to approach speeds. It helps me understand exactly how an addon will respond during my overhead break or straight in approach. I’m basically practicing to control the addon for landings the majority of the flight when I’m flying in a group. I really don’t like stalling and crashing an addon at the end of a flight… especially when people might be watching.

I too would be interested in your experiences with the flight dynamics and what you use for your controls and axis settings - that provides the closest simulation of control input in the absence of physical feedback from the aircraft, sounds, and controls.

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Thanks @Deacon8tor! You’ve got quite a bit more T-45 time than I had T-38 time. I’d forgotten about the wing rock during maneuvering. That just brought back some memories from the MOA. I remember the T-38C Flight Training Devices during pilot training did a poor job at simulating maneuvering flight. They were really only good for instrument work, but that was also quite a few years ago. Maybe things got better.

You identify my exact concerns, and mostly why I’ve stayed away from them to this point.

@Kapustick, thanks. That’s normally how my sensitivity curves have looked since I first started with MSFS.

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Ok, thanks for the recommendations all. I picked up the freeware 2-seat Hunter and the Heatblur/IndiaFox F-14.

The Hunter is very good for freeware. I was impressed by the work. Nice texturing and modeling.

The Heatblur F-14 is pretty good quality and brings a lot of nostalgia from when I was a kid and the Tomcat was a top dog. The Heatblur/IndiaFox has good systems depth and is fun to play around with. It does have a bunch of cool features, akin to types of things Got Friends and Flying Iron do to their aircraft… and that was one of the things I was hoping for. Getting an engine flameout during some outside the envelope maneuvering was fun. The Jester AI is pretty cool and I’d like to see something like that in more crew aircraft. The subtle buffeting during high AoA maneuvering is a nice touch.

With that, I think the Asobo F/A-18 and L-39 both have a much better internal soundscape than either of these aircraft (i.e. wind noise during maneuvering and an internal engine sound set more representative of fast jet sounds from the cockpit. I even tried to turn the headphone simulation on for the Hunter and the F-14, but both still have too much external sound coming through. Under both a headset and helmet, inside a pressurized cockpit, engine noises are pretty muffled, yet the aerodynamic noises still came through pretty well. My guess is people want “cool” sounds more than they want “realistic” sounds. Including the loud breathing sounds from the mask would also probably quickly drive people crazy!

@Deacon8tor, with that, I’d have to agree with your assessment. It’s not that they aren’t fun to fly, but they still don’t give a full picture of the fast jet environment.

I can sit someone down and show them a PMDG 737 and say “this is a pretty darn close approximation of what you’d see and hear sitting in the pilot seat”. I still don’t think we’re quite there yet for fast jets in MSFS.

I guess in the combat sims, you have the weaponeering and combat aspects to focus on. In MSFS, you just have the aircraft environment to focus on.

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One thing I’ve wondered about since the begining.

  • Can fighter pilots hear other aircraft/wingmen near them while at flight cruise?

Sometimes while flying a jet addon and forming up (maybe 20 kts closure rate at 1-2 nm) on a GA (C208 at cruise for example) and at “low” power settings, the person (Twitch streamer flying in cockpit view) says “I hear a jet”.

I mean, in external view, I could understand hearing other aircraft. But in the cockpit?

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That’s a multilayered question really.

Jets are loud of course, but so is the thing you’re in. As @HerkDvr noted as well, the jet guy will have a helmet (and frequently ear plugs) which will reduce the sound considerably.

Honestly, the only time that I can ever remember hearing another jet when I was in one, was in close formation and really mostly when crossing under the lead aircraft or in column formation. At that point, you were only feet away from their tailpipe though.

Now, could you hear a jet from the cockpit of a prop? That I don’t know, but I still think that you’d need to be close, ideally with the jet abeam or maybe in front.

Also as @HerkDvr said, it’s kind of hard to separate what you feel in the plane from what you hear and I think that is one of the reasons that sim devs tend to amp up the sounds a bit.

To make up for that. :slightly_smiling_face:

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I agree with @Deacon8tor. The only time I recall hearing another jet while in the T-38 was either on the hammerhead/hold short/on the runway and another jet goes into burner. Then you hear (and feel in your chest) the low rumble sound.

In flight, I only ever recall hearing others when within a few feet from the other burner cans. My only other formation experience was in the Hercules. The only time you heard other planes was when on the ground and doing a formation take-off and you heard (and felt your plane) being buffeted by the propwash of the plane a few feet in front of you. That would quickly die off though as you waited a number of seconds before starting your own take-off roll. In-flight… nothing besides yourself. That includes fighter jets flying off your wingtip.

A few representative examples from the T-38:
T-38C 3K Offensive BFM (youtube.com)
You can see the buffeting, wing rock, and hear the aerodynamic sounds during maneuvering.

A USAF T-38C Talon in a defensive BFM session🤩 Via: @fluxmechanics on… | TikTok
Cockpit view of buffeting. The plane really does seem like it wants to shake itself apart during maneuvering. I’ve got to think that the T-38 was on the high end of the buffeting scale Yes, the HUD and panel would really do that… I really hope the MilViz version is able to model that!

Feel the cockpit shakings and buffets in a T-38 during defensive BFM! … | TikTok
Not quite what your ear would hear as the microphone is in the cockpit and not under the headset, but representative of the environment…

Flying with the Air Force in a T-38C Talon (youtube.com)
Again, everything would be muffled quite a bit from the headset, but a good representation. You can hear the other jets taking while your own plane is at low throttle settings, but once in the air, you really only hear yourself.

Flying in tight Formation with T-38. Cockpit Audio (youtube.com)
People in the sim probably don’t want to be hearing their simulated breathing the entire simulated flight, but mask breathing is loud when you’re on hot mic.

Blue Angels ride looking forward - flying starts at about 11 minutes into it. (youtube.com)
poor microphone in this one, and not as the ear hears it under the headset, but representative of the sound environment. Really the only time you can hear the other jets (even at the stupid close Blue Angels distances) is when they light the burners. Otherwise, you just hear your own sounds and the aerodynamic sounds during heavy maneuvering.

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The DC designs harrier is pretty fun and the dcF4 is super fun :slight_smile:

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