Sorry, I considered your main concern as just not having the SID/STAR information provided by FS planning tool at hand while entering the route into the FMC. Therefore my suggestion to have it shown in LNM (instead of notepad or taking a screenshot/note).
But yes, you are right of course. When I used the integrated flight planning in FS, airways were never given and consequently not shown in LNM, either. It´s mostly waypoint to waypoint only. Not really convenient or realistic, but at least, you can get the plane ready.
You could use LNM for planning the entire route, but it will not assign SID/STAR automatically. Same for other web planners which are using more accurate AIRACs like Route Finder (used f.e. also in OnlineFlightPlanner) or FlightPlanDatabase.
You could also maybe generate a route in FS (or even in Simbrief with outdated AIRAC), load the plan into LNM and re-calculate the route using FS database. It should keep SID and STAR information as provided, adjust the route including airways and show all information in the plan overview to enter into the FMC.
Nevertheless, all of the above might not always work and even if, this workaround will only help for planes using the actual nav data in FS. A lot of payware planes are delivered with their own FMC without access to FS database and only including an outdated AIRAC different from the free simbrief version. Without a running Navigraph subscription, users will sooner or later need to manually adjust the plan like f.e. skipping an airway or a waypoint etc. ´
So yes, the dependency to Simbrief/Navigraph is (still) there despite up-to-date navdata being available in the base sim - and not only for comfort. And while I consider Navigraph a great product worth the money, I can understand the concerns.
Would be nice if Microsoft and Navigraph could come to an agreement, where the free database in Simbrief matches the current AIRAC pushed out in sim updates. Ultimately it is in all parties interest and benefit (end users included) to make them play nice to together.
I strongly suspect** that Navigraph pays Jeppesen and other companies for their charts, so that’s part of the cost for us who pay for a Navigraph subscription. Regardless, it takes a lot of work to maintain charts, software, websites, support, etc.
Can confirm, Navigraph uses Jeppesen as its provider.
This is part of the problem. Simbrief and Navigraph are not MSFS partners. MSFS for some reason (I suspect being made by a French studio) went with Airbus’ product instead which is Navblue. The gotcha is that Navblue isn’t that detailed for anything but airliner operations. Jeppesen on the other hand covers all levels and has all of the details needed to provide quality charts.
So since the data is slightly different, even if Simbrief magically matched the FS airac - it’d still have discrepancies at times (though they’d be rarer).
Simbrief really is not the solution to the problem of the A310 - the solution is to report it as a bug that you can’t import the MSFS flight plan. Simbrief is a solution for people who want to go beyond vanilla in at least some capacity. And yes, the moment you leave the confines of vanilla you start seeing price tags everywhere you go. It’s not ideal, but it’s the reality of what keeps these services even available. The fact that Simbrief is free at all is honestly pretty cool - it could just as easily require a Navigraph subscription.
You don’t need simbrief to import flight plan in A310. Little Navmap exports flight plans in inibuilds format. They should be saved in \AppData\Roaming\Microsoft Flight Simulator\Packages\microsoft-aircraft-a310-300\work\flightplans. When you enter departure and destination on INIT page, FMS will import all the waypoints from that file.
Little Navmap can use MSFS default navdata so the flight plan will match fixpoints and beacons that are available in MSFS.
This topic, like many others, reminds me that aviation is complex (both IRL and in sim) and pilots are problem solvers. While we flight simmers have many valid points of view as consumers of game content, we are also very much like pilots IRL who are constantly solving one problem or another. Those who do this for a living may argue that problem solving is mostly what they get paid for (that and saving fuel) and that those beautifully smooth and wonderfully delightful flight experiences that pilots live for are few and far between LOL! I loved my Jeppesen subscription (expensive!) back in the day I flew privately IRL, and getting that back in Navigraph is worth way more to me than the monthly fee, but I love charts and maps, so that’s almost another hobby! Anyway, great conversation here with many possible solutions to a messy bit of game programing. Thanks for sharing.
I let my annual navigraph subscription expire 2 days ago and unfortunately took an extended sim break last year so paid for many months of navigraph unused and just started back into simming.
My simbrief AIRAC is still at 2313 even after the sub expiring but I’m guessing it will stay stuck there. For now everything is in-sync with simbrief and I’m wondering if I can just keep everything frozen at AIRAC 2313 for a while without problems. If I run into simbrief sync issues in the future I figure I can either go for the nav-only sub or just occasionally resub to navigraph for a month to get everything up-to-date as needed.
Navigraph programs are fabulous but chartfox has a new UI that is is quite good and has worked well for me so far if you just need quick access to charts (depending on area you are flying) and can live without Jeppesen.
Well i just want to add my opinion. I never use SImbrief i looked at it once, hated it and never looked at it again infact i do get annoyed at the constant harking to it in updates and aircraft. I do my flight planning usually in Little navmap then import in, i also have a Navigraphs subscription which i use constantly even for VFR
LOL the first few times I looked at SimBrief, I had the same reaction. Then I started using Navigraph because I like to flight plan from a chart and choose my own route. When I got into the PMDG 737 I realized that there is something to SimBrief, but I started using it backwards: I plan my route in Navigraph, cut and paste the route text into SimBrief and go from there. This works for me because I have some familiarity with the US airspace, at least enough for a sim head, but it is less useful for ex-US where I have been letting SimBrief suggest routings and going from there. So much flexibility, so much fun!
You are missing the point. Of course there are 3rd party tools that can solve this, but the A310 is a default aircraft and therefore should be fully supported without the need for external tools.
I do find it annoying all official DLC planes don’t have world flight planner functionality.
I’m good at using the free simbrief function but I just honestly prefer using the world map planner if possible with vanilla planes. I’ll never pay a subscription for just an addon though.
The main point of the original post is paid subscription for navdata. I just pointed it’s not required. Importing flight plan to FMS saves you how much time? 2-3 minutes? Most of the data has to be entered manually whether you import flight plan or not.
Also reporting it as a bug is pointless. It’s a missing feature, not a bug. Software bug - Wikipedia
The main point of the original post is paid subscription for navdata. I just pointed it’s not required.
Close: the main point of my post is twofold.
1: There is currently no proper way to enter the FS flight plan into DLC airplane in game as the game does not show you the SID/STAR/Airways of the planned route (despite it being in the savegame file if you save the route, so it definitely does route using proper airways). There are options, but all of these options require you to use an external application just to access the route info you just made in game. It is non intuitive and frankly, bad design. Note I am talking about MSFS routes planned by the ingame planner here, not the Simbrief routes.
2. The only other way to enter the flight plan in game is by using Simbrief, of which the free version is getting increasingly more difficult to use due to the fact that the Simbrief database you get with the free version is dated march 2022. The current database in MSFS is december 2023. There have been quite a lot of changes in SIDs, STARs, airways and waypoints over the almost two years of time between the databases to the point where you have quite a lot of errors when simply loading a Simbrief flight plan into a DLC plane (A310 for instance).
The main issue here is the increasing reliance on a third party, non affiliated tool to plan routes in MSFS in its DLC content. Who is to say Simbrief will remain free? For all we know, Navigraph will keep the free version on 2203 and the routing will become worse and worse when the MSFS databases get newer and newer, or worse: they will stop offering the free version altogether. Then what? My take is that it is bad practice to rely on a third party tool to get a basic feature like route planning in any DLC aircraft in MSFS. The very least MSFS should offer is a simple window in game with the route using the standard airplane routing notation including departure runway, SID, airways or DCT, STAR and arrival runway. This way, if you are unable or unwilling to use Simbrief, you can simply enter the route manually using the ingame window.
I like the simplicity of ChartFox, the ability to zoom easily and plan my own route (which I might copy from yet-another planner).
One could argue that entering and modifying the route in the G1000/MCDU/CDU is a skill that every pilot must develop.
I’ve heard a few real airline pilots say we don’t like to rely on preset routes - there can be hidden problems. ATC will change departure and arrival in real time anyway.