You don't need Spacedesk, we already have Spacedesk at home (or how I stopped worrying and learned to use two iPads at once)

Have you run into the dreaded ‘how do I use two iPads as extended displays’ problem, and struck out trying to use xDisplay and Duet etc. together in wired mode?

Not happy with the performance of wireless Splashtop/Spacedesk etc for the second tablet?

Splashtop and Spacedesk and etc–in wireless mode–are more or less just a virtual display (“indirect display” in Windows parlance) and VNC in a commercial wrapper, with all their extra cruft and its round-trip degrading performance (plus another hand in your pocket).

Have you already realized this, but struck out trying to create a virtual display in recent versions of Windows without having an open HDMI port and a physical dongle to trick windows into seeing a connected display? (Now that the ‘Detect’ dialog no longer permits creating a generic VGA display.)

No more. There are downloadable indirect display drivers, liked below, that don’t need a dongle. Using one of them together with a VNC server that supports serving a designated display only will let you present a virtual display of an arbitrary size, with no dongle, to as many tablets as your system and network will support (zooming in on different parts of the virtual screen on each; or, with more setup, multiple virtual displays specifically served to different tablets).

Here’s the commercial driver:

https://www.amyuni.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3030

and an open-source alternative:

which has a fork to read in settings from an options.txt here:

These posts (and the thread generally) explains how to use the drivers:

and here:

Basically, you need to create a couple batch files to add and remove the virtual displays.

You can then serve the virtual display – and only the virtual display – via TurboVNC by configuring it from a batch file like so:

tvnserver.exe -controlservice -sharedisplay *n*

where n is the display number of the virtual display as shown by ‘Identify’ in the Windows ‘Rearrange’ dialog. (This is also the number referenced by AirManager for moving a panel to that display.)

(There may be other VNC servers that will do this, but TurboVNC was the one I found first.)

If you then run a VNC viewer on your iPad (or other tablet, or secondary computer for that matter) and point it at your sim machine, you’ll get only that display. Performance should be better than Splashtop wireless, Spacedesk, etc.

For even better performance, that should be pretty close to a USB connection, put a wired Ethernet adapter on your tablet (presuming your sim machine has a wired connection). Or a hub with an ethernet port and power delivery, so you can charge while it’s in use.

You can also try enabling network tethering over USB – I haven’t experimented to see if that interferes with another tablet being connected via xDisplay, Duet, etc. But if you do this, remember that it will create a different subnet, so you’ll need to reconfigure the VNC server to be listening on the right interface, etc.

If you want to serve multiple virtual screens to separate tablets, instead of having one large virtual screen and zooming in on the panels, you’ll need to dig into the TurboVNC docs to figure out how to run multiple instances of the service on different ports and bind them to the different virtual displays.

On the tablet side, I have found that both TurboVNC’s viewer app (‘Ripple Viewer’) and RealVNC’s viewer app work fine (for iOS).

I run the PFD on the xDisplay connection, and the MFD on the wireless VNC connection. VNC’s latency over local wifi is much less noticeable on the MFD (and much improved over Spacedesk & etc).

Not sure which hand Spacedesk has in your pocket, but it has been free since release (and will be until it’s out of BETA, but there is no ETA).

Have been running Spacedesk for quite sometime to run 2 iPADS and a Tablet, absolutely 0 issues. And zero performance decreases. Those come with pop outs, whether you add them to an HDMI display or Spacedesk.

I was going to check this option out but you lost me at, here are the drivers, here are the batch files, etc…

I can easily make it work, that’s not the issue, Spacedesk does the job perfectly, without any extra setup, just run it.

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If you’re happy with Spacedesk then it definitely makes sense to stick with the packaged solution.

For whatever reason, it looks terrible and has tremendous latency on both my recent iPad Pro and my older iPad Air.

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Very odd, possibly interference / issues with your wifi?

I only mention this as we have a large user base (Air Manager) that use SpaceDesk and I haven’t seen any reports of this other than 1.

He changed ISP’s and issues went away.

I’ve linked this thread to our Discord so I’m sure others will check it out as well.

Interesting. I haven’t drilled down into what’s going on with Splashtop/Spacedesk – I just figured it was par for the course given that they’re mostly intended for productivity, sales and support screen sharing. I don’t have network issues running Teams and Zoom on these devices, or anything on my laptops, and I use Ubiquiti networking gear.

Either way, it’s good to know that you can still create virtual displays in Windows without a free port and a dongle. And it took me a while to work out, so I figured I’d leave some notes here.

An alternative should things go bad with other solutions but not very user friendly. Some struggle with just getting instrument popouts to work so this will likely be a no go for some. Good to know though.

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I agree with Sling. Most people aren’t very technically inclined. If for some reason SpaceDesk doesn’t work or someone is technically inclined, this sounds like a good solution. But otherwise, I wouldn’t recommend it to the average user.

Spacedesk is easy. Install a server on the computer, clients on tablet(s), and you’re good to go. A multi-step process that involves installing drivers and configuring multiple separate utilities downloaded from multiple Git repos is a bridge too far for most folks when a simple process already exists.

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I’m having issues with POPM and Spacedesk running two older iPads connected to WiFi. I was in my HJet yesterday, and on the ground without POPM or Spacedesk apps running I see 60 FPS. When I pop out a PFD and an MFD it drops to 20 FPS.

I’m going to investigate from the network side. I’ve got a fast fiber connection, and from the PC I see >350 Mb/s on speedtest.net on its WiFi 6 connection. I’ll run speedtest.net on the iPads.

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Common issues to lose FPS when you pop out, but that is allot.

Do you have VSYNC turned on? If so, turn it off and try again.

I thought that using POPM and Spacedesk relied on server/client communication?
If I have the Spacedesk server running on the PC, and a Spacedesk client on the iPad communicating with the server, then the only overhead should be network and server resources.

Way different than using the sim to pop out panels, isn’t it?

When I got POPM and Spacedesk, I had heard that there is very minimal perfomance loss.

I’ll try it will vSync off.

The issue is not SpaceDesk, the issue is a long known bug in the Sim that as soon as you pop out a panel, performance drops.

If you have VSYNC on, it’s worse.

From the Feedback Snapshot;

image

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I guess I was badly mistaken when I thought the performance hit was when you use R-Alt + L-Click to pop out panels to monitors connected to the GPU.

Does the same thing happen with Panel Builder 3, running on a separate networked computer? Not sure I want to go down that road, but if it’s the best option…

You don’t even have to have another monitor connected.

Just load up on your single monitor, and pop a panel out, you’ll see the FPS drop.

I run 8 screens, and with the Fenix A320 and PMDG 737 there are allot of pop outs. I get the hit, but it’s not as bad as it use to be, with VSYNC off it’s even less, and DX12 seems to handle it better.

OK, but am I wrong that POPM + Spacedesk should mitigate that problem?

Yes, you’re incorrect with that statement.

The issue is with the Sim, pop out, lose FPS, no third party tools like POPM or SpaceDesk alleviate that problem.

That’s quite a bug…

The sim code should be able to supply aircraft sim data to an internal server with almost no perfomance hit.

Well, I tried vSync off and DX12.
No change. 60 FPS without pop outs. 24 FPS with.
Failed experiment. Glad POPM and Spacedesk were free. :neutral_face:

It’s a well known issue among those that use pop outs and affects individual setups in different ways. Some users suffer minimal loss. A fix is touted (see the dev update slides) but this has been around for years now so I say that more in hope than expectation.

I had a similar issue with popouts and fps loss. I ended up using DDU in safe mode to fully remove and reinstall fresh video drivers which fixed my issue. It might not work for you but it’s something to consider if you haven’t tried it.

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Thanks. I am loathe to change nVidia drivers, because the only CTD problems I’ve ever had were due to a driver change. There was also one caused by a particular Reshade filter, but I figured that one out pretty quickly.

But I really want pop outs to work without crippling my FPS, so I’ll give it a shot.

Are you saying to DDU clean, then reinstall my existing driver version (536.67), or update to the most current version?

(I also realize I haven’t tried it with my trusty Bonanza - just the HJet. I’ll try that first. I know that aircraft behave very differently in this sim. Maybe it’s just the HJet having this problem.)

ETA: I was seeing 20-25 FPS with the HJet (clean community folder,) and I’m getting 45-50 FPS with the Bonanza (a bunch of addons in Community.)

Everything is very smooth, including camera switching. The latter seems better with sync on, and turning sync off didn’t improve my FPS at all.