From everything I’ve seen so far, XP12 will not compete with MSFS at all.
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Water physics (while still far from perfect) and engine simulation are far superior in XP12. I also like the way you can set up controls in XP and assign various profiles to each airplane you have installed. Also, you can easily assign beta range on your power axis for turboprops and not to forget, turboprops actually behave like turboprops, including beta range which is fully simulated. Ground physics/handling is also way better in XP. Yes, and did I mention helicopter physics? It’s extremely good.
Hopefully this will be implemented in MSFS too. For the time being, despite the various flaws, I’m really enjoying the different experience that XP12 offers. MSFS has a long way to go when it comes to engine simulation (especially piston props and turboprops). Prop simulation in MSFS is still not good.
I’m really hoping Asobo will do something about all of this next year when SU11 and the anniversary edition of the sim is out.
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If this were a boxing match between MSFS and XP, the ref would have called the match already in favor of MSFS, because XP’s eye is swollen all over and XP can barely stand,
It’s not even a fair fight, it’s a one way beatdown. SMH.
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I think after 526 posts everything has been said.
Many posters are repetitive.
Folks keep saying this, igtnoring that the Photogrammetry scenery isnt supposed to be viewed from 200ft or whatever. This is a flightsim. To me these cities look fine from 4000ft or higher. Isnt that the purpose? What good is a very detailed scenery to me if it swallows my GPU capacity needlessly.
Completely diagree. Photogrammetry is highly dependent on graphics settings. Don’t expect photogrammetry to perform miracles if you’re cruising around with terrain LOD and object LOD at 100.
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Personally, I don’t think there’s any competition between MSFS and XP12. Below are three images from the just-released, updated XP12 demo, with all sliders set to maximum graphics quality. Compare these images to what you see in MSFS (even on very low settings):
XP12 Roads
XP12 Roads
XP12 Inland Waterways
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To All Real-World Pilots, I stand corrected, and even IFR I look out and see what WX is doing, to high up to see much other stuff, looking for other planes too. So, guess I’m wrong, but never been RWP. Knew a bunch of them.
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It is not impossible, Technically it is very possible and AccuSeason addon did it…
But it is simply not implemented or prioritized (yet). In terms of immersion I think it is something that is a must have in the world of MSFS…
The last time seasons were mentioned, the dev team was explaining that there is a complexity of adapting the aerial imagery to seasonal hues… I think it is possible with some techniques I saw before but then I am not sure if it works the same with streamed data…
At least the roads aren’t green 
Those screenshots remind me of a “vanilla” FSX installation!
Oh dear - it’s not looking very good for X-Plane. I bought XP9 then went back to FSX and P3D. I then tried XP10 and went back to P3D.
Despite the poor flight modelling in MSFS at least you can distract yourself with the pretty views…
This is the Demo of XP12, around KKLS vs Same area in MSFS (same time aprox and real wx)…
No need to post real photos to show how trees and forests (should) look from the air 
XP12 trees reminds of the Freeware procedural tree generating App called Tree IT… Their trees are scientifically correct + animate with wind as well… But to render the optical illusion of density and vegetation clutter vs performance… Not the right way to go… Also XP12 trees reminds of Hunting games trees and for a hunting game, I think they make total sense… 
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I would say that most XP users today fly in airliners and one thing about airliners lovers is that they care the least about scenery quality compared to a VFR lover, as they are always flying high and will only notice on takeoff and landing.
X-Plane has a good selection of decent quality airliners available and more are yet to come. MSFS will match in quantity on this offer, but it will take a while. However, with more airliners being released for MSFS, more users will come until there comes a point where for most people it won’t be worth keeping XP installed just to fly 2-3 airliners that MSFS doesn’t have.
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A nice example of how MSFS renders dense foliage vs XP12. Tree model aside, MSFS benefits significantly from Bing maps when determining the correct tree density. The one from XP12 looks like a field with a few trees.
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Also to add to ncbartschi’s comment, photogrammetry data generated scenery is an evolving technology, what you see now you will not see 3-4 years let alone 10 years down the road. I’ve covered this on a YouTube debate when Austin passionately defended his autogen approach as the best choice forward. The problem with Austin’s approach, as hard as he may defend it, is that it limits the future capabilities of the game. IMHO It’s a dead end technology.
I know he’s blubbering about the dynamism of generic data over “photographic parameters” that he considers static and unchangeable but that couldn’t be further from the truth. A.I. technology and algorithms are more than capable of being developed to create dynamism and alterations into the photo data obtained and implemented. Whether we like it or not satellite imagery and photogrammetry data analysis implemented by AI software to create an exact replica of the earth is here to stay. Whoever cannot see this is blind or ignorant. It’s the present and future of terrain and globe visual representation for both serious applications like global navigation, types of research and applications in sectors such as: military, agriculture, marine, law enforcement aviation, climate observation, oceanographic research, archeology, geology, etc. And of course gaming.
The current limitations we have are down to 3 main things - remote sensors (active and passive) on both satellite and aerial platforms, A.I.’s capabilities to interpret and implement that data into a flawless, desirable and usable, to an ideal level, result. And last but not least computing power and networks speed to generate that data at very high resolution on the cloud in real time. Year by year the technology on all 3 elements improves dramatically (better sensors, much more detailed imagery, much better photogrammetric data, improved AI algorithm techniques to implement that data, more powerful computers, faster networks). All that will come together gradually to give us a complete high resolution lifelike flawless earth simulation result. It’s not a matter of if but when. Now you want to toss all that and go for generic generated scenery based on landmark feature database? Be my guest.
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In 10 years time, I wonder how much more dated XP13 will look.
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That’s really a good argument. The best defense I have seen for photogrammetry. It’s all about future possibilities. If we support it now, it will get better source material, higher resolution, more advanced technology etc, and we will get a brigher future.
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Once MS/Asobo figure that issue out and address it, MSFS terrain is going to look even more amazing!
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If there is an XP 13, it would have to target the commercial market. With XP 12’s laughable release, I think XP could be done for the consumer market.
This is just a repeat of Blackberry vs IPhone. Blackberry, like XP, had to make a revolutionary release after the IPhone came out, something that would wow the market and bring people back to Blackberry. Blackberry did not. All their subsequent phones were trash compared to the IPhone. And then of course, Android came out, and both IPhone and Android, sealed the fate of Blackberry.
LR needed a revolutionary release with XP 12. Instead, LR released a joke. Mind you, there were people also loyal to Blackberry too, just like there are people very loyal to XP, but those loyal Blackberry users didn’t save Blackberry either. I think it’s game over for XP in the consumer market space. MSFS is just going to pull further ahead of XP 12 with every Sim Update, and the gap will keep growing, and growing.
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One question: Do I need to upgrade to Intel Pentium IV with over 900MHz and do I also need to upgrade my Riva128PCI to a Riva TNT2 Ultra 32MB for this tremendous visual quality?
It looks like these gorgeous DirectX6.1-alike texture and lighting effects need a SUPERCOMPUTER! 
