[Polls] Zeppelin Luftschifftechnik Goodyear

Official Microsoft Flight Simulator Polls & Feedback
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Please use this thread to provide general feedback and impressions about this aircraft in Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024. For all bug reports, please create a new topic (or upvote an existing topic) in the Bug Reporting Hub > Aircraft & Systems section of the forums. Please use the full bug report template when creating a new bug report.

On a scale of 1-10 (with 10 being best), how do you rate the Flight Model and Aircraft Systems?
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On a scale of 1-10 (with 10 being best), how do you rate the Interior and Exterior Graphics?
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On a scale of 1-10 (with 10 being best), how do you rate the Audio and Aircraft Sounds?
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On a scale of 1-10 (with 10 being best), how do you rate your Overall Enjoyment of this aircraft?
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Thanks,
MSFS Team

Zeppelin NT / Goodyear Blimp (real world Zeppelin NT pilot)
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This topic is now open for Poll votes and comments.

We’d love to hear your feedback on the Blimp!

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Pilot feedback here:

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That is a bit of a depressing read, but not surprising, if true.

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Even more depressing is that it was moved out of the official bug forum to user support since he mentioned all of the issues.

Understand why individual issues need to have their own topics (I’m sure these are converted to bugs/tasks on the MS side), but to get an offer of help from one of 20 RW pilots and have it dropped into another forum where it won’t be logged in the official system and may be lost is disappointing.

10 Likes
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I know, it’s so frustrating. @UHPKCROW also took the time to thoroughly document the issues with the Skyship 600, which still remains unloved. Sad to say, but I had the lowest of expectations for the Goodyear airship. I simply can’t understand why MS is spending money to have iniBuilds make these things when they also have zero intent to deliver a usable product.

Who are these aircraft even supposed to be for? They’re too complex for casual crowd to bother, but too unfinished for advanced users to enjoy.

10 Likes
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I found a fourth engine/propeller on the blimps back and this what the IA is telling me:

Great! To summarize the key fact for your Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024 Goodyear Blimp experience:

The aircraft has three engines driving four propellers. The “fourth” component you see is the lateral thruster propeller on the tail, which is powered by the third (rear) engine.

  • Engines: 3 (Left, Right, Rear)

  • Propellers: 4 (Left Vectored, Right Vectored, Rear Main, Rear Lateral)

  • Control: The lateral propeller is controlled via rudder inputs or dedicated yaw vectoring, not a separate throttle.

Enjoy your flight over the United States National Parks in World Update 22!

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The problem with the two airships in MSFS is that they’re simply too inaccurate and unrealistic to teach anyone how to operate them properly. As a result, hardly anyone flies them. That lack of interest means bugs never get fixed, which in turn makes even fewer people use them. It’s a vicious cycle.

In real life, flying a Zeppelin NT is an incredible experience. Hovering, landing in confined areas, and coordinating with the ground crew to moor at the mast are all challenging, rewarding, and genuinely fun. None of that is meaningfully captured in the current MSFS implementations.

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I don’t know how to fly the blimp without it doing strange things. I hopped in for about 20 minutes yesterday and another 40 today but I don’t know how to go about figuring it out. It was constantly doing things I didn’t want it to. Without any real understanding about how to fly it, it’s not really doable in a realistic way.

Based on what I’m reading above, even if I were to figure it out it wouldn’t be the most realistic experience.

I was actually really looking forward to it, too.

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You make a great point, but it begs the question of why they attempted to make a second airship when MSFS still lacks the architecture to support it? Something from the business/legal side, where they had a licensing agreement or something with Goodyear and needed to fulfill?

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Can some community manager tell us if we are ever going to get a word about the Airship 600 and this aircraft from Microsoft? A user manual, a video tutorial, anything that can convince us that these are flyable?
And can I ask why there is complete silence about updates? Any plans to fix bugs? Who developed this?

I’m really looking forward to being able to fly these.

Thank you very much!

G

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Some points, I agree with all of these issues raised to start https://forums.flightsimulator.com/u/uhpkcrow

I think the lack of utility with regard to the mast truck is a massive own goal (another one) on this especially given the aircraft model itself is generally speaking very nice, issues above raised not withstanding.

MSFS 2024 introduced aerostatics, rope physics, winches and hoists so it is all technically achievable - the helicrane missions show that for mooring it would work. Please add this, and missions for airships, it will be a draw to the type

As for aerostatics, the albeit slightly janky existing aircraft physics system does work 
 ish (caveated), I have played with it a lot in SDK projects, though there are big in-built issues, the most obvious being gas valves themselves which are not detailed in simulation meaning they aren’t custom to each ship (not enough settable configuration to be simulatable realistically). The valve map (flight_model.cfg) here is too simple and only denotes an over-pressue release pressue, these things are differently sized depending on purpose and there is no notion of how much flow you’ll get at a certain overpressue, small hole is gonna flow less than a big one

In my projects I have managed to get rigid airship physics (which are not pressure vessels and have no ballonets which are ‘technically’ required by the physics engine) to somewhat work as I would nearly expect, the valve issue not withstanding - they tend to work slowly or instantly with difficult in betweens achievable, it is satisfying I must say releasing gas after burning fuel - alebeit not at a prototypical rate, however it is achievable and wouldn’t be a massive change to the physics model, a valve release area should be settable, as most airship release valves are spring/cable actuated and move to full deflection nearly immediately, tho percent open would be a useful addition also. That is a simple change, I can get into more interesting additions such as valve placement (important on rigid ships not non/semi rigid airships that said), superheat, rain on the envelope weight 
 
 but this is the most critical to getting the 600 and the NT to work somewhat more realistically for flight physics

As an aside however, without the ability to moor, my projects for GZ2 (mothballed at high model completion), and my new project of R101 modelled with the original drawings, won’t go further than curiosity pieces for my own personal fun. Shame as they really are so magical to fly, here I was testing the physics and an early engine model on a mediteranean cruise along the coast of Egypt in hot conditions, the ship gently pitching side to side as she goes.

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Here approaching Cardington, it would be nice to have an actual mast that can be docked to - framework shown in the interior here is early and already fully revised

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Well that’s cool. Iron Maiden already wrote the theme song for your project, too.

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Was really looking forward to this new airship, especially with the National Parks scenery. Unflyable right from the start - yaws hard to the right, slowly corrected with rudder trim?! No manual/instructions - really??? Goind to have to wait for someone on YouTube to post a starter tutorial. Doesn’t the team that designed the flight model want to share what their thoughts are?

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From toying with the other airship I ended up being able to take this one off and fly it around to altitutde, but I ran into a problem. I filled the envelope to a nose high attitude to cruise upwards, but I was not able to bring the nose down. The envelope pressure between the fwd and aft just wouldn’t change no matter what I did with the valves or the fans.

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Can you confirm that you were able to use the air system by filling / emptying ballonets?

For takeoff and landing, the Zeppelin NT is normally trimmed slightly tail-heavy by adjusting the fill levels according aerostatics and weight & balance calculation.

As the airship climbs into cruise, the trim gradually shifts toward neutral. This occurs automatically because the aft air valves are set to open at a lower envelope pressure than the forward valve, causing the aft ballonet to lose air first.

Any remaining trim adjustments are made using the transfer valve, which transfers air between the forward and aft ballonets, or by fuel trim.

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Thanks this helped a lot actually! I just took off after following the fill advice and its working much better now.

Edit, well atleast for the initial climb. I kind of get stuck in this sort of state. The transfer fan seems to help, but I just cant for the life of me figure out how to actually get the nose trimmed down.

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Or even getting it to this state, the nose is still 15 degrees up


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Several variables influence the trim and buoyancy of the airship. Adjusting only one parameter (for example, air dirstribution or fuel) is not sufficient. All parameters interact and must be considered together.

The calculation requires, at a minimum:

  • Airship Dry Operating Index (DOI), depending on the aircraft configuration
  • Outside Air Temperature (OAT)
  • QFE (local atmospheric pressure)
  • Helium volume
  • Expected superheat
  • Payload
  • Required fuel

Using this information, the pilot (or operator) performs an aerostatic calculation using either a dedicated software tool or a traditional aerostatics and weight-and-balance worksheet.

The calculation determines:

  • Whether the selected helium volume is appropriate for the mission.
  • The required amount of solid ballast.
  • The required amount of water ballast.
  • The correct fuel distribution between the forward and aft tanks.

During the final stage of the calculation, the fuel distribution is normally adjusted to achieve equal forward and aft ballonet fill levels, which is the preferred trim condition for normal operations.

This planning process is fundamental to Zeppelin NT operations. Without it, there is no reliable way to ensure that the airship is within its operational weight and trim envelope.

In many ways, omitting this calculation is comparable to attempting a flight in a large airliner without calculating weight, center of gravity, or takeoff speeds—it is not a realistic or practical way to operate the aircraft.

Trim verification on ground “by feel”

Before takeoff, while the airship is off the mast and resting on its landing gear, the pilot can assess the trim by observing the landing gear.

If either the forward or aft landing gear has a tendency to become light, bounce slightly, or even lift off the ground, this indicates that the airship is not correctly balanced.

The pilot can then correct the trim by:

  • Transferring fuel between the forward and aft tanks.
  • Using the ballonet transfer system to move air between the forward and aft ballonets.

However this seems to be impossible in the sim right now. Personally, I can’t get the airship to rest on both the forward and the aft landing gear, by adjusting the variables.

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SU6 Beta completely breaks this even though it already wasn’t working very well.

In the beta if you turn on the aft ballonet fan, both ballonet fills will go to 100% basically instantly, and then it becomes a science experiment trying to lower them. Maybe they are trying to figure out a fix for this air pressure stuff in the update.

Anyway I unsubscribed from the beta and was able to fly the Zeppelin a bit better, but can’t figure out how to land.

The trick for taking off for me is to turn on the aft ballonet fan, and then wait until both fills are around 20%. Then I disconnect from the mast with engines tilted all 60 or 90 degrees up. Once I’m flying I manage the air valves and the fans to attempt to pitch up and down. Turning the fans on and off in flight seems to help change pressures, but there is only with a slight causal relationship to if I’m going nose up or nose down.

I did find that you can fill the Zeppelin with just 50% fuel, and then this allows you to transfer fuel between the fwd and aft tanks, which again helps with pitch control. The other thing is setting the rear weight ballast to 0, which seems to help it be more nose neutral.

I can actually get the zeppelin to go like 60 degrees nose down with a combination of Aft engine up and trimming forward as much as possible with the methods mentioned, but I guess I need someone to grab a rope. It doesn’t seem possible to actually off gas the helium and descend in a gentle manner.

1 Like