Help with basic circuits

Made some circuits on my chosen local airfield, did three in all with full stop landing, taxi, takeoff and managed to land on all three attempts - never managed this before, usually end up in the trees at least once !

However, one thing i am struggling with is the base leg - I can take off, climb to 1000’, turn for crosswind, turn for downwind, start prepping for landing, turn for base leg but then it gets a bit messy and when i turn on to the runway heading for approach I’m always off on a tangent - seems I always overshoot so even though I am on the runway heading, I am positioned off at a tangent.

I was pleased to be able to make the landing each time but it wasn’t too pretty :slight_smile:

Any tips?

I had trouble with this when I was newer to Flight Simulator years ago, and as a student pilot.

In addition to the obvious answer of turning base to final sooner, you should try making that turn more gradually. It’s not a sharp 90, but a nice rounded corner. I’m usually only on base for a few seconds before I’m turning, if that. Plus it will help keep you from stalling when trying to fix an overshoot with a steep bank at slow speeds.

And then it’s just practice practice practice. It reminds me of teenagers learning to drive who brake way too late and hard until they get a feel for when to start slowing down.

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Also I’d watch some YouTube videos where a student and instructor are doing pattern work. There might even be one for your local airport. Then watch it a few times. It helps having that picture fresh in your mind before you go and do it.

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Thanks,

I have ben watching plenty of vids, both real and FS2020 content, they do help.

As you say, I’ll keep practicing

I was of the assumption that the base leg was the same sort of length as the crosswind, maybe i’m trying to be too precise and missing the point. I have just realised while typing that time taken is no use as the base is a lot slower than the crosswind, generally at least?

I usually start turning crosswind once above 500 agl, and then the goal of the crosswind is get you at a consistent distance from the field when on downwind. Then it’s the same routine each time that you just fall into. So you have that same sight picture with the runway midway up the strut while on downwind.

Having a head tracker helps a lot with pattern work too if you don’t have one. TrackIR or even VR.

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Moved to #student-pilots:basic-gameplay-help

Thanks,

sounds like i’m turning crosswind too high/late - i’ll try 500 tomorrow :slight_smile:

One more tip: look at the map and see what landmarks you can reference that help with the right distance from the runway. At my local airport there are two freeways which basically line up perfectly with crosswind and downwind.

If you use little navmap it can draw the pattern over the map which may help too.

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Technically the circuit height should be 1000 ft above aerodrome elevation until you turn final. Be sure of what the altimeter is telling you. More height is better when you are learning.

Yes, got that, the airfield I use is handily only around 60’ ASL so i can pretty much read altimeter as it is :slight_smile:

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500 ‘ turning base is far too low and dangerous - you start descending from circuit height (1000’ AGL) when turning base. 30 deg bank when turning base. Then look at the runway regularly when on base.15 deg bank when turning final at no less than 500’. Keep a rectangular circuit. Rounded corners are ok. Allow for wind. A strong xwind can lengthen or shorten your base considerably if you do not allow enough for wind. Don’t hesitate to go around if you are not happy with your approach - “if in doubt, go round about!” Cheers.

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If new to FS then practice again, and again, and again.

In RL, you do a lot of pattern work when first learning to fly. Then one day your homefield pattern becomes second nature, because you have developed a site picture and mental timing in your standard pattern.

Welcome to flying!

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This diagram helps a lot i think, been watching videos too, hopefully get some time later to go fly :slight_smile:

If you have nailed traffic pattern flying my guess is that it counts for a large portion of what “learning to fly” really is ??? At least VFR flight yes?

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I have not done this training for a long time but your post has encouraged me to go back and refresh.
Thanks,

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Well, there’s quite a bit more to it than that part, but it’s a base to start from. The whole process is meant to teach you what the air does that is flowing over your wing, and how to maintain that steady flow by keeping your aircraft at speed so it doesn’t fall from the skies in an uncontrolled manner :wink:

I’ve started flying in games since, i guess 1993-ish? Been a huge fan since, and have learnt quite a lot.
from 2001-ish i learnt to fly a badly stricken aircraft that had controlsurfaces shot up in iL2, complements of other human beings using me for target practice. That combat flying teaches one that not just your stick and rudder are important, also engine management, flaps or even a gear that can help slow an aircraft down when needed, or, in the event of not having those complementary control surfaces, one just keeps the speed up to stay afloat and “lands”(read-> ditch) it on any smooth surface without hedges without killing more of the crew. Just remember that the airplane, is just a vessel that can be replaced… humans can be replaced too, but it is quite frowned upon when one does everything to keep the vessel alive, and kills oneself in doing so. Understanding how the aerodynamics work on any airplane takes quite a bit of time, it is achieved by doing alot of pattern work, learning the instruments and how to correctly read it, but foremost understanding what your position is in 3-dimentional space. The awareness of it all is what makes flying such an epic achievement. I see alot of users here use the onboard computers to help them make flying look easy, but when you strap them into a simple contraption like a cessna, with round guages that have needles in them, some dont even know how to start those… (which in the real world, you’d start with… basically some have jumped on the big airplanes and learnt them completely, without knowing the basics of flight… yet still they do an amazing job with the big ones :wink: )

So yeah, you are definately on the right track. Next step would probably be stalls and spins (at a higher altitude)… you get to know your aircraft better, and it might save your (virtual) life one day having done those practices beforehand, as you might run into an aircraft that actually requires a higher speed upon landing, or you’ve forgotten your flaps on one occasion for example, realising you are in trouble and acting appropriately is one of the most important things of air safety. Same goes for that approach, if you dont get it right, if you are too low or too high for your liking, just floor it and go-around. It makes no sence if all your sences are telling you something is wrong, but you still continue to do wrong… make it right, retry.
The funny thing is, after you’ve done your stalls and spins, you need to remember where to find your airport again. If you know where you fly to do the practice, you should also know your back-course to get back to your airport. minus some deviations as focusing on one thing, might take you miles further than where you thought you were, so awareness of that 3-dimensional position is key.

Hope i didn’t startle you or confuse you, but flying is just an awsome way to pass the time for me… in real life i’m afraid of flying, as i’ve simulated an awful lot of times what can actually go wrong(but mostly an inner ear sensitivity issue that makes my brain go ballistic), but i’ve focused on the things that have gone right and am a better virtual pilot for it. It’s fun, and doesn’t cost as much as the real world equivalent.

Have a great flight, Captain(s), and remember, there’s a whole world out there to explore. So if you want to get your feet wet, pick a spot on the map or an airport, and fly around that for a few flights, see what it’s like. (and one tip, if your aircraft is not performing as well, you might inadvertantly be at a high altitude airport, so lean that mixture and dont pull on the controls too hard, or the flight will be over quite shortly.) The views you get, might be very astonishing, so there’s a bonus for learning and a bonus in the view. Whatever you do, make sure you have fun!

Woof ~ Woof & Salute!

Steiny

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Thanks, and no not startling or confusing at all :slight_smile:

I find it odd that the situation is yelling at me i need to go-round but for some reason still think to force the landing, usually disastrous but sometimes works - an odd quirk of human nature maybe? Do or die or something like that?

Finding the airport is another big area i need to know, or finding any airport sometimes :slight_smile: I guess that comes with navigation skills?

I deliberately stayed away from jumbos, heavies or even the Cessna 172 as it has AP - I’ll save that for later.

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Hahaha, yeah, it’s human thinking… and exactly, we can do anything! If it worked once, it will work again, hahaha. Once you learn what your airplane can and cannot do, you can set her down anywhere, and i mean, “almost” anywhere. It’s usually better to stick to airports rather then just finding a field… in real life, most of those pastures might look promising, but tend to have either very soft ground which makes the nose clobber into the ground upon touchdown, or the odd “mote” might throw a spanner in the works… (i was trying to find the dashcam footage of a Cessna 208 emergency/crash landing near me, but apparently the user or twitter removed it…) Then again, if you understand your aircraft you can even land it without flaps, just need more speed and thus a different/lower trajectory and a longer runout/better brakes. :slight_smile: In case of en engine out, you’d like your “E” (potential energy) to be high, so flaps are for the last few seconds, as they basically are an airbrake, diverting the energy down to give more lift, but cause more drag… that’s also why you take off with a bit more speed, so in an emergency, you have a few more seconds to actually try to control your aircraft on the way down.

AP is nice, if you dont want to handle the controls all the time, or gotta take a bathroom break, talk to the wife or kids, yet i love to handle the controls all the time, and in all fairness, i haven’t learnt EVERything on the big boys yet, but manual flying anything the sim offers me is quite satisfying, and also a great learning curve, even though i find myself wresling a computerdriven system every once in a while.

Finding an airport? Well, since the release of FS2020 I’ve gone back to relearning VOR-tracking and have even downloaded VOR Maps from the official site for flying in the USA… which i try to use from time to time. (i could use navigraph for that but the vor maps are free :wink: or just go to https://vfrmap.com/ and scroll around) Takes a bit of time to understand the symbology, find out what and where everything is (including the radiochannels needed for navigation), but these radio-highways of the skies are a great help for navigational purposes when flying vfr. (but with all the satelite navigational stuff out there, it is on it’s way to be outdated rather soon, i guess.)

And sorry, made it into an article again. hahahaha

If you want to hook up on discord and/or maybe have a chat or do a flight together, send me a pm.

Have a great flight!

Woof ~ Woof & Salute!

Steiny

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I’m actually a student Pilot (with 60 :wink: ) and I’m doing practice it at the moment all the time in my Homebase LOAV - because thats my sessions at the moment. After 60 landings and dozens of patterns in real and hundrets in MSFS I think I’m good in it now. (So my flight teacher told me :wink: ) So if you want to get help contact me via XBox Chat and we will do it together if you want. But if you know once the routines than it’s always practice, practice and once again practice … :wink:

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