Or should we let the mods decide?,seems fairer to me.
I think if you consider that this beta format is ultimately what you will be simming on shortly, they are both very much related so should remain. My view.
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The issue I have is someone posts a screenshot and I don’t know if I’m looking at the beta or I’m looking at live. We are asked to make sense of the latest beta build for a potential regression on the LOD issue. Posting a screenshot of the live version is clearly going to show issues.
If people want to muddy the waters then, at the very least, state what version of the sim you are using.
@moderators Why do we have have two separate categories for live and beta in the forum if we are just going to use them interchangeably?
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Is the beta thread the one about increased CTD’s with LOD fix? I’m having a hard time keeping the threads straight. If so, then there’s an argument that the LOD discussion should stay with this thread since the beta is the fix for the problem, and since the other thread is ostensibly about CTD’s.
Anyway, that’s my justification for posting here instead of over there.
I think there are at least three things happening here:
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The original “LOD problem” from SU 11 which I call the “PS2 scenery problem”. That is, there was a small circle around your plane beyond which everything was mush. 3D assets didn’t load in, and the textures that did load in were extremely low resolution. This was the problem I think this thread was originally about. And this problem was fixed from the first AAU beta all the way to today and remains fixed (or near enough that it’s hard to notice).
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The “fuzzy runway problem”. This is the one where if you go up in altitude a little bit, runways and other things on the ground become fuzzy. The difference between this and the first problem is, it doesn’t have to do with a circle around your plane or drone. It has to do with all ground scenery including directly under your plane or drone. It is universal and has been here since at least the beginning of the current beta, probably before (but I didn’t notice during SU11 because the other problem was so much worse). This problem was NOT present in SU10. I don’t think there’s been a claim made that this problem is a bug. It may be a deliberate reduction in quality, or a different problem. If it was part of the same bug that caused the PS2 scenery problem, it was not fixed by the beta.
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The “regression”. Recently there’s some claims that the latest beta build has regressed to SU11 levels. Some people are adamant it has, others that it hasn’t. I think the discrepancy here is that the ones who say it hasn’t regressed are talking about the PS2 scenery problem, while the ones who are sure that it has are talking about the fuzzy runway problem. This would explain why everyone is so sure of their position.
My personal opinion on the fuzzy runway problem is that it is bad. It is also worse than it was in SU10. But I think it’s been bad for as long as the beta has been active and that it’s not any worse now. It may easily be as bad as it was in SU11, but my point is it has not improved since SU11. In none of the builds has the ground texture not been fuzzy at 3,000 feet, in all of them it has been a regression from SU10.
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PC visuals are not relevant to this thread, and the idea that visuals were purposely downgraded to “release it on Xbox” is unfounded.
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Bottom line is……. This sim has looked and performed fantastically on console and that’s what we expect again. It’s just so puzzling these issues.
Lot of time and money invested in this hobby of mine! Feel a bit passionate about it.
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I don’t agree with this, sorry. Ok, it may looked good, but performance wise it was terrible. For example, don’t you remember the insane stuttering when in cockpit view panning the camera? It was absolutely terrible and barely playable. And not to mention the endless CTD’s. Now it looks fantastic and performs equally.
No, in my opinion we came from very, very far on Xbox. The team did a tremendous job for the people on Xbox.
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Let me say again where is problem:
0 - 3000 ft - everything is great when it comes to textures quality
3050 - 5000 ft - textures looks blurry, it reminds me textures quality in SU11 public
5000 + ft - there is no problem or it is very hard to notice.
It’s not new bug, it was there in beta(december) but i guees many people fly at 6000 ft + and it’s very hard to notice.
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I agree this thread is very messy. I will keep beta talk where it belongs.
The common topic in this thread is a single bug. I agree that it’s a bit messy, but I don’t think we should segment the support for this topic by dividing it between versions. After all, I’m very confident that it’s the exact same issue in either case.
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This is gonna be a long one, but I hope you’ll read it because I’m going to try to end all of the confusion regarding the existence and cause of this bug. After a short preface, I’ll get right into the guide on how to reproduce the issue. I’ll also end on my conclusion, along with some supportive arguments to back it up.
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My motivation in writing this is the multitude of users who insist that everything still looks fine without trying to reproduce the issue (or rather, failing to properly reproduce the issue). Showing a screenshot from 30,000ft and saying “everything looks fine” is useless with regards to this issue. Showing a screenshot of nearby skyscrapers that block out the terribly blurry roads below is also irrelevant, nearly going out of its way to avoid reproducing the issue. Some people don’t notice this issue while flying like others do, and that’s fine, but it’s nonsensical to write off this bug if you’ve hardly made an attempt to reproduce it.
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So how do you reproduce it?
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Using the drone camera, find a spot that is at least moderately dense with houses/short buildings. Short buildings are best so that you can see the roads and satellite imagery below. For obvious reasons, make sure there’s daylight.
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With the drone camera near the ground (about 250ft) from the ground, make note of the high quality satellite imagery and objects. Specifically, I’d recommend keeping an eye on houses and road markings.
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Slowly ascend (pan the drone camera upwards), while looking down toward the ground. As you cross a threshold at about 1,000ft agl, you’ll notice a substantial drop in overall quality on the ground as the ground textures become blurry and buildings decrease in polygon count.
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Confirm that the change in quality is occurring at a consistent threshold distance from the ground. To do this, descend back below the threshold and notice that the higher quality immediately returns.
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Ascend with the drone camera again. You’ll cross a second threshold at a few thousand feet, at which point you’ll see quality absolutely plummet. Make note of the drastic decrease in object polygon count as well as the poor ground texture quality.
Optionally, you can repeat these steps over a runway to see how blurry runway markings become at just a few thousand feet.
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If you followed the steps above, I’d encourage you to contribute any findings to this thread; however, if you haven’t tried to reproduce the issue, it isn’t fair to conclude that this bug hasn’t returned just because you haven’t noticed it.
By recording and sharing videos/screenshots using the steps above, users like @Pazdzie22 and I have effectively proven that the LOD/mipmap thresholds are low again with this update. Whether or not anybody’s eyes are keen enough to pick it out while flying is irrelevant.
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That being said, what can we infer about the nature and cause of the issue?
The issue is unlikely to be occurring on the server-side; rather, it is likely caused by the same client-side frame time bug that was identified by the developers the first time we we were experiencing this visual downgrade. Several findings support this conclusion:
There is absolutely no problem seeing high quality visuals within a certain threshold distance from the ground. High quality textures/objects appear immediately when you’re within said threshold distance. Such behavior is perfectly consistent with the concepts of LOD and mipmapping, which occur on the client-side. Conversely, a server-side issue would likely cause the high quality textures/objects to be inaccessible completely, or would cause the downloading of higher quality textures/objects to be sluggish. Server-side issue symptoms are not consistent with the problems being reported.
Furthermore, we can confirm that the issue is behaviorally identical to the first instance of the bug in the frame time system. You can confirm the behavioral similarity by comparing the provided video demonstration from the SU11 beta with the recent video from the AAU beta. Recall that the developers confirmed that the original issue was caused by a bug in the frame time system which caused the sim to think it was running slower than it actually is, resulting in the sim reducing quality.
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I hope that all of the drivel regarding the existence of the graphical quality regression doesn’t obfuscate the important message to the developers: The frame time LOD bug is occurring in 1.30.12.0; simple as that. Hopefully it’ll be fixed again soon.
Thanks for coming to my TED talk. Sorry for the wordiness; I wanted to clearly drive my points home. Thanks to those contributing to this conversation, I hope you’re all doing well!
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Put simply, a Community Manager asked about this issue in the beta forum.
There is an active thread about this issue in the beta forum.
This thread is marked as Bug Logged because months ago, this bug was logged by devs. It is all but dead in their eyes now.
This isn’t the beta forum.
If we combine our posts in one thread it will be easier for devs to follow the discussion and diagnose.
Whatever issue we are now talking about has not yet been marked as Bug Logged in there.
We’re talking about it in the wrong place in here and it is stretching the conversation thin between two threads.
This is a good discussion and it is more likely to help if it moves to the right thread in the right forum.
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How did that post not get flagged.
Totally inappropriate.
FYI some folks own a PC and Xbox.
Please keep all Beta discussion in the Beta forums.
A reminder about the SOP in the Code of Conduct:
- The Skies are Open for All - Everyone is welcome to Microsoft Flight Simulator regardless of age, gender, race, sexuality, or creed.
- One World, One Community - No matter how you play – regardless of console, experience level, or reason – we are one community of aviation lovers.
- Follow Your Checklist - Adhere to the set of rules from each community space. Skipping a checklist item can ground a flight quickly.
- A Pilot is a Pilot - Treat everyone in the community with respect, and seek to have positive experiences with your fellow pilots.
- Your Cabin Crew is there for your safety - Respect all moderators as they are there to ensure everyone has a safe journey. Anyone who does not follow the Standard Operating Procedures will be asked to disembark the flight.
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I flew from LFUC to LFMK yesterday in the Freedom Fox and had no issues. Xbox Series X, Western Europe server.
Thanks for trying that. Strange, have replicated this tile loading issue a few times now.
I have a Vodafone Fibre internet connection full fibre 2 i think, so guaranteed 37 Mbps but up to 73
xbox series x here - yup broken again
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We are entering in the last week of juanary…I’d like hope that the fix is coming very soon but the last proofs in this thread aren’t positive.
Bad feelings about it 
As I already said, I’m pretty obsessive about these issues, and when you guys wrote about another downgrade in the Beta a few days ago I was worried. I played a lot in the past few evenings and I confirm: I don’t see any dramatical downgrade. I already noticed in the past weeks/months mountain/shores morphing and pop-ins, and they’re still there. Maybe it depends on the places you’re flying. Spain, with WU installed, still looks great. New Zealand is terrible, with a lot of LOD issues around Wellington. Mexico still great, and I love how the Sierra Madre and the volcanoes look.
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After a lot of testing in the beta forum because of those initial reports, graphics seem to be working as normal.
Still no official word as to when the official patch will release but January still seems likely to me considering the current state of the beta.
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