I recently had the chance to fly the TBM for the 1st few times since AAU1. This plane is one of my main rides in FSE, in which I have 145 flights and over 300 hours, the vast bulk with the WT mod that was before AAU1. And things worked great all that time with GPS, ILS, and RNAV (RNP even). But this is no longer the case since AAU1.
I have always before just used the World Map to create a High Alt Airways IFR flightplan with any needed SID or STAR (but mostly I don’t use either, just pick some waypoints to turn to the en route course from runway heading), and have selected an approach to fit the wind (I don’t use live ATC). This always loaded perfectly and I never had any problems with the autopilot. I should note that I have Navigraph.
Since AAU1, however, I have noticed the following problems.
Flightplan Discontinuities: There are often gaps in the flightplan somewhere, such as between the 1st waypoint in line with the runway and the 1st en route waypoint. Or between the last en route waypoint and 1st of the approach. I tried using SIDs and STARs but gaps would still appear. Meanwhile, the flightplan sequences to the waypoint on the far side of the gap, but says I’m already there even if the waypoint is 100 miles ahead. And note that this ALSO happens with the PMS50 GNS750, not just the G3000, so seems to be something in AAU1 itself instead of the G3000.
Failure to Acquire Glideslope on ILS Approaches. Hitting approach mode arms LOC and GS. LOC eventually becomes active, the needle switches to green, and the plane tracks the localizer. However, GS remains white, never activates, and the plane keeps flying level. This has happened 4 out of 4 attempts so far. This only happens in the TBM with the G3000; the 750 follows the glideslope no problem.
Failure to Acquire Glideslope on RNP Approaches. Same as with ILS approaches, the TBM just keeps flying level and GS never activates. This is 2 for 2 so far.
Hi @OrigBullethead
You might want to consider looking at the (rather long!) thread which is the official G3000/G5000 thread Garmin G3000/5000 Issues and Support . Several of the issues you bring up are addressed there. For example, the MANSEQ issue. One thing I’d do if you go to this thread is to sort so you only see Bishop’s comments first. Just seeing his responses may clarify some issues, or you can “show all” when you want to see what the question/concern was. The way to sort by him is to go to the top of the thread and click on Bishop398 and in the info that shows up, there will be a box that says he has 19 posts (subject to change in # of posts). Click on that box and you’ll just see just his responses.
A couple of things you bring up, I can comment on. For example, in your paragraph 3, the G3000 is not authorized to fly RNP approaches due to not having the real “required navigation precision” needed to fly those approaches in real life. Frequently, there will be another RNAV(GPS) approach (listed “Y” or another letter) for the same runway. The G3000 can fly those. Main difference to the flyer in the approaches is the minimums, which will be lower for the RNP vs the GPS approaches.
As far as paragraph 2, the ILS approaches not capturing the GS, sometimes it’s also due to limitations on the approach, which unfortunately aren’t listed on the WM. For example, some ILS charts will show “AUTHORIZATION REQUIRED”. The G3000 will not fly those as the sim is set up now. Getting the charts for airports you want to fly to is an issue in some regards. I use Flightaware to see most charts in the US but there are lots of alternatives. Assuming you’re clicking the APR button before the GS diamond passes the middle of the mark as it moves down, then there is some issue with the ILS. Several possible issues…
Paragraph 1, there are definitely issues with discontinuities. The G3000 will go into “SUSP” mode when it hits one of those disconnects. Generally, the way around is to use the direct-to mode to go to the next waypoint, where the flight will continue on until it hits another disconnect. One issue with waypoints sometimes being way to far apart and in the wrong direction sometimes, is that the first point of an arrival route may not be a very good fit for where the enroute fixes end. That’s a limitation of the current sim. I normally try to edit the waypoints once I’ve realized where the sim is trying to send me!
Hope some of this helps.
Regards
Thanks for both your detailed response and your helpful tips both at the main thread and how to look for a specific guy’s posts.
RNPs: Hmmph I was used to using those before but, if the plane can’t do it for real, and that’s now modeled, then I guess I’ll have to live with it. It is disappointing to learn this, however. Still, it’s only a minor inconvenience NOW THAT I KNOW RNP glideslopes won’t capture, whereas before I was expecting that to happen :).
ILS GS Not Capturing: I consult the Navigraph approach plates in Navigraph Charts itself running outside the game, rather than the in-game toolbar pop-up because there’s less lag with that way. I’ve never see an “AUTHORIZATION REQUIRED” note. And I’m always hitting GS from below at the published FAF altitude. HOWEVER, as I’m flying my TBM in FSE, that meant flying in Saudi down by the Yemen border, then across to Kenya, Uganda, and on to Tanzania. So perhaps the nav data isn’t so good in that part of the world. But at least I wasn’t shot at.
[quote=“OrigBullethead, post:23, topic:576241”]
So perhaps the nav data isn’t so good in that part of the world. But at least I wasn’t shot at.
[/quote] Well not yet…don’t push your luck!
Could you post a few of the ILS’s you’re having issues with and hopefully we identify if the sim isn’t modelling some of the approaches correctly.
Regards…and keep your head on a swivel down range!
P.S. I tried a few random airports in part of that region (OYAA rwy 08, OEKM rwys 24 and 14, HDAM rwy 27) and the ILS worked fine in the 930 for each of these airports. I’ll try ISHA/08 and OEBA/25 when I get a chance later.
Well, there’s ILS 14 at OEKM and ILS-Y 05 at HTDA for instance. I remember the circumstances of the latter pretty well because it was the most recent. The flightplan was made in the MSFS World Map, not imported. I took off from HUEN Rwy 35 without a SID or STAR but with high airways set and a cruising altitude of FL250. To get out of Entebbe, I added 2 waypoints N of the airport to make 2x 90-ish degree turns to get on the en route course. There were only 2 or 3 en route waypoints for this whole ~600nm trip, which is usual in Africa because there ain’t many navaids (or other players) there.
(Aside: Seriously, just to hear even repetitive Morse beeps to relieve the feeling of isolation during long African flights, play with the Nearest button and most times you’ll see only 2-4 VORs and 0-2 NDBs in total on the whole list going out to 500 miles away, and this makes you feel even more isolated.)
Anyway, there was a big gap in the flightplan as loaded in the FMS between the last en route waypoint (a bit west of Mt. Kilimanjaro IIRC) and the IAF into HTDA, despite this gap not existing on the World Map. So, of course, I went D-> at that point and, as it was straight down from cruise altitude to there, I did the descent based on time, distance, and VS. As portrayed in MSFS, the ILS-Y 05 has a dogleg in it becasue it includes the last waypoint of some STAR, a typical MSFS thing. Once in line with the runway, however, I hit the APPR button and LOC armed and then became active and the needle turned green, but GS remained white while the GS bug fell down the tape. So then I switched to VS again with bottom altitude at minimums and came on it.
As to keeping my head on a swivel, there’s no good way to check 6 in the TBM without a big clearing turn which, if there’s anybody behind you, just lets them lead-turn you when they might not have been able to catch the speedy TBM otherwise. So I only worry about flak
BTW, I used to know a Habu from DOS Air Warrior. Any kin to you?
I’ll go back and fly an actual approach into OEKM. I did an abbreviated test flight into there, and both ILS’s worked fine, but that was starting 20 miles off the end of the runway and just doing a straight in approach and letting the LOC/GS lock. It may be that if I select an actual approach into those runways, it doesn’t work right, but I’ll have to test that.
As far as HTDA, I believe there is an issue with the GS on the approach selected.
I did a similar straight in approach as I did OEKM to test the LOC/ILS signals. I was fairly low to start the test, and it was obvious I was going to have to be quite a bit lower that seemed normal for the GS to remain above the midpoint, even quite a ways out from the airport.
I don’t have a chart for that airport, but i flew the whole “normal” ILS Y 05, and ATC took me down to 2300’ at the IAF, which I thought would be a somewhat normal altitude for GS capture. But as you said, the LOC locked, but the GS was already well below the midpoint when I got to the IAF. Since I don’t have a chart, I’m not sure if we should actually be lower than 2300 at the IAF or the GS is set up wrong! But it wasn’t technique.
I’ve attached a few screenshots just FYI. When I set up the flight, I had quite a few GPS waypoints along the route, and actually had quite a few VORs and ADFs show up on the “nearest” screen, for whatever it’s worth.
Never really go into DOS Air Warrior, but I’ve used the same name for numerous other sims.
Regards
This shot is from a test flight to check the LOC/GS signal. Pretty low approach to even get the GS at/above the midpoint.
Thanks for the chart. I ran the test in standard conditions so that shouldn’t have been the issue. It’s the first time in the sim I’ve ever seen the GS indicator below the midpoint before I got to the IP. When I get the chance I’m going to rerun the test approach a few times and see what happens.
Regards
Thanks for having a look. It is a somewhat confusing approach and what MSFS gives you lacks the procedure turn, it just comes straight in from some seemingly arbitrary waypoint that doesn’t even show on the plate.
Now that we’ve got part of the chart from @casualclick, the approach works fine. At 10 NM DME from DV (I believe thats 117.2 but you can double check me), you descend to 1600 MSL, (ATC vectored me to 2300 but left me there). Assuming you press the APR at the 10 DME point, the LOC will lock, the GS will arm since the GS will be above the midpoint and will lock when you actually intercept the GS. We all know the current ATC won’t help you get there, so unless you have the approach plate it’s just not going to be inherently obvious how to accurately run that ILS approach.
Regards
Having, understanding, and using approach charts is imperative for IFR operations. I recommend spending the money on Navigraph, which gives you most of the charts in the world. Bui in the absence of that, get your hands on as many free charts as you can and learn to read them. Some countries publish them for no cost other than the taxes from their citizenry.
Many years ago, my next door neighbor was an instructor at the AF advanced instrument school. Just for S&G’s I used to go to his class and challenge them to come up with the approach with the most “interesting” comment in the FLIP charts. They came up with lots of good things, but the one approach I always used as an example for why you read Everything on a chart was Indian Mountain Alaska. There was a comment buried in some text that said, “go around not possible due to mountain at end of runway”. One way in, one way out!! The far end (non-approach end) of the runway literally ended just short of a massive mountain.
Not a good alternate when you’re mission planning! LOL.
These days if I can’t readily find a chart for some obscure airport, I just look at surrounding terrain, field elevation, and wing a reasonable approach,
But most areas I’m interested in going to have charts reasonably available.
I had a friend that got assigned to Indian Mt. as an admin-type 1LT. Lost track of him until some years later. He saw my name on the house and knocked at my door. He had gotten selected for AF-funded law school and “went to the dark side”. I said the mountain must have broken him! I don’t think any of those sites are even manned anymore, or at least not the way they were in the ‘70s.
Regards
I was used to using those before but, if the plane can’t do it for real, and that’s now modeled, then I guess I’ll have to live with it. It is disappointing to learn this, however. Still, it’s only a minor inconvenience NOW THAT I KNOW RNP glideslopes won’t capture, whereas before I was expecting that to happen :).
