I wish everyone a nice day with this wonderful picture:
Bell 407
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Amazing helicopter is the Bell 222. I trust there is someone who will build the model into the simulator.
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You have bought into the marketing spin as the physics modelling should been a whole of physics model not just GA physics .
Based on your theory then MSFS should not have been released as it was because even the basic flight modelling was very average when it was released and I still see complaints a year down the track.
Why was it ok to release a puss poor fixed wing physics model but rotary wing physics can’t be included until it’s done right ? Give me a break it’s just marketing spin as if Asobo adopted that on MSFS as a whole then the retail version we have now would be called a Beta version !
This forum is full of Asobo apologists and its becoming cult like in people’s responses .
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No they said they are starting them in 2022 which could mean December 2022 which really is 2023. It could be years and many of us bought into MSFS in the basis helicopters were said to be a priority and all the garbage talk about doing it right and how the developers are taking helicopter lessons . Surely they can just hire a programmer that flies as I know 2 programmers that fly helicopters with me here where I live at the ■■■■ end of the world . Pathetic is a word that comes to mind in relation to how Heli simmers have been spoken down to , patronised and now ignored .
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Not trying to patronize or overlook this. Many feel your pain, including myself. Pathetic would be the words used by many if they rush helicopters out the door to soon. We see the reactions and consequences go both ways in this genre. Whatever the justifications for the release dates sit with MS/Asobo… essentially there is nothing we can do other than wait. Hopefully its sooner than later, regardless they are incoming.
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Absolutely agree, the vast majority of us would be very satisfied, waiting for better, of a basic flight model.
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I sort of agree but we can make a difference by keep asking and bringing it to the top of the list .
The problem now I see is that many Heli simmers have given up and our voice is being filtered out as Asobo have quietly put us down by ignoring us helped by the Asobo apologists and the cult that had developed.
Once the apologists find this thread it will be closed .
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Gee it can’t be any worse than P3D V5 flight model but having said that it’s not as bad as it used to be and it’s acceptable ( barely) so it would not be hard for Asobo to have at least made some effort .
I think they have stuffed it so bad we are no just getting the spin doctors telling us what we want to hear .
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2022 is the date of release, not when they are starting.
You have bought into the marketing spin as the physics modelling should been a whole of physics model not just GA physics .
No, I have bought the idea of this being a new sim in the market and there’s a long path ahead, just like with any other new product of this scale.
Why was it ok to release a puss poor fixed wing physics model but rotary wing physics can’t be included until it’s done right ?
Exactly because the fixed wing physics need to be fixed first and stabilized. Walk, then run.
The problem now I see is that many Heli simmers have given up and our voice is being filtered out as Asobo have quietly put us down by ignoring us helped by the Asobo apologists and the cult that had developed.
I don’t think people have quit. They just understand that we all need to be patient and wait. I have been trying to inform people of what is going on and the path Microsoft and Asobo are taking, and they seem to understand. While some get frustrated, the majority realizes that there is a lot that has to be done before getting something more complex such as helicopters.
Adding them on top of broken stuff is not good for anyone. Hiring more people wouldn’t help as they would be building something on top of not-so-solid foundations. While it’s getting better with the updates, it still needs some work. But I would say we’re probably getting closer to that stage and I wouldn’t be surprised if something was already happening in the background.
Gee it can’t be any worse than P3D V5 flight model but having said that it’s not as bad as it used to be and it’s acceptable ( barely) so it would not be hard for Asobo to have at least made some effort .
If it’s as bad as P3D, I will definitely not use helicopters. That is exactly the type of flight model we don’t want in the sim. I am more than willing to wait for it to be a good flight model, not the stuff we have in FSX/P3D because in the end, if that’s what we get, I will keep on using other sims for sure, which is what I’m doing right now.
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Sorry everything you wrote is mostly lots of verbose speculation but the fact is simple that Asobo failed to release a helicopter as a priority.
They (Adobo) have spin doctored their statements with zero commitment or detail .
We need people to get the priority up list and I and others don’t care for the patronising statements about being patient .
Why is it ok we have had broken plank flight models since release but helicopters have to be perfect ? Sorry mate this makes no sense as we need to get a helicopter now so we can start the process just like the planks.
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It’s not speculation as I have been in contact with Microsoft and Asobo from the start. What I am talking about is the information they are not only making publicly available but also from conversations I have had with them.
Helicopters were never a priority. They never said that and I don’t know where you got that idea from. What they DID say was that helicopters were in the roadmap but that they needed to take care of other things before getting there because they “want to make them properly” (I am directly quoting them here).
They are not providing us any details because there are no details to provide, or they decided not to say anything before that information becomes meaningful.
Why is it ok we have had broken plank flight models since release, but helicopters have to be perfect ? Sorry mate this makes no sense as we need to get a helicopter now so we can start the process just like the planks.
Because, as a developer, you don’t want to build anything on top of broken code. Helicopters will always have to build on top of some physics and dynamics that are inherited from fixed wing and build upon that. Doing that on top of code that may and WILL change because it needs tweaking is just a nightmare and an awful use of resources.
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I am sorry but you are speculating because you don’t work at Asobo and as far as I am concerned anything you say is hearsay and speculation . I am not saying you are lying but it’s very easy to tell people what they want to hear and let them disseminate fake news or whatever you want to call it. That’s how the spin doctors work . If it’s a fact why don’t they just tell us than letting it be disseminated by hearsay by your good self . Sorry it’s tile 191 in spin doctoring!
I am sorry but I am at complete odds agian with you as to say it’s ok to drag us through alpha and beta testing plank flight and then release a very buggy retail version and say it’s acceptable and then say helicopters have to be done right is simply spin doctoring.
I am not in the cult of Asobo so unlike many people especially developers I won’t be an apologist for them . This forum is littered with self proclaimed developers that seem to think by appeasing Asobo it might help them get their products into the market place . That may be others motivation but it’s not mine .
It’s simply pathetic that after years of having an R22 and Bell 206 in FSX the successor had ignored rotary wing flight .
The attached priority list does not say started it says something less and if they have not started it by now and they want to get it done right 2022 will be 2032.
We need to get Heli simmers on this site to motivate the developers to get cracking but if people like you keep telling us to be patient and in other words be quiet we will have 200
Tube liners in 2000 liveries before we get rotary flight . You are part of the problem and patronising anyone that asks for some rotary wing priority is not helping the Heli simmers .
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Unlike other priorities it does not say started so to me Asobo are not being open as to what is being done if anything other than some developers getting paid to learn how to fly a helicopter !
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That’s your opinion and you’re free to believe whatever you want to believe.
Like I said, all the information I am adding here comes from conversations I had with Microsoft and Asobo. I really don’t need you to believe me. I am trying to help the community by conveying information I have. You’re free to do whatever you want with that information.
Asobo and Microsoft release information as they see fit, just like any other developer does. Very often, things are happening in the background. Just because you don’t know about them, it doesn’t mean they are not there.
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Let me reiterate that I said I don’t think you are lying and I believe you pretty much .
My point is that why are they telling you and not putting it out there ? They are using you to spread the word because if they change their mind they will cut you loose my friend.
Hearsay is a powerful marketing tool get someone else to spread the news as it gives them the option to change their mind . Hearsay is second hand information and allows for speculation and in strict legal terms it’s inadmissible evidence , it does not mean you are lying it just means it’s senior have and no one is accountable which is exactly the way they want it.
Sometimes things are not happening in the background and a no 7 priority means it should be and they should have something to say and if they are not saying anything it’s more than likely they have not started , which agrees with the semantics of the wording they use in the priority lists!
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They are not using me to spread the word. I just happen to be informed because of what I do in the community.
Well maybe ask them why they can’t update the Heli community
What concerns me is all this negative talk will just make all the Heli simmers lose interest .
I know there are a lot of us from DCS but we are thin on the ground here as there is nothing for us is there ?
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I’m sure they will update the community once they can say something meaningful.
Meanwhile, we are updated: we know helicopters are coming out in 2022. Whatever they may or not say at this time becomes irrelevant if they fulfill that goal and deliver us the goods properly.
If you stop and think for a minute you’ll see all the negative talk comes from the community. And all that comes from the speculation you mentioned before (which there’s a lot out there) and sheer frustration.
People are going crazy because Asobo and Microsoft don’t say anything. Well, they did say something. They already said helicopter are coming in 2022 and they say they will work to make them properly.
Not only that, they told us that they are involving people that are relevant to that portion of aviation to help them out, just like they are doing with fixed-wing (which needs fixing, we know that – this is software development and it can be a pain to get stuff working, trust me – I’ve been working in that area for over 20 years).
Look, I understand the frustration. But, very honestly, as much as the community did a great job at getting helicopters on the list, moving it up or down that list won’t change a thing. That’s the truth. And it won’t change a thing because Asobo and Microsoft already commited to a date.
That date will not change. We will not see helicopters before that for sure, unless something magical happens. And it’s not because they don’t want to, but because this takes time to do. And, please, don’t go back to say that there are guys that already have done this, there’s code out there, insert other stuff here, etc.
I’m sure Microsoft is aware of that and exploring all avenues. But whatever is added to the sim needs to interact with the rest and vice-vera. It’s not just a matter of adding a self-contained block into the puzzle. If they were to add something self-contained, they would need to create a sim just for helicopters so that it wouldn’t break fixed-wing or the opposite.
I know some of you see my words as someone that’s a fanboy or a speculator. I’ve received hilarious emails from people calling me all sorts of names just because I am not jumping the bandwagon and shouting my lungs out against Asobo or Microsoft.
The truth is that I try to understand the reasoning behind what happens. And I do that while listening to the companies that are working on the sim and adding my own experience as a software developer into the mix. So I can understand where they are coming from, what they are doing and where they heading out to.
Bear in mind, this won’t be an easy process. I am sure that, when helicopters come out, people will go nuts and shout and scream and bash the product and say it sucks because it will come out with some issues for some users. All this is a process. It takes time to build and perfect. This isn’t tic-tac-toe or minesweeper. It’s a HUGE project with a lot of complexity and parts that interact with each other.
It’s Microsoft and Asobo’s prerogative to come out with any information and they have been doing it when they have something solid to give us (like the release date for helicopters). Meanwhile, I just want them to fix all the stuff that needs to be fixed because that will have an impact on rotor-wing aviation.
I really want them to make this happen as I want to use MSFS in the future. Right now, like I said before, I am not. I do have it installed and keep it updated but I must have less than 20 hours put into the sim after it was released.
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