My 2070 SUPER VR settings and suggestion (Reverb G2 - WMR)

Hey, Cap — hard to tell where you landed on this: I’m about to try a full VR flight in the CJ4 for the first time. Did you decide what settings you like for that? 60/80 without repro? Or are you still doing repro on jets?

I nearly don’t use the G2 anymore… mostly the Index instead.

I did try yesterday the G2 with SteamVR and WMR and tracking was giving me a awful time compared to the razor sharp outside in tracking of the Index. The cockpit was floating around me and lagging every move I made, WMR was sometimes shifting the entire position all of a sudden.

Sure the visuals were nice in the very narrow center I would appreciate them, but comparing again with the Index where not only I can see wider both horizontally and vertically, but more than this I can see clearly from edge to edge in just moving the eyes, was really revealing to me the G2 is just a deceiving product in many aspects you can probably only see once you’ve used a Valve Index. Really night and day an experience and I only wish the Index panels were refreshed with higher res, that’s all that would be needed to me.

Now It might be my G2 has a specific problem but I doubt it now since the latest HP Q&A. The “official” answer is clearly telling I’m right since the beginning and they have compromised the optics in the G2 in ways they didn’t need to (see below*).

Here is for the Index settings I’m using right now (with latest SteamVR 1.16.5):

My 2070 SUPER VR settings and suggestions (Index - SteamVR) 🟢 - #449 by CptLucky8

Otherwise with the G2 I’m still finding the settings I’ve posted when using motion smoothing are working good on my test system:

My 2070 SUPER VR settings and suggestion (Reverb G2 - WMR) - #2 by CptLucky8

That is I can’t use less than OXR 65% (because of distortions bug if below) and no more either because of performance on the 2070S. From there, I adjust TAA more or less 70 and clouds/terrain depending.

*I mean both G1 and G2 panels are the same res and size, they could have kept the G1 optics now that it shows they can anti-CA it effectively (as reported by many G1 users). Choosing the Valve optics for less CA also comes with less refraction and the need to curve the lens more therefore lowering the sweet spot cone and therefore making this headset optics even more questionable without any eye relief system and a so much recessed face mask. This is what I’m thinking about in terms of “compromised optics in the G2”. And let’s not forget they said initial production was slightly delayed because of a last minute change with the lenses… what last minute change is this??!

here is the HP comment

We have found that a minority of user’s eyes are farther from the optics after making the correct adjustments than optimal. Reducing FOV and optical performance. You are right that there is a careful balance we must hit between accommodating users with glasses, but also ensuring user’s eyes are close enough to the lenses to remain in the sweet spot. I cannot comment on future plans but this is something that is definitely top of mind as we want everyone to have the same experience.

https://www.reddit.com/r/HPReverb/comments/l76cke/hp_microsoft_here/gl54msi/?utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=web2x&context=3

In other words, I wouldn’t hold my breath about “what to see if the headset is calibrated properly” because even the HP person behind the G2 hardware is not providing a clear answer to the specific calibration measures and questions I’ve raised. But he is suggesting the distance to the lens is somewhat narrow and because of the shape design of the G2 it is very possible many people can’t get it right at all.

I believe I’ll process a RMA if not requiring a plain simple refund (even if post 30 days) because they’re selling a product they know can’t work with many people, unless they’re wearing their glasses which is not supposed to.

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Thanks @CptLucky8 - assuming when you said ‘OpenXR Scaling to AUTO’ you meant the Motion Reprojection option, I switched to Always On. It seems Automatic Motion Reprojection does some other stuff automatically too. A little embrarassed that’s the one variable I didn’t consider despite all the other changes I was making and testing to try and isolate the issue.

Appreciate the effort and patience you keep affording all of us - I do hope you get to spend at least a bit of time enjoying some flying after you’ve taken care of the rest of us.

Thanks again.

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@CptLucky8 I also have a HP Reverb G2 and having the same head tracking issues in MSFS as I use SteamVR because I want to use OVR Toolkit when I stream.

I also use X-Plane and I use my G2 with my Index controllers and do not have any of the head tracking issues so not sure what the issue is but might also try to use my Index in MSFS to see how that will work.

Thanks for your feedback while we work thru the current VR issues.

Yeah,I have a love and hate relation ship with this headset ( G2 ), it’s so close to being great, buy yet so far, which makes it even more frustrating. I regret selling my G1 so early, I didn’t get to compare. But from what I can remember, I could just glance at my VS and airspeed without feeling “bothered”.

I’m thinking about trying the Quest 2, but I’m not a big Zuk’ fan, it pains me to give him money.

I’m even thinking about getting the Index again, but the glare was a problem for me in XP…

ugh… money…technology…

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Thank you for your kind words! No I really meant Scaling to Auto, where OXR will then automatically adjust the scaling based on your VRam amount (and other things we don’t know).

You might want to read this then:
My 2070 SUPER VR settings and suggestions (Index - SteamVR)

and the latest post about SteamVR 1.16.5:
My 2070 SUPER VR settings and suggestions (Index - SteamVR) 🟢 - #2 by CptLucky8

Thank you for all your feedback as well, this is helping all of us in turn!

I regret having returned the G1 when they’ve announced opening the G2 preorders soon (I was in the 30 days return window).

It is so amazing how I can just grab the Index, wear it, and it perfect right away: no sweet spot to adjust, no clarity problem, no tracking issue, feels solid and robust, the handy in-headset button to change your SteamVR settings live in FS2020 session without the need for a controller, etc… so well thought out product for VR. The G2 was promised to be the killer headset for simmers and I’m glad many are enjoying it, but the Index is so much superior, and when I got the chance maybe one day to find a 3080/90, pushing the Index to SS200 is nearly the same legibility in the cockpit than the G2, with the bonus of edge to edge clarity over nearly 85% of the view for me…

I guess I may have found something before you for once then :slight_smile:

I’ve got scaling set to 100% manually, and tried other values too. Also, no Geforce experience. If there was something that far down the chain like that causing issues, I’d expect it to have an impact regardless of reprojection options, but there are so many variablles and interdependencies going on here, you can never know for sure.

[Edit]
Looks like that might have been some placebo or temporary effect. Anyway, I took some screenshots and they all came out looking the same regardless of disabled/auto/always, so it’s definitely a frame-to-frame issue, and this is despite the headset not moving (it’s stationary on the desk). I don’t get a constant 30.0 fps counter - bounces between 29.x and 30, so not sure if it’s a boundary issue. It’s being throttled in main thread by the reprojection though - I’ll get 40fps in same scene when disabled. Anyway, I don’t want to get too bogged down in this as it’s actually fine disabled, would have just been nice to get the extra smoothness. Or maybe it’s because I just can’t stop tinkering…

Thanks again

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What would help me a lot is to find some technical posts that explain how to calculate the effect on pixel resolution of changing MSFS and OXR scaling. Such as when you post the following, how did you actually calculate the Render Resolution and the Post-Processing Resolution? - sorry if I missed an explanation somewhere but you have almost published a full-length textbook on settings and results (for which everyone is very grateful!). Also, I’ve seen posts by others on Reddit or avsim where someone has calculated with particular settings how many pixels are real and how many synthesized.
Was wondering, too, if that calculation is real and meaningful and how is it done?
WMR Scaling and Dev Tools - Some Explanations

Using WMR OXR 103.2011.17003

FS2020 Render Res. Post Process Res. Comments
TAA 60% 1898x1855 3164x3092 breathtaking visuals and crisp enough EFIS at ~30 fps

Also, it would be great to have in one place a description of the techniques, including the test scenes or flights, that you use to compare settings. Again, sorry if it’s already in one place in one of your discussion threads and I’ve missed it.

Another unrelated question is in the Windows Mixed-Reality Enthusiast’s Guide, which seems to be out-of-date and perhaps initially oriented mostly towards HoloLens developers, there is emphasis on going into Windows Developer Mode and running the Windows Device Portal and looking at the Performance tab. I was wondering if this was of any use and whether by doing that, I’m just going to consume CPU/GPU and make my PC more insecure to boot!

The easiest is not to calculate anything and just reading the values in the developer mode fps window!

  • TAA scaling is affecting rendering resolution, which is the actual pixels the game is rendering (yes I know, the game…)

  • OXR/SteamVR is affecting Post-Process resolution, which is the number of pixels the CAS Shader is “stretching” the rendered pixels. It is also the resolution the OXR API is expecting the application to send each views at prior further internal processing for display purposes.

When I’ve started all these series I use to first fly a certain pattern around KSNA which is a “demanding” area (photogrammetry, multi players, mountainous terrain around, etc…) with the DA40 (EFIS). I was then confronting this against the A320 in different places but mostly Dubai, Hawaii. My “recommended” settings are therefore trying to set the minimum required for the visuals (ala “I wouldn’t accept anything less as a pilot”) which are also giving enough fps and stutter free experience over the LAX region in most cases. Flying nearly everywhere else is running better and allowing me to raise some settings like clouds, and/or terrain LOD now on the Index thanks to the latest SteamVR beta updates (I have to update my topic accordingly too).

The device portal is working but I didn’t use it really, just tried it out.

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I guess I have no chance with my 1080 (not TI)?

@SparkerInVR, how do you do that exactly? I’ve tried to start MSFS from within Steam VR, and although the app does fire up, it never “starts” inside of the Steam VR session. Instead, I just get an empty room with a sign that says something like “Coming up”, with a picture of FS2020.

What am I doing wrong?

Use WMR for SteamVR beta.

:clap: :clap: :clap:
:clap: :clap: :clap:

I do so wish more people would do this. FB is not only trying (and succeeding) to corner the VR market as a whole, they’re also doing so by holding “your” very device hostage to their ability to brick it if you don’t use their service in a manner in which pleases them.

I couldn’t use one of these with a clear conscious even if someone gave them to me, and I’d probably just use that as an opportunity to literally destroy the device while video recording what I’m doing, and most importantly, why!!

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@CptLucky8, OK friend, I need your help on this. I don’t understand how to use Steam VR with MSFS properly. If I start in the Steam VR “waiting room”, and I click on FS2020, it brings me to a matrix like room with a little sign that says (paraphrased from memory), “Up Next”, with a picture of FS2020. Aside from that, nothing whatsoever happens.

FS2020 does start in the background, as I can both hear it and see it if I peek out from under my G20, but “inside” the Steam VR session, nothing. Just that empty room and sign.

What am I doing wrong? And even though I want to know how to use it from within Steam VR regardless of if it’s a good idea or not, is it in fact a good idea?

Once again I’m asking you to save me from my own noobness induced stupidity. Many grassy asses.

I have been spending most of my time enjoying flying lately, and getting more and more reluctant to try new things. This post made me plug in my Index one more time.

I have to say, I agree with almost everything said. The latest SteamVR does make a huge difference. Being able to lock FPS at 20 or lower means almost everyone can get a smooth experience. And the Index does have all the advantages mentioned by @CptLucky8.

However, I am still going back to the G2. Yes, you can push through more pixels with Steam OpenXR, but some of those get wasted on the Index anyway. Super-sampling won’t make everything in a A320 legible; only a high-resolution headset can can.

The real deal breaker for me is Steam motion smoothing, which is far inferior to WMR. Some of the words I read from other posts but could not really understand – wobbling wins, vaseline effect, ect – make sense now. With WMR motion smoothing, the only artifact I notice is around the propeller area, which makes it much easier to manage and ignore. With SteamVR (and Oculus, by the way), they are everywhere. Even the instruments wobble when you shift you head left and right.

Lastly, the contrast and color of the G2 make everything more realistic to my eyes. The Index is too saturated, almost completely washing out the subtle effects of ambient occlusion.

Now that I have spent significant amount of time with all three major headsets. I can say definitively: G2 is the best headset for MSFS 2020.

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I’m not sure for FS2020 Steam version, but IIRC we’ve already discussed this: Steam “Home” or “Client” is just for launching the game (yes I know, the game), and once FS2020 is ready you can CTRL+TAB to switch to VR. That’s all. Now when switching to VR, you can choose SteamVR OpenXR or WMR OpenXR, the former also requires therefore WMR for SteamVR BETA to run with the G2.

I agree with what you’re saying too about the G2 and WMR Motion Smoothing.

NB: don’t forget to try adjusting this as well:
What is the new SteamVR “ADDITIONAL PREDICTION (ms)” value doing?

With SteamVR 1.16.4 I was using 50ms usually to eliminate most “wobbling”
With SteamVR 1.16.5 I usually get good results with 25ms now

This is really helping a lot getting a much better SteamVR motion smoothing.

However I do find the G2 more saturated than the Index as if it was using a “vibrancy” boost (not the same as saturation), especially on the greens, but the Index is clipping whites and I don’t know if this is a panel limitation or the FS2020 tone mapper calibrated for the G2…

Hence the need to vote for these so that we, the users, can take control back:
Provide a Sharpen strength setting, and more post-processing effect controls in VR
Implement a metering system better suited for VR

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CptLucky8:

I am new to flying sims and just acquired MSFS2020 on Dec. 12. I was so blown away that on Jan. 10, 2021 I received my brand new gaming rig aimed at wringing out hours of smooth flying while learning to fly and see the world. The rig is made up of: i9, 3080, 32 mb ram, liquid cooled, 1000 w PS. It’s currently running the 461.40 Nvidia driver.

I am a junior, intermediate computer nerd. I have been reading your columns to better understand how to improve my rigs VR performance. Yesterday, I implemented your recommendations for the Nvidia Control Panel settings found at: 3D Settings / Manage 3D Settings / Program Settings / Microsoft Flight Simulator.

I am pleased to report improved flying characteristics in 2D and VR as a result. In VR, my frame rates were running anywhere from 30 to 45 fps. The CPU never exceeded the GPU in percent utilization. All settings within MSFS2020 had been set to Ultra or High except a few at the bottom. I am using a Vive Pro headset in VR and a 32 x 20 Ultrawide monitor w/ G Sync enabled running at 120 Hz in 2D. I was flying the 336 Pan Training Jet out of Monterey, CA. Clear skies, no wind. I flew a bunch of other GA planes, too, all with improved performance (stable and smooth flights).

Today, I am about to implement another of your recommendations - installing the 457.30 Nvidia driver. I will report back on the outcome of that experiment.

Wednesday, I will receive my order for an HP Reverb G2 headset. I am hoping to greet it with a tricked out rig and effective software tweaks cause it sounds like getting IT to perform well will be another big challenge. I will keep you informed.

Imagine me doffing my cap to you (and many other MSFS Forum members) for your willingness to share your very extensive … wait for it - its another acronym…KSE’s, known in the Six Sigma Process Improvement circles as Knowledge, Skills and Experience. It has been daunting to digest but rewarding. I have greatly benefitted from everyone’s generosity and the experience has been a breath of fresh air given the current state of affairs in the world.

Thank-you!

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Thank you for your kind words! I’m really glad this is helping more people everyday. We all learn from each other too and I’ve started these topics with a “developer” and “pilot” background to understanding what is influential to the experience, but it is unfortunately highly technical sometimes. Nevertheless I strongly believe anyone can learn these if giving enough willingness, and once you do, it opens a door to another level of understanding of computers and the technology you’re using everyday, let alone it opens the mindset to critically discerning the generic YT blah blah meant for raising clicks and popularity, from the practical knowledge you’d benefit from.

I’m really glad my 2 main VR topics are attracting so much exchange and sharing and I’ll never hesitate to continue updating the recommendations based on everyone’s feedback, because I’ve just started the topics, but we’re collectively improving them.

PS: I must admit I’m also glad one of these (SteamVR - Index) is also the most popular topic in these forums :blush:

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Yes, I did use all your suggested settings for Index, and experimented a little more myself. The Additional Prediction – which as I understand is acting like an additional buffer to filter out occasional hiccups – doesn’t seem to make any difference for me.

I wonder if SteamVR is using depth information at all for motion smoothing. That might be the key. Regardless, given how often it gets updated, I am sure it’ll catch up with WMR soon. It already offers far more flexibility than the others.