You’re not gonna bounce because the mains are too stiff. You bounce because you have too much lift. Having flown the plane before, I assume you’re coming over the numbers at the proper speed. So, sounds like either you’ve got too much power in, or the flight model needs a little tuning.
Ill try it myself today to corroborate, if I can get on the sim.
Doesn’t mean the mains might not be too stiff, but that shouldn’t cause a bounce. Unless you’re trying to land like a fighter on a pitching carrier (which, see reason 1 ) .
Oh, and the “too much power in” could mean prop tuning might be required, too… IOW, there’s nothing you can do to pull enough power out…
To me it feels like the flight model needs a little tune, I can wheel and 3 point other tailwheels just fine (chilton, ryan sta, rans s6, waco, tiger moth)
I could try to plant it as if on a carrier…but that might turn it into a kangaroo
the super decathlon is a great model, lots of fun and challenging.
I don’t have this aircraft yet but for taildraggers I always test the lowest controllable airspeed before trying to 3-point a landing.
Climb to a safe altitude, make sure you’re heading into the wind, reduce airspeed and add flaps (if the plane has 'em) and raise the nose to the 3-point attitude then see where the stall speed is. Once you know exactly what speed that is, you practice balancing the airplane in that 3 point attitude just above the stall and fall speed, then bring that knowledge down to the approach and runway. Many light taildraggers require some prop energy to maintain the 3 point attitude due to the wing area and angle of attack causing excessive drag and rapid airspeed bleed off.
Actually, that’s not strange at all. The problem of bouncing can occur if the plane has too much energy, or it falls to the ground from too high an altitude at high speed. There’s quite a bit of drag in a 3-point attitude going on, so I would expect the plane to need some power to maintain it.
The problems come when the pilot leaves too much power in. Then it will bounce because as it touches the ground, the plane can acquire lift in ground effect (less likely in high wing planes, but not impossible), and then it takes off again.
150% this… I’m part of a crew who do bush group flights and when we have newer folks join in looking for tips this is nearly word for word what I tell them for learning how to land short and practice energy management.
You’ve truly learned a plane when you’re able to get into slow flight and alter/maintain altitude as you wish with throttle input. After getting that down you’ve got the knowledge and experience to bring her in smoothly.
I would expect that a low drag, high performance aircraft like the Decathlon would take more runway and higher speed to land. I haven’t personally flown this myself. For planes like this, I usually reduce throttle and pitch for level flight and see how much it slows down. I am cautious to feel if it gets too mushy with the lift. You can’t dive down, you have to descend with nose up. If it slows down, then you get a nice easy touchdown. If not, you let it roll on out and bleed the speed on the ground. In that case you are dancing on the rudder. Fly it to the stop.
Revision 1.0.1 will be coming out soon. The 2 wheel landing is taken care of as well as making it easier to land in general. Here are the notes:
Adjusted Flight model (Specifically for landing and landing on two wheels)
Fixed G-meter in Analog
Removed Min/Max/Reset in Analog(Will replace at a later date)
Fixed Alternator charge rate
Fixed Registration Brightness & Size
Fixed Fuel code in GNS430 & GTN650
Two New Liveries - 1. Orange & 2. Smitty
Added smoke annunciator light - all 3 variants
So i’m trying to learn stuff and of course my first step was to start from the basics. This is from the manual of the plane ( really a great and super useful bonus for who, like me, doesn’t known nothing about areobatics ).
SPINS: To induce a spin in the American Champion Super Decathlon,
follow these steps:
Enter a Stall:
Reduce throttle to idle. Maintain level flight while slowly pulling back
on the stick to raise the nose. As the airspeed decreases, the aircraft
will approach a stall. Keep pulling back on the stick until the wing
stalls. Apply Rudder Input:
Just as the aircraft stalls, apply full rudder in the direction you want
the spin to occur (e.g., left rudder for a left spin). At the same time,
maintain back-pressure on the stick to keep the nose high. Spin Entry:
The Super Decathlon should now enter a spin, characterized by a
steep, nose-down spiral descent. The aircraft will rotate around its
vertical axis while descending rapidly.
My problem is the first step, the wing doesn’t fall on one side. The stall warning keeps sound while the plane slowly go down. Now, if i apply full rudder the wing falls and the plane nose down quickly but do not spin. I’m sure i’m doing something wrong ( be kind, this stuff for me is new ). For example, step 2: i apply full rudder on one side, but when should i release it ? Before the plane starts to spin ? After ?
Trim behavior is strange in MSFS. Have you tried adjusting the pitch trim as you slow down and move into the stall? It may help; it may not.
Coincidentally enough, the issue may be related to the topic above regarding the three-point attitude. Could be an elevator authority; the plane being overly-resistant to any type of lateral movement; balance issues; etc.
I agree generally, except the manual for this very aircraft says, “In a full stall landing, the flare or round-out should be made with power off.” There are exceptions of course (as with the soft-field landing instructions), but it doesn’t look like power should always be needed to keep the tail low enough for a three-point landing.
So, in real life, I pull power out as I cross the numbers in Piper low wing and Cessna High Wing tricycle landing aircraft at about 10 to 20 ft off the ground. Obviously, the plane is gliding at that point, and will slow down as I transition those last few feet and I’ll be very close to stalling as I land. I don’t have my tail dragger rating, so I can’t definitively talk about 3 point landings from real life experience.
But as a pilot and engineer, I know the methodology @FusionHorse151 suggested is exactly what’s needed to understand how to fly the Super Decathlon in the sim. There may be some differences between real life and the sim depending on how well it’s modeled. Sometimes authors have to make compromises in one area to make other areas work better.
So, if anyone wants to land the plane without bouncing, I recommend following @FusionHorse151’s advice. Learn how to fly the plane in the sim. There are videos that show Super Decathlon’s landing in a 3 point stance, so it can be done in real life. But real life and the sim can be different. I didn’t get a chance to try it yesterday. Sorry. But I can say I can repeatedly land the Carenado C170 in the sim without bouncing, and lots of people say they can’t. I don’t know why, other than all the reasons I’ve given here.
I only said it’s not strange if some power is required to maintain a 3 point stance when flying. The whole point of landing is to stop flying, so it makes sense to pull power out at the point of landing just before you go into landing the plane, which requires the pilot to (almost) stall the plane. If you maintain lift over the wings, you’re going to keep flying (bounce).
It’s a balance of forces things, and you need to be precise about it to be precise in your flying operations.
I flew the Decathlon for the first time at the end of last Friday’s stream. I couldn’t reliably get it to spin, either. It just mushed into a stall, no matter how much pro-spin input I gave it.
My first landing was a PO180 (why I do that to myself, I don’t know) and I couldn’t hold the nose off through the flare, so I ended up bouncing onto the mains. But that’s part and parcel of dragging in a new aircraft poorly, getting too slow and stalling it during the roundout.
The second landing I managed a three-point. It was kind of bouncy because as soon as I got to three-point attitude, I got the stall warning and it fell again. Maybe I was a little high in the flare (I need more practice gauging my height in this plane), but I don’t remember it being so touchy in real life. That said, it’s been a couple decades since I’ve flown one.
But the stall behavior almost reminds me of the Bronco as to how fast the stall break occurs - almost immediately after you get the warning (but without the Bronco’s violent wing drop). I think it’s a bit too overpronounced, especially considering ground effect.
I can’t throw money at anything just now - too much going on - but as soon as possible I’m going to pick this airplane up and see what the deal is.
I loved the RealAir Scout and Citabria back in FSX and this Champion has been on my buy list since it was announced.
As @FlyingsCool5650 has said, some flight modeling aspects are not quite right in MSFS - either on the sim side or the developer side - due to their complexity. Everyone is trying to do their best but as we all have seen, it ain’t easy to nail - and given all the other layers of expertise required to develop top quality aircraft for this simulator, sometimes we just have to be willing to compromise or be patient until things get sorted out.
In terms of achieving a simple spin, it’s all about finding that balance between airspeed and angle of attack. If you’re struggling to initiate a proper spin, make sure you’re entering the stall with enough speed to create an aerodynamic imbalance. Once you feel the stall, apply full rudder in the desired spin direction and keep the ailerons neutral. Don’t be afraid to push the limits—you’ll feel the plane naturally start to rotate. Timing is key here, and it’s all about refining your control inputs to make it as smooth as possible.
Remember, spins can be tricky, especially depending on your entry technique and the conditions you’re flying in. Start slow, experiment, and build confidence with each attempt. Once you master the entry and recovery, it’ll feel second nature.
I can promise that with enough practice, you’ll get it just right—Charlie Morris did on his Xbox in testing the plane. Who is Charlie Morris? You can see him here performing in his Super Decathlon - https://www.youtube-nocookie.com/embed/ysewR5erlEQ
With Charlie’s input and the testing we’ve done, I’m confident that the current flight model for the Super Decathlon is incredibly close to the real-world experience. The team didn’t cut any corners, and Charlie’s real-world feedback—going up in his plane and comparing it directly to the sim—has been instrumental in fine-tuning those last details. We’ve made sure it behaves as accurately as possible within the constraints of MSFS 2020’s current physics engine. It’s not just about making the plane look and feel right but ensuring the performance and handling are authentic down to the last detail.
As for the future, I’m really excited about the improvements coming with MSFS 2024. The advancements in aerodynamics that Jorg and the team at Asobo have teased will push this flight model even further. Right now, we’re sitting at around 70-80% of what the Super Decathlon can truly be, but with the upcoming updates, I believe we’ll surpass 90%—getting closer and closer to true-to-life flight physics.
That’s what’s so exciting about this plane—it’s not a static experience. With continued testing, feedback, and improvements, I’m going to keep refining it so that it evolves alongside the simulator itself. This means you’ll not only get a fantastic experience now but an even better one as MSFS continues to grow.
In the meantime, I recommend spending time mastering its unique handling. The Super Decathlon is responsive and requires a level of precision that’ll make you a better pilot in the sim. It’s a rewarding aircraft if you’re willing to adapt to it, and I’m confident you’ll appreciate how it handles compared to what you’ve flown before. And of course, I’ll be continuing to listen to feedback and make adjustments where needed.
Right here is what we meant in saying that compromises need to be made, by authors and users. No disrespect was intended, and it’s totally understood that it’s impossible to get things perfect. Not nearly impossible, impossible. I know you put your heart into this and made it as perfect as you could with the tools you had, and totally appreciate it. I haven’t had a chance to fly it yet, but am looking forward to doing that.
All users need to appreciate how hard creating a simulation of reality is, and need to set their expectations accordingly. And, yes, exactly what you said: Flying requires precision, whether in the real plane or in the sim. It takes time to learn that precision, and effort in understanding what will get you there. There’s lots of dead pilots out there, low hour and extremely high hour. The nice thing about simming is we don’t have to worry about that.
Of course, on the flip side, it’s super easy to lose an appreciation for maintaining vigilance. I realized when I got back into flying after a 20 year break, that when I practiced in the sim, it was wayyyy too easy to skip steps, and if I wasn’t careful, that could translate to my real life flying. So I’m super vigilant in the sim to do every… single… step. Every one.
In this case, @FusionHorse151’s methodology will help understand how to fly this plane with precision at this point in time. With that, you can learn how to fly the plane now, and can give feedback to @B4Gunner to help him improve the plane to help make it better, if it even needs that.
As I write this version 1.0.1 is now available in my store and will be ingested this week for Official Marketplace both Xbox and PC
Version 1.0.1 Release Notes:
Adjusted Flight model (Specifically for landings)
Fixed G-meter in Analog
Removed Min/Max/Reset in Analog(Will replace at a later date)
Fixed Alternator charge rate
Fixed Registration Brightness & Size
Fixed Fuel code in GNS430 & GTN650(Variants)
Two New Liveries - 1. Orange & 2. Smitty
Added smoke annunciator light - all 3 variants
Thanks for the tips, i’m ready for another 2-hours session ! I really appreciate your genuine positive attitude and passion, this plane is a joy to fly.
) .
