I too, have been plagued by the latest performance issues. I feel the frustration in the community… I read it in every comment in regards to this latest update.
Now that being said and this is my own perspective, If you step back for a second and look at FS2020… it is an incredible piece of software! It is also incredibly complex with an equally incredible amount of variables at play. When I purchased FS2020 as I did FSX years ago, I came in with the realistic perspective that it was going to be a very, very rough cut diamond and that it is going to take about a year to a year and a half for it to become “polished.” We are seven months or so since it’s release and even in that short time, it’s made significant strides.
Just like FSX… FS2020 is going to be around for many, many years. The people at Asobo want more then anything for their project, that they have poured blood, sweat and tears into, to succeed. There are going to be times where it’s two steps forward and one step back, as in Sim Update 3… But ultimately it is going to be an amazing platform… (it already is,) It’s just going to take time… just like FSX… or any other complex piece of software.
It’s more a case of one step forward and two back. The sim is basically bricked for most people at the moment and for those that can fly, the LOD has suffered. What good came with the last update? I can’t think of anything.
They’ve demonstrated time and time again that their QA process is flawed. Which wouldn’t be so bad, except this software package forces updates on everyone without any option to roll back or defer an update.
There’s no way this release should have been released and pushed on everyone. They should roll everyone back immediately until they sort this issue out.
They need to rethink their QA process, and their release strategy. They need a beta period for each release, a roll-back option, or something. This is NOT working.
VR update was the big performance “killer” for me. Not killer as in getting 5-10 fps, but as in 30-40% lower framerates than prior to it.
Just prior to the VR update I was at 60-61 fps in the A320 in my standardized test; since then about 46 is my record, but it’s usually more like 40 on average.
Those aren’t framerates just taken at a glance, but averages of a fixed run (flown on autopilot, with identical conditions every time). They should be fairly repeatable, but they’re everything but.
I’ve even lost 10 fps from hitting alt+tab and going back, with no other apps in the background that used any resources.
That’s an overstatement, methinks. I think most people are experiencing the stutters and pauses that are causing a lot of frustration. But that doesn’t make anything realistically bricked or unplayable. Less enjoyable, definitely, but still usable. And Asobo’s reaction (or lack thereof) is based on that.
From all the bug reports and posts, it sounds like those of us with the unplayable frame rates are a subset of that group and a small minority by comparison. It’s no less valid by any means, but we’re a small minority compared to the bigger issue. And that doesn’t give me much hope our issue will be solved any time soon.
The communication aspect of this, at the very least, should be fine tuned. There should be a communication director that should be putting out DAILY communications about sim progress on the forums and social media.
My expectation when I purchase a piece of software is that it is complete and I am getting what I paid for, when I pay for it. Same as if I go to the store and buy a microwave, I expect it to work and not be broken.
This is the expectation that I’m held to when I produce software, professionally. And I can’t use “Well so-and-so old software was buggy when it came out…” as an excuse.
I can appreciate that there are some great things that MSFS has done. But that doesn’t excuse other things having been broken, or moreover the sloppy development and update work that’s been done since release.
Exactly this. I see so many people justifying the poor state of this sim by comparing it to a 12 year old program that was released on DVDs. If that’s the standard by which we are judging a product, it’s no wonder devs feel like it’s okay to released such an unfinished piece of software
This is an issue plaguing the gaming world at large. And typically, the call to release unfinished stuff comes from the financial suits at the publisher, not the devs nor the head of the dev team. No self-respecting programmer wants to release broken software or have their vision compromised. This is a labour of love for many of them, not just a paying gig. They want to put their best foot forward. They’re just not the ones calling the shots. And unfortunately, they’re the ones that ultimately take the brunt of the abuse when things go awry.
And as passionate as Jorg is about it, he doesn’t call the shots either. I’d be surprised if even his boss is the one that has the final say on things.
I wish that were the case TomZ85 but it’s just not. Look at the Windows OS as a case in point. The whole argument of software being complete is just not the world we live in. I agree with you that I wish that were the case but it’s not an expectation that holds up.
Windows works pretty well for me.
Just about all software I purchase and use personally or professionally tends to work pretty well. Anything from Lightroom to Matlab or Visual Studio or whatever else, to a high degree of robustness.
There will always be edge case scenarios and small bugs that creep in - this is unavoidable, and accepted as reality. Things that are hard to catch in core development. The “1%” case kinda stuff.
But that’s not what we’re up against here. We’ve have glaring issues that show up within minutes of firing up the application. That’s inexcusable.
Like I say, I’ve been a simulation and software developer professionally for ~14 years now. I get how it goes. And this is some of the sloppiest work I’ve seen. I hate to be that blunt about it, but it is what it is.
I’m glad you’re still using it… would you continue to use a word processor that skipped every other letter you typed or added a random space? That’s just frustrating, but still usable right?
Can you give me an example of another sim sw that has the entire world modeled?
I’ve got plenty of bug reports in to MS for VS
No, I’m not using it at the moment. I’m one of the ones seeing the dreadful single digit fps regardless of settings. I’m one of the "bricked’ ones. Unfortunately, we’re not part of the majority.
What I’m saying is that if you actually read a lot of this forum, it does seem that a lot, if not most people, are seeing performance issues. Some aren’t seeing any issues at all. But for those that are, that manifests itself in the form of stutters. I’ve even seen that in recent YouTube videos. That doesn’t make the game unplayable. It hampers the experience, there’s no doubt about that. But it doesn’t render it unplayable. Less enjoyable, for sure. But not unplayable unless you had borderline playable fps to start with.
Then there’s a subset of that who are seeing single digit frame rates that literally make it unplayable. Sure, it will run, but you can’t realistically fly a plane under those conditions.
And unfortunately, I’m not hopeful that Asobo will be addressing this small group, but rather only the overwhelming majority that have the stuttering issue. And I’m convinced these are 2 separate issues. One was introduced with the UK update (when they made changes to the rendering engine, and where the affected saw their first large fps drop), and another with SU3. The latter is where Asobo’s attention is, because it had more widespread effect.
The irony is that the world model tends to work pretty well; I’ve rarely had issues there.
And it’s irrelevant to the point at hand anyway. If you’re a developer and you agree to take on a project with a given size and scope, that’s on you to be able to deliver it. Plain and simple.
Scale doesn’t really matter either. If you have a big project you just divide it up into small chunks that can be developed and tested in isolation. The responsibility is still on the developer to adhere to that as good programming practice.
Nothing new, object-oriented programming and test-driven development have been around for ages. There is zero excuse for a release and QC process to be this poor.
The performance was far better when I purchased the Sim in September. Surely it can’t be that difficult to roll back. When ASOBO do eventually sort this out could we not have the option to opt out of updates if we are happy with the way the sim is running. It strikes me that the sim is being sold under false pretences, look at the requirements quoted .
Rolling back code can be as much or more trouble as not though.
For one, we don’t really have a stable release to roll back to. So you’re guaranteed to re-introduce old bugs while you’re trying to roll back on some new one. Bound to make some people happy but frustrate others. So that’s hard to see as a definite win.
Also less than ideal in trying to get good feedback from the userbase if you have people on split versions. You can get bug tickets and then it’s even more difficult to track down and reproduce in an older version that you may have already moved on from.
I could see once we get to a stable version of MSFS that’s mostly bug free, maybe it makes to have updates be optional. But for the moment I kinda feel like it may be best to trudge on.
Still needs to be emphasis on more QC though.
Just spent an hour round southern France, over cities, busy airports, and big clouds and rain, No Stutters.
Could it be that the areas affected are the ones that have had World Updates?
Has anyone else noticed that AI aircraft only appear/spawn about 3 or 4 miles away? in my sim I see no AI aircraft far away anymore since su3, I used to see landing lights a long way away which added to the realism, but now the AI just pops out of thin air about 4 miles away
I’m currently over the Canadian Maritimes on my way from Philly to Europe… haven’t seen any planes since leaving Boston area
Yeah there’s something amis somewhere, unless it’s within 3 or 4 miles I don’t think AI will appear