Will this sim be relevant for PPL training?

Hey there folks I will be starting my PPL ground class at my college in January and I am looking for some sound advice specifically from real world pilots. I did take some elective Aviation courses on the side my first semester and there is a lot of stuff I learnt concerning Weather and Regulations you won’t learn in the sim.
Is there anyway the sim is relevant for training moving forward?

No. It is not an approved flight training device, so officially its meaningless.

However there is a lot you can learn and practice within it. It is just that it will not count in any official way.

Dang it, I missed an opportunity to say…

“Thats a negative, Ghostrider…”

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Good to know so maybe it maybe handy covering basics procedures? But likely not a good idea to practice maneuvers.

In detail, its great for practicing various navigation, and procedures, a lot of the flight physics are reasonable enough… You can work on pattern work, Instrument navigation… Lots of it is good for your personal enhancement… But it is not loggable.

Just remember that you’re augmenting what you learn from your CFI, not the other way around. There is nothing wrong with practicing what you are taught. Just be careful that you don’t try to apply things you worked out on your own to your real world flying.

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Thank you! I know quite a number of flight students who use this sim but they goof around with it. Looks like I will have to undo many habits!
The aircraft used at the school are glass cockpit Piper Arrows for IFR, the Warrior and Archer TX model for VFR.
I do own the JF Arrow.

Its a mix. When I started flying was around flight sim 5. I had been using it (earlier versions) for years.

The only bad habit my CFI had to thump out of me was that I would fixate on gauges… Which is not how VFR is done. In VFR you’re doing everything out the window and pretty much the only things on the dash you care about are the airspeed, altimeter and tach. (someone will come along and point out some other thing, but thats not in the spirit of what I’m getting at so don’t worry about it).

He was impressed with my basic understanding of a lot of things. But I did get my hand slapped in a few areas. Over all I think it decreased my training time.

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That’s encouraging.I will admit I’m a bit nervous but I will give Microsoft some credit.
If it wasn’t for the sim I would not have taken up flying seriously.

There is a Delta propel program at the school Most students are heading to the Airline route.
Some already came into the program with their PPL.

I have not made a decision yet when I’m done.
I have been weighing in on the Air National Guard pilot slot which needs the 4 year degree.

I never had any intention of going after a real job, I learned to fly because I just wanted to. I thought about going toward CFI, but ultimately decided not to.

Good Luck! If nothing else, primary training is a lot of fun and very rewarding. Nothing tops that first solo, it’s one of those remember every detail forever kind of moments.

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Right now no, however i can defiantly see it getting to that level once they get all the kinks worked out. i have flown alot of different Flight sims including actual simulators for Air Force ops.
And honestly they are not to far from being on track. especially with the direction they are going with the live Metar weather and hopefully live Air traffic.

IMHO: the Sim is not ready for primetime with regard to IFR training.

You mentioned a Warrior and an Archer for real life training; if you already own the Just Flight Arrow I believe you’re entitled to a discount for the Warrior. That would be money well-spent. It is - again IMHO - the best GA aircraft currently available in MSFS.

I have several hundred hours in two different Warriors over the years, and I’d say the flight dynamics of the Just Flight model are very good, if not excellent. You could practice pattern work in the sim and get a decent “feel” for the real thing.

Two things I would highly suggest as a course of study that will serve you well no matter what you chose to do when you graduate:

  1. Learn everything you can about meteorology. Knowing how to interpret METREPS prior to flight, and how to “read the clouds” once airborne, can save your life. It can also serve you well for planning long-distance cross country flights with regards to head and tail winds for best altitude and routing.
  2. Learn manual flight planning, with paper charts, aviation protractor/plotter, and an E6B flight computer. GPS and glass panels are great, but knowing how to navigate in VFR conditions by dead reckoning, if nothing else, is supremely satisfying. Plus, you’ll never be intimated climbing into an older aircraft equipped with steam gauges! :slight_smile:

Good luck with your training, and have fun!

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I’m late to the conversation, but I wanted to give my perspective.

I passed my checkride a few months ago. I got into the world of aviation at a young age through flight simulators (began with FSX, then P3D, then X-Plane 11).

The simulators are invaluable learning tools whether or not they are “official.” I became proficient at ATC communications before ever stepping foot in an airplane. Took the radios my first flight up. This is all because I joined the VATSIM community and began flying virtually in a network with other sim pilots whose goal was to make the simulator experience as real as possible.

I also knew my way around a Cessna 172; I knew where the ignition, throttle, mixture, fuel shutoff, light switches, etc. all were, and I came in with a general understanding of when and where to use them having followed checklists on the sim. I also had a strong knowledge of some aviation rules that came out of my sim networking experience.

And in addition to that, while I don’t hold an instrument rating, each instructor I’ve flown with has been greatly impressed by my instrument flight abilities (maintaining a heading / altitude, turns, slow flight, climbs and descents, all while under the hood / foggles), which have come purely from my simulator experience.

The sim isn’t everything, but it’s a huge introduction into the world of aviation and there is a lot to be learned from it.

Long story short, the sim is a great introduction to aviation and can help you learn so much before you even start training. Don’t trust that everything you encounter in the sim is exactly the same in real life, but things are pretty close - especially if you fly the airplanes by the book and use VATSIM or PilotEdge.

@PablodNinja ’s response sums it up pretty nicely. Listen to your CFI, and only use the sim to augment training.

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Ridiculous POV in my opinion. Even with quirks and bugs, the sim is an invaluable tool. Obviously people aren’t going to train in the sim and expect things to be exactly the same in real life. The best thing the sim can do is broaden knowledge about aircraft operation and aviation rules. As someone who was able to excel in my flight training as a result of simulator experience (primarily FSX, which is incredibly unrealistic in some respects), I find it comical whenever someone acts like this sim is a horrible learning tool just because of minor bugs relating to altitude / systems inconsistencies.

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What’s wrong with the navigation instruments? From what i read about radionavigation etc. it is working as in real life.

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Agreed, maybe use it as a procedure trainer. Don’t use it for anything flying related, it only causes bad habits. As soon as you know how to fly a plane and move on to instrument flying, its good to practice interceptions and holdings maybe in the sim, but be aware that radio navigation is a bit flawed here and there.

And the RMI / bearing pointers point towards localizer antenna just as in real life, oh wait…

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Dial in an ILS and look at what your RMI does.

Rules? In MSFS? What might that possibly be? Hardly any flightsimmer knows what an echo airspace is, let alone an RMZ or TMZ. ED-R? Pfff. And that‘s just a tiny example.

A cockpit layout is a matter of 2 hours. And nobody learns muscle memory at the PC!!

Trim in flightsim is fundamentally wrong (for the lack of alternatives), again, muscle memory.

I‘ve never seen a flightsim that provided me with the possibility to correctly slip a Katana down when I was too high.

Flying in the sim is Eye-Hand-Coordination. In reality it‘s asscheeks-everything coordination.

I agree with one thing: it‘s easier to understand many things when you‘re used to a good simulator. For example P3D with A2A aircraft. But it‘s never a tool to learn to fly. You‘ll have to relearn it again and that‘s harder than doing it without any biases. Of course everyone who starts flightschool after years of simming has to go that way, but don‘t make the mistake and practise at home what you learned from your instructor.

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These are things that I learned through my time as a sim pilot - especially after meeting people on networks and flying on VATSIM. Most do not learn these things because they use the sim for entertainment. Those who are starting training will be looking for realism, and they will ask questions about airspace.

It absolutely is useful - I’m back into my PPL training in the UK in the Piper PA28 and if you have a high fidelity equivalent in the sim you can certainly fly to regulations and practise drills, checklist items and flows.

With good scenery too you can practise flying circuit patterns and your cross country navigation too - all easily possible inside MSFS.

The main thing it won’t give you, is the physical FEEL of the aircraft but it is certainly a gateway and a step up! Just be sure to not get into any bad habits.

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That‘s a good thing you did for sure. I personally was lucky enough to take flight lesson first and - funny enough - never really cared in the sim. I‘m not IFR rated and I need to go by landmarks if I don‘t wanna run into an ED-R or C airspace, which was/is hardly possible in P3D. So I pretented to be the king and did what I wanted. But the world has become easier with moving maps anyway :smiley:

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