Hi folks. I seriously thinking of transition from the Xbox to PC with flight sim. I just purchased the VelocityOne and it’s been an absolute game-changer. Now that I’ve experienced having a peripheral with the game… I want more panels and levers to interact with.
I would like to know if I should go all-in with Logitech or should I stick with Turtle Beach and still get the Logitech panels?
My motivation behind Logitech is the stackability of the panels. It looks like it’ll be a clean setup. Here’s what I’m thinking:
Scenario 1: $779
- Velocity One Flight, $380
- Flight Switch Panel, $99
- Flight Multi Panel, $150
- Flight Radio Panel, $150
Scenario 2: Full Logitech, $739
- Flight Yoke System + Flight Rudder Pedals, $340
- Flight Switch Panel, $99
- Flight Multi Panel, $150
- Flight Radio Panel, $150
Unless money is a big concern, I wonder if you wouldn’t kick yourself later on for not going with Honeycomb for the yoke and throttle quadrant. Then the Logitech radio stuff on top of that.
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You can get Logitech cheap using Amazon Warehouse if your prepared to track and wait a little.
I still have my “Logitech” Yoke and Pedals I bought back when they were Saitek brand. I can’t even remember how long ago that was. 12 years? 15?? They still work great and I haven’t found a situation yet where I can’t use them for some plane or another in the sim
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If I were building a civilian flight sim set now (and since I fly with a stick I occasionally ponder it) I´d probably get the new Thrustmaster Yoke (cheapest yoke on contactless sensors AFAIK), this throttle/panel combo from VKB ( GNX Dual THQ + SEM + FSM-GA Combo – VKBcontrollers.com) and a set of pedals with contactless sensors from MFG, Virpil or VKB. Price would be somewhere around $1000-1100.
Note that if you don´t have headtracking or use a VR set, neither the Logitech or Honeycomb yoke has a ministick for view panning.
The more research I’m doing I wonder if my perspective is a little off. I like the VelocityOne because of the 2 8-hat and 2 4-hat switches. I feel like I get good viewing options. The 180 deg turning is pretty nice too, but its been demonstrated that the single-prop planes really aren’t turning that sharply. I guess the other panels would replace some of the switches I’m using with the VelocityOne.
Going full Logitech gives me a yoke with less features, but I wonder if looking around the airplane is even a big deal? Do most people that have hardware looking around or do they tend to use the default view screen?
I actually though Turtle Beach yoke had axis based ministick somewhere since it´s an XBox controller. I prefer those to view panning in MFSF instead of 8 way hats with preset views (I use the hats as 4 way buttons instead). I have a ministick bound to view panning on both my joystick and throttle and use the one which gives me least controller bleed at the moment. I also have some head movements bound as well. I make a habit of looking around a lot since MSFS is a pretty looking piece of software and it would be a waste not to.
If you’re going to a PC, don’t worry about Hat switches for views. Get yourself a head tracker and be done with it.
TrackIR is fantastic, I’ve heard good things about Tobii.
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Just got the Velocity One myself today and while I have a great inexpensive IR head tracker (the Grass Monkey Simulations Puck), I quite like the default hat switch on the Velocity One that does a “slow pan” look-around as opposed to a simple left/toggle type setup. Since it’s mimicking an Xbox analog stick look-around with the camera, it’s more natural feeling than a toggle. Even with a head tracker, every airplane cockpit is a little different and unless you’re going to go with custom calibration curves for each plane on your tracker, and switch between them for every plane, it’s always nice if you turn your head or lean around to see something, to have an easy way to “nudge” that view a little bit one way or the other to get a better look.
And if you won’t want to use the hat switches for camera controls at all, you can always remap those controls instead. More switches are always better than fewer! That goes double for controller axes. The more you have, the more you will find yourself using.
So, if I was in your shoes (and I sort of am), just add the additional panels. After a new desk, my next piece of sim gear is going to be a radio panel, followed by a switch panel. I might actually build those myself using Arduinos and mount them in a 3D printed housing or even a simple project box. The hardware is dead simple and there HAS to be some open-source Arduino libraries for Simconnect to use with them.
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I don’t want to put a downer on your obvious enthusiasm. I like that you are excited about the possibilities because you should be but IMHO I wouldn’t waste money on any of that stuff. It’s all over priced for what it is. I like many fell into the Saitek yoke trap many years ago but there are much better options now. The TB not being one of them. If you are willing to spend the sorts of sums you indicated then my advice would be quality, over quantity and add to it bit by bit as the funds allow. I personally have a Fulcrum one yoke which is such high quality and at a reasonable price too. The return you get from this thing is outstanding. I took a similar approach with pedals too. No point buying a load of gear early on and wishing you had waited a while. I get the excitement factor though.
My 2 cents.
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I have to admit I did not know Fulcrum One existed. One of the side effects of the quality flight controller market having become dominated by boutique brands that generally only sell on their own store. That does look like it might be the sweet spot for yokes at the moment, rather akin to what VKB Gladiator is to joysticks (though it looks comparatively a more premium product).
Best bang for your buck…
Honeycomb Alpha yoke
Honeycomb Bravo throttle quadrant
Logitech radio panel
Logitech multi panel
Logitech rudder pedals
Enjoy the virtual skies
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If you got the $$$ and you are a hardcore then go for it
scenario 3 Thrustmaster Boeing Yoke Honeycomb throttle quadrant and logitech radio panel. plus logitech multi panel sells new for less than 100 euro in my town
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Indeed. But with all of those premium brands you get what you pay for. Like I originally said quality over quantity all day for me. There is no reason these days to use cheap mainly plastic controllers that use pots. We’ve past that now and it’s waiting for the majority to see the light. Contactless sensing should be the standard now.
For everyone’s information.
Saitek, CH, Honeycomb and the TQ part of the Turtle Beach all use pots as their sensing elements. The Fulcrum, Thrustmaster, VKB, Virpil products use Hall effect (contactless) sensing elements.
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Can I get a lamens definition of contactless vs pots sensing? I tried looking it up and it doesn’t make sense to me.
That is in fact the reason I went with the VelocityOne after I tested out Honeycomb and Logitech yokes. If you rely on yoke buttons and hats for your view, it cant be beat. The V1 has a couple of other things going for it. It has some drawbacks too, mostly on the manufacturing side but life is a tradeoff.
I have the (most of) Scenario 1 with a few additions and I am super happy with it.
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Pots (potentiometers) wear in use and will invariably end up exhibiting spiking that renders the axis unusable without disassembly and repair. In some badly installed cases (notably the twist axis on Thrustmaster T16000) this can happen rapidly, in other cases (CH has probably best reputation for pots) they can go on for over a decade. Contactless sensors (not all are Hall effect) don´t exhibit such wear and also tend to be more precise in the sense they register more possible positions along their axis of movement.
Note that the boutique brands are also more likely to use mechanical switches for buttons than the mainstream manufacturers, who have shoved cheap buttons even on supposedly premium gear (this is the primary reason I´d go for the VKB panels over Logitech ones). And for primary flight control the mechanical design of the main axes matters a lot. When VKB released the Gladiator with the Kosmosima grip the real reason for it´s success was probably not that it used the same grip that is available on the much more expensive Gunfighter series (with fancy cam based design) but better gimbal design over TM Warthog.
What’s the extent that you tested the Honeycomb stuff before settling on V1? That’s my biggest fear, when the Honeycomb stuff drops for Xbox - that I’ll miss the excellent way V1 handles the camera and views. Looking at the single hat switch on the Alpha, I’ve justified that it’ll probably work okay since I don’t use the “quick views” much; just set it up as a camera pan, set up an exterior/cockpit view switch button, call it a day. Was it significantly worse?
I suspect the Thrustmaster yoke beats the Turtle Beach one for that simply because of the mini joystick for the right thumb (as opposed to 8 way hat). Presuming Thrustmaster didn´t botch the quality of the ministick (which would not be unprecedented). Beyond that the controllers are almost identical in the button arrangement.