Max Graphics over London, CPU/GPU almost at idle

User Support Hub Install, Performance & Graphics
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I just got a new rig with a Core i7-13700K and a Geforce 4090 RTX (MSI Gaming X Trio), it’s running on my WQHD monitor supporting 60 Hz.

While I wasn’t actually sure what to expect, what I least expected was this: I’m outside an ATR-42 over downtown London at sunrise. DLSS is active, no VSync or frame rate capping is on and every switch and slider of the graphics setting is set to maximum. I get around 30 frames per second in active pause (more like 25 when actually moving over Canary Wharf) - but the CPU runs at 25%, the GPU at 18%. So there’s room for improvement?

Now I’ve heard something about the CPU slowing down the GPU due to having too much to do. I admit, I didn’t really understand all of that, but I suppose it’s true. At first glimpse it doesn’t apply to me, but the question is of course what’s happening in the cores. Win11 resource monitor shows:

  • “CPUs” 0, 2, 4, 6, 12, 14 at about 50%
  • 8 and 10 at 100%

So I do suppose it’s this “CPU has too much to do and GPU waits for it” scenario. Can you confirm? What do I do now to improve this? Or is this all I can get?

I want to add: the dev mode’s frame rate display also says “limited by main thread PC D3D12” which runs at ~26 ms.

Edit 2: I’m currently running 3DMark to get a grasp of what’s happening. I’ll post the results.

https://i.imgur.com/RN1ds0b.png - 3DMarks TimeSpy Benchmark looks normal, just a little under average.

https://i.imgur.com/fIobxqU.png - GPU-Z screenshot.

NVidia settings are on default.

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I’m following this post as a benchmark:

  1. Install MSFS and run it vanilla. Don’t turn on Vsync. Just load Ultra preset graphics settings. Turn off traffic. Load plane into KMIA runway 27 at 2PM with clear weather. You should be at least at 875-80 fps here.

I’m in a DA-40 TDI at KMIA halting in position RWY 27, 2 pm, clear skies. Preset Ultra, Vsync off, fidelity sharpening 100, nVidia settings at factory standard, DX11, all traffic sliders including fauna density set to 0. I’m getting around 90-92 FPS.

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I’m now trying to figure out whether it’s my high traffic settings that reduced the frame rate. Or whether I’m simply expecting too much.

Edit: going to 100% fauna didn’t change anything. Going to DX12 got me to about 95-100 FPS. Stays the same when I set AMD sharpening from 100 to 200.

Edit 2: Okay. Moving TLOD from 200 to 400 brought it down to around 73. Traffic also seems to be a big factor.

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There’s a limit as to how much overall CPU load you will get due to not all threads being equal (all other threads are to some degree dependent on and limited by the main thread, and vice-versa). The sim cannot fully load all cores (at least, not on a 16-core CPU), nor would you want it to be loading your efficiency cores for anything time-critical. The CPU loading you mention looks about right in my experience.

You only mention even-numbered cores across the available performance cores - do you have HyperThreading turned off? Personally, I leave this on and let the sim and Windows work out how best to schedule my threads.

As you’ve mentioned in your second post, TLOD is probably the worst CPU-limiter there is. Since you can’t get full CPU loading from the sim due to main thread synchronisation issues (basically, all cores have to wait for the one core running the main thread), there is a ceiling for TLOD beyond which it will start to eat into your FPS, and it’s also sensitive to scenery complexity more generally. Traffic (more so AI traffic it seems, based on my experience) also eats FPS for the same reasons. The more aircraft models you have in view, and the more detailed they are, the worse the effect. When I attend the Community Fly-In on Fridays and there are dozens of players visible to me on the runway, all with detailed models, my FPS takes a huge hit into the low 20s sometimes, despite being in less dense scenery areas where otherwise I’d be seeing 80+ FPS; once I get in the air and further away from the other players, my FPS recovers.

I have a 13900K and a 4090 running at 2160p on DX12, so a very similar system to yours, and on Ultra with TLOD at 200 I can get 40-45 FPS uncapped sitting on the ground at EGLC, and about the same in the air over the city with occasional spikes of low FPS. I can vsync at 50% for 30 FPS and that’s generally stable but again with occasional stutters.

All of which is to say, I think if you cap your TLOD below ULTRA levels (I typically go with 100-150) and turn traffic down (or use external traffic like AIG which seems to be less demanding), you should be able to manage 30 FPS over London most of the time, but you won’t manage 60 FPS in such a complex area. My experience is that DX12 performs better in most cases with more than 10GB VRAM, and the 4090 is as big as it gets :slight_smile:

That’s my lived experience, at least. Others may have different experiences.

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Okay, yeah - it’s the TLOD and the traffic I suppose. With TOLD 200 and 40/50/40/100 on traffic sliders, I get around 60 FPS when flying the DA-40 TDI westbound above London City airport. “Limited by main thread” is between green and red.

So is that what I can expect? Or is there something left to optimize?

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On those settings, at <10000ft, that’s really good. Better than I can manage, frankly. Are you using the default EGLC or ORBX? I think the ORBX stuff hits a bit harder for me.

Edit: also, do you have frame-gen on? Because the sim FPS counter doesn’t show you the true FPS with frame-gen on. RTSS can reveal what you’re actually getting with frame-gen. Personally, since vsync is essential for me since I don’t have a VRR display, I don’t use it, but it did double my FPS on the ground in London as claimed.

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Frame-gen is now on, yes. I tried using RTSS after your suggestion but I don’t really understand it. I created an MSFS profile, but I cant get it to actually do any measuring.

I have the ORBX EGLC. Totally forgot about that. :slight_smile: Altitude was maybe 1500 ft.

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You could use MSI Afterburner, which uses RTSS as its instrumentation engine. It’s a bit simpler to get going. Note that I have seen it affect FPS itself if you have pop-outs running, though.

With frame-gen on and a single window, you can probably assume that your true FPS is roughly double the displayed FPS.

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Seems about right. :slight_smile: 98 vs 47.

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I’m going to turn on VSync now.

So what I actually get is a high frame rate even in diffcult suroundings, but stutter. I suppose stutter is caused by the CPU?

By the way, can anybody please explain the visible impact of TLOD? I tried with screenshots, but noticed no difference between 200 and 400.

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I’m sorry, I have totally overlooked your post despite it being so long. Thanks for the valuable input!

"You only mention even-numbered cores across the available performance cores - do you have HyperThreading turned off? Personally, I leave this on and let the sim and Windows work out how best to schedule my threads.

As for the even-numbered cores: that’s what it looked like. Alt-tabbing to the task manager showed the workload of e. g. core 8 being transferred to core 9 for a few seconds, but eventually went back to 8. Same with other core pairs. Since it was just for a few seconds each time and the respective “partner” core is at idle when the other one works, I simply chose not to mention it. I didn’t configure anything here, at least not knowingly.

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Be aware that with frame-gen on, vsync does not work. You will still get screen tearing.

Hopefully something NVidia will address but for now it’s limitation of DLSS 3.0. If you have a VRR display, I guess it doesn’t matter, but I use a TV as my main display and TVs with G-Sync are a bit thin on the ground :slight_smile:

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Not sure. Going by feeling it’s at least better with VSync on instead of off. I’ll have an eye on it and if it turns out to be bad, I know what to do, thanks.

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If you want to save some extra FPS turn vsync off better. It occupies the CPU to some extent, on my system 5-10 FPS depending on where you are flying so if you want the maximum keep it off. Also introduces stutters occasionally

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13700 does this. check parked cores.
nothing to worry about I tested all this and you can unpark them but gives no benefits.

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I will check I have the eame monitor and setup but I think I have much higher numbers.
I will test and let you know

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Hi guys!

So my system spec near same except GPU, my own view on this and my experience some people just could not believe till they saw my stream, I have near all Uk covered with aftermarket airports, got major USA airports specially NewYork got LaGuardia I got Newark KEWR, I got Washington DC city and airport by ORBX and KLAX all inibuilds, my London And EGLL and London City is all Inibuilds and ORBX so you already can see level of scenery I got in my sim, now I have played more lately with settings but I found 2 great options or settings for me, also worth to mention I use XTU Intel for overlocking and manual Overlock to my memory via bios and my GPU I have 3 profiles stock, MSFS OC 4K and MSFS OC light.

My fps will be lower to mid to max.

Flying over London and landing at EGLL or London City using Fenix A320 or PMDG737 fps as fallows:

  • 61/68-75-124

Flying over Manhattan and landing at LaGuardia or KEWR using Fenix A320 or PMDG737 fps as fallows:

  • 68/74- 80/88- 124/138

Always can change

My settings for above fps covers both 4K with scale to 150% and under TAA with Frame Gen turn on. Rest of settings ultra except the screen refresh rate it’s the bottom setting I have it on low. Rest of setting all ultra. Also worth mention my TLOD is set to 345 and my Detail LOD is 200.
And, I have Nvidia control painel with specific settings for MSFS only I have in game anisotropic filter turn completely off in Sim but on Nvidia painel set to max x16 then GPU set to max performance and low latency set to ultra, then in general on Nvidia setting I have Cache set to unlimited. Gsync set to variable as I have Vsync in game turn off.

2 option in game - All above :point_up_2:t2: same apply to native resolution as my monitor is 1440p (2k) native and it’s IPS painel with 165hz refresh rate and it’s 27inch gaming monitor, for this case I have Nvidia DLSS activated and set to Quality and Frame Gen turn on.

Fps in game same with bit higher numbers on max fps I hit from time to time even 250FPS bear in mind all ultra.

Multiplayer Online set off only turn on if needed.

Traffic in game options set to airport people - 20
Airport vehicles set to 20 parked airport aircraft set to 0.

Other traffic - Leisure boats set to 0, the ships and ferries set to 50 and road cars traffic set to 45

Also I use FSLTL for traffic later can post my setting of that.

My system is Intel core I7 13700k overlocked using XTU to 5.6Ghz all P cores and E cores to 4.4Ghz.

My memory is Hynix Adie and it’s 2x 16gb Gskill 6400mhz 32GB running at tide timings stock voltage at at 6800mhz on 30-32-32-90.

My board is Z690 ASUS Rog Hero

And GPU is ASUS Rog Strix 4080 OC edition oc for MSFS 3000mhz core and 22550 on Memory.

PSU is an EVGA SuperNove 80gold 1000w

Cables for GPU is cable mod 4pcie to single 12v power cable just that alone was 30£ something like that order from original website of cable mod.

Temps never above 50c also cpu is also ways few cores only 45-50c

My cooling is all around EKWB fans and rad and block is all unique system as it’s last of its kind is modular EKWB Phoenix MLC 240mm but it’s very fat radiator which equal an 360+ the block on that is an velocity flat copper like a mirror! Also worth to mention I have thermalright flat plate for cpu to make HSI of cpu flat that alone drop around 10c I had to remove original board cpu bracket retention.

Forgot to mention I use de lot if process to install Nvidia drivers NVinstaller or cleaner and DDU.

My drivers are very light and only got 2 containers for Nvidia

All optimisations done to get faster higher frames and less over stress system.

Also I have turn off the option in windows defender that gives cpu his wings back as there is core isolation that cpas cpu performance by turn that off you get your full cpu power under your controle I notice huge relief of cpu once that was off!

Recommend that! If you need like personal system optimisation I can have you and myself on discord and I can guide on complete tutorial for optimisation! Just DM me.

See system here:

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i cant find you in Discord please send me your active discord name, i would like my system optimisations like your one