Blessed are the ones who dont get CTDs

And for every 500 posts of issues there are 10’s of thousands of MSFS simmers who have none. But you don’t hear about them, as they have nothing to complain about.

And for the 500 who do complain (here), how many just turn the sim off and do something else, thus being lost to the community forever? We don’t know and will never know.

INSTALL MSFS ON A SEPARATE DRIVE.

This makes zero sense and should not be a stipulation for any software. And yeah I’ve tried it, I have a separate game drive and it makes no difference.

The logical step is when you find someone (me) who has ZERO issues, simply duplicate what THEY are doing to see if it solves your issue.

So, what? Your precise combination of hardware and software? Dedicate a $2k+ machine to a single piece of software? swap[ out thousand dollar components until you find the hardware that Asobo, in their good graces, have permitted to work without whatever hardware, software or firmware conflicts that make this sim an utter nightmare, literally a waste of time for so many?

For the record:

Pyranees leg 9
Patagonia leg2 15 mins in
Portugal 5 mins after to

Cannot be resolved by the user. If a piece of software, either of it’s own accord or in concert with some other driver, .dll or whatever does this, there is NOTHING the user can do about it. They’re asking for non existent memory addresses!

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If you can’t solve your issues pal, don’t take it out on me, or anyone else who takes the time to offer their time and experience to help others!

If it was solely the software then EVERYONE who has MSFS would be dead in the water with CTD’s.

It’s quite evident you deserve none, so keep banging you head on your own, as it’s quite evident you lack any common sense.

I only see one keyboard warrior here.

My main system is basically identical spec to yours - and I’d like you to consider how you would feel, after that upgrade, if your system routinely returned this CTD’s and faults in Flight Sim 2020- and try as you might, following all advice, for several months nothing you did fixed it. How would you be left feeling, in particular when you are aggressively told that the fault lies with you, or your otherwise 100% stable reliable system? The error codes I receive are MSFS calling memory addresses that cannot exist… How is that within my agency to fix? It’s a coding error, plain and simple .As to what triggers this, only Asosbo are in a position to aggregate data on the hardware and software environments that cause conflicts, and address them. No one user can be expected to identify that in the near infinite combinations that exist in the world.

I’m saying it like it is: Don’t go blaming users, or hardware, for faulty software. Sorry you’re so Stockholm Syndrome’d by terrible software that you think any of this is normal! It’s not! The sim should handle minor errors better, and should not exhibit anything like the major errors that it does!

Please remember you are part of a community, even if to your mind others are not of the same ‘status’ that you perceive yourself. We have an equal right to enjoy this sim as you do. We’ve paid the same price for the software and hardware: and in most cases more time troubleshooting than peaceful flying. And I sincerely hope that the next update does not find the fault with your system… because you will enter our world of hurt if/when it does.

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That looks like a dodgy RAM bit but I’m often quite wrong.

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Passed Memtest 86 six passes, Faults occur with XMP on and off, zero ram instability in any other application/4 months use. I am a hardware tester by trade and manually OC RAM on other systems. Literally nothing else indicates RAM instability - I won’t tolerate anything even vaguely Sus on my main pc as I rely on it for work.

In my case the Application is calling memory addresses that cannot exist (literally ‘-1’) so it’s not getting corrupt RAM returns as it would with an unstable RAM environment. It’s a bit of code that hasn’t got it’s memory handling in order.

Suffice to say this isn’t the first round of CTD’s i’ve experiences in FS2020. I’ve been through a few cycles of it crashing, it being fixed/getting stable after a Sim update, getting back into it, then having it break again. They happen for so many asinine reasons and I’m just sick of it at this point.

AS I say I run and test multiple systems, so the constant feature for me is Flight Simulator. No other game, not even the really notoriously badly coded ones, exhibit this level of instability.

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AMD Ryzen 5900X , NVIDIA GeForce 3090 RTX , 32 GB RAM, 2 TB NVME.2 SSD for the sim, 1 kW PSU (Gold rated) , 2k monitor w/165 Hz refresh rate
Windows 11, latest drivers (for AMD chipset and GPU), latest BIOS version. In the sim I use DX11 for now (DX12 not ready/stable yet).
I’ve been simming since 2004. One thing that always remained constant with Microsoft’s flight sims (and P3D, as a direct successor) - the hardware (especially CPU) was usually heavily taxed and was brought to its limit. I still remember the slideshow I saw, when I launched FSX for the first time :slight_smile: Also, I used to waste a lot of time while constantly tinkering with config files.
I’ve also had problems on the competing platform, though most of them were because of my own greed, some of the settings I had used were just too much for the CPU/GPU to handle :grinning:

I’ve been lucky to participate in Alpha version testing of MSFS. Performance was sometimes dreadful (while the sim was being optimized for launch). Since the launch, I have had 3-4 CTD, at least 3 of them related to 3rd party content.
Sim update 9 degraded the performance a little bit for me. So, per advice in one of the forum posts, I’ve changed the value of HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\CurrentControlSet\Services\Ndu Start from 2 to 4 in the registry editor. Since then - performance became buttery smooth for me for most scenarios. I use TLOD of 180 to 400 (depending on the type of flight - VFR or IFR and region).
I do not use VR, as I personally do not believe that the experience is as fluid, as it could be in maybe 2 generations of VR Headsets from now. I also do not fly aerobatic aircraft or fighter jets, where VR could be more useful.
Most of my settings are on ULTRA (except motion blur which I detest, so its off, and also texture synthesis is on high and not ultra, it makes a difference in some large airports or heavy photogrammetry areas).

So, generally speaking, my sim is quite stable.

I did say I’m usually wrong

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I’m far from a technician or programmer but I came across this (righ-click and select “open in new window”) item on “Bleeping Computer”. It seems more users have encountered crashes due to memory errors. Microsoft offers a “fix” that could help with Memory leaks. Reading through your posts this might solve your problem.


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WeirdNeville.

You are the one who initiated this. It should have been your post being flagged but I digress.

You have some pretty flawed assumptions of who you think I am. And if I was in a position where I had your issues with you PC or Sim, I’m also well enough in a position to get to the bottom of it, and certainly not lash out at forum members who are trying to help. I have built, configured and diagnosed, more PCs since the late 90’s that I care to remember. And I have always managed to get to the bottom of PC and software related issues. The most difficult issue here, is that users who are seeking help on forums, cannot give the entire picture to the folks who are trying to help.

And all I did was try to help. I didn’t put the blame on anyone’s hardware or software. After all no one has any idea what you may or may have not installed on your computer, or how it was built. There could be 1 of 1000 different reasons why you are receiving this error. Did you even try researching this error by memory address? It points to either a physical memory fault, a page file/size fault, your flightsimultator.exe may be corrupt, or you have missing/corrupt dependency apps or files, which the sim needs in order to to run.

It may be something isolated to the Microsoft Store version of the sim. Initially, this is the version I bought, and I asked for a refund in less than 24hrs, after the install loop fiasco. I subsequently bought it from steam, and installed the sim in a custom folder. And YES there is a difference. The C:/program files folders have added permissions that can wreak havoc on certain apps and games.

What have YOU done so far, in order to attempt at any diagnosis? It may even be as simple as reseating a RAM module. Did you try this? Did you try running memtest86? Are you running your memory in any XMP modes provided on you MB’s bios? Did you try disabling XMP to see if the issue disappears? Have you updated your bios, and tried your XMP profiles again? Did you check your Mb’s list of supported memory manufacturers speeds and timings? Have you run your BIOS in its default configuration, and then the sim? Did you try running on a single stick of RAM, have you tested your RAM sticks one-at-a-time on a single channel? Have you done this on both A and B memory channels?

Have you tried creating an image of your drives, backing them up, reinstalling windows and the sim in a clean fresh state on another drive with an empty community folder? That alone will immediately tell you where you should be looking for faults, without doing absolutely anything else. You’ve spent all this money on your sim, what’s another $100 or less on an extra drive to test a clean install on? You can also get a month long trial version of Macrium reflect to back up your drives for free. You can also download your windows version for free- it does not have to be activated for testing purposes.

Heck, have you tried JUST running with an empty community folder alone?

As how widespread the issue is, we are all statistically dumb. We hear “everybody is having this issue or that issue” with the sim and automatically every other game or app on the planet is perfect and MSFS is the culprit. Go ahead. Search the internet for every AAA game title ever made. You WILL find a corresponding forum of outcries of issues upon issues for each one. That is the nature of an open hardware structure which is that of a PC. Content and app creators cannot possibly test their wares on literally every hardware combination there is- probably well into the tens or hundreds of thousands. Yes MSFS is flawed, and unstable and unoptimized. But so are other apps and games to varying degrees. But not for everyone. Your mileage will vary.

Personally, I’ve had MSFS running on five systems! Yes five! The oldest one is an Asus X79 sabertooth with an I7 4770k with 32Gb of DDR3 and a 1080 Strix. The next one is an Asus X99 Deluxe II with a Haswell I7 5960X overclocked to 4.7Ghz, 64Gb of quad channel DDR4, with an Nvidia Titan Xp. The third system was a Z390/ 9900K/2080ti. that system is now part my wife’s pc as I’ve upgraded to 2 Z690/DDR5/3080ti platforms, I’ve already mentioned one in my first post. Both identical- one is an itx build.

Yes I’ve tested all these, because I’m crazy that way. No freezes no CTD’s, only variances in performance throughout, due to the generational specs and differences of these PCs.

So, I don’t know- go try stuff I’ve mentioned earlier in this post and my first post, and try things other people have mentioned. At least report here what you HAVE tried, instead of biting my head off and, then flagging me for defending myself.

Mod note:
Suffering any CTD in MSFS can be an extremely frustrating experience!
I am continually impressed with how helpful the members of this forum can be with offering their suggestions on what might help in these sorts of situations. However, it is entirely possible that others will not agree with such suggestions. Such disagreements are fine. Even when we disagree, lets keep all forum posts respectful of each other and relevant to the subject matter at hand. Making posts personal benefits no one and can quickly derail a thread.
Often times it may be better to disregard posts/ comments that we don’t agree with. Let’s not derail this thread!
Thanks all!

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  1. I didn’t report or flag you. I manage a community of over 5 million PC enthusiasts, have been around the internet since it’s inception, and assure you my skin is significantly thicker than that.

  2. Notwithstanding the above: You were incredibly rude and have now edited your comment to remove that section.

  3. I was not biting your head off - at all. I was pointing out that there comes a point where once you’ve tried all the common solutions, when you know it’s not you, or your system, the fault is with the software. My ire here is directed at Asobo for continually failing to address game breaking problems.

I should not be wasting my time trouble shooting. You should not have to spend your time trying to help people. The sheer variety of posited solutions on offer is telling. I can copy my spreadsheet of A-B testing out into the forum but It’s just electrons being inconvenienced to no purpose. I have been troubleshooting this issue for 5 weeks now, built an entirely separate test system to try and isolate software that may cause the issues, and tried literally every suggested fix I can find including the ones suggested by Zendesk. Nothing works. I’m not doing anything more, I have better ways to spend my time. Zendesk have my logs and system information, they have the fault logs. I’m leaving the sim alone for a few months and seeing if the next Sim Update fixes it. That’s what’s worked in the past.

hat have YOU done so far, in order to attempt at any diagnosis? It may even be as simple as reseating a RAM module. Did you try this? Did you try running memtest86? Are you running your memory in any XMP modes provided on you MB’s bios? Did you try disabling XMP to see if the issue disappears? Have you updated your bios, and tried your XMP profiles again? Did you check your Mb’s list of supported memory manufacturers speeds and timings? Have you run your BIOS in its default configuration, and then the sim? Did you try running on a single stick of RAM, have you tested your RAM sticks one-at-a-time on a single channel? Have you done this on both A and B memory channels?

I am a hardware tester by trade. I’ve published significant amounts of information on memory overclocking. You can see that I have done the above in my post, above. Physical Memory issues are a very different thing to what is being experienced in this sim. They exhibit everywhere - logged WHEA errors, glitches, stutters, hangs, ultimately BSODs, pervasive system faults. My Memory is QVL approved, Memtest 86 tested, Tested XMP on and off, single stick tested, tested vs another kit and Iv’e even tested it on another Motherboard with another CPU: The problem persists. If it’s solely at fault with FS2020 - well, I suppose it’s not impossible but it would also be completely bizarre. As I said: The fault is the software asking for a memory address that cannot exist. It’s not getting a corrupted return, it’s just looking where there is no memory.

Heck, have you tried JUST running with an empty community folder alone?

Yes. I’ve tried that. I’ve reinstalled it entirely twice (on the main system, a multitude of times on various test rigs), run it completely vanilla anyway and I don’t use any third party mods and only have a couple of additional aircraft.

Have you tried creating an image of your drives, backing them up, reinstalling windows and the sim in a clean fresh state on another drive with an empty community folder? That alone will immediately tell you where you should be looking for faults, without doing absolutely anything else. You’ve spent all this money on your sim, what’s another $100 or less on an extra drive to test a clean install on? You can also get a month long trial version of Macrium reflect to back up your drives for free. You can also download your windows version for free- it does not have to be activated for testing purposes.

The one thing I haven’t done is reinstall windows - I’m not prepared to do that for my work system, which as I say is otherwise stable and configured how I want it. There’s no point installing from an image since that could include any problematic software, and the half day or so redoing from scratch is not worth it to me. I’ve got 10TB of SSD space, it’s not the cost that’s the issue. I’m not taking the PC that is my livelihood offline for the sake of a game. As I say, I’m very active in other regions of the PC world, I’m not blind to my options, but neither am I blind to the infinite time sink of trying to fix something that should not be my problem in the first place.

So, as far as I’m considered ,the sim is broken. It’s just a same we all spend time doing this, rather than enjoying it.

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Well, reading through all that, I now know exactly who I’m dealing with. And so does anyone else who reads it. Want me to count how many times you’ve contradicted yourself?

Yes I edited my post, because I was prompted to by the admins…who probably don’t manage 5 million people- I know hard to believe, right?

Also, you don’t HAVE to reinstall windows from an image. Yank your OS drive out, put it aside for safe keeping, reinstall windows on a new drive, just to test. You can ALWAYS put your original OS drive back, and it would be just like nothing ever happened. But since you manage 5 million PC enthusiasts, you already knew that, right? Can I quote you on that?

Anyway, Admins may flag this, you may flag it, And you may reply however you like. I’m finished with this, really…

Best of luck and kind regards.

I’m sorry I bothered. I have never insulted you, I don’t see how my reply warranted further snide insults.

No, I’m not swapping out the five SSD’s in my pc to try a fresh windows install (because you know what happens if you don’t do that, right?), to get a game working, when i need my pc configured as it is for my work.

Even if it was then stable, it would do no good for me, since I’d have to return it to how it is now anyway. There’s no ■■■■ on there, its all stuff I use daily for video production.

I need to know which specific driver, add-on, hardware, software package i have installed triggers this conflict and fault. Asosbo, to my knowledge, have not provided the tools to allow me to identify that since it doesn’t provide proper crash logs or error reporting.

Without that information I’m left scrabbling in the dark, like so many others, and getting insulted by people on a thread intended to offer help?

Yeah, nice.

The one thing i’ve long maintained Asosbo should add is proper crash telemetey back to their servers (opt in) so they can aggregate data and identify and address this kind of fault. Its in their commercial interest to do so, because people will drift away from the sim once intractable problems overwhelm it.

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Alright alright. Truce!

Would you mind telling us in detail, about your hardware?

https://pcpartpicker.com/b/wn3tt6

Is current build, plus a 2nd 2tb MX500 ssd.

That is a very nice machine!

Here is what I noticed. I have a strong feeling that your RAM is not supported by this mobo at these speeds. G.Skill Trident Z5 DDR5 6000.

See here:
https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/MPG-Z690-CARBON-WIFI/support#mem

According to MSI the maximum is 4800- likely an XMP profile.

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Nice catch on the RAM Viper883, only thing that leapt out at me as a wild card was the capture card.

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You never know Salem. Could be. I’d remove it and test as well. At least check the bios to see how much bandwidth it is sharing with the EVGA3080ti FTW3.

I’ve disabled it as a hardware profile and uninstalled drivers/software and it made no difference. It shares no bandwidth with the 3080Ti - it’s via Chipset on that slot, the GPU slot has 16 dedicated lanes to the CPU. I guess it’s no effort to fully pull it (at least when my collarbone is healed, I can’t hoik PC equipment about with ease right now). I did also consider the capture card as I’ve seen others have issues with the capture one codec/.dll which is why I disabled it in device manager and uninstalled the software - I mean, it shouldn’t have an impact, but if it does, it does.

The QVL is interesting - since I consulted it at time of RAM purchase and the specific kit was listed! Note they’re now showing 4 stick configurations only, which is bizarre and likely the reason for so few kits being listed and them being so slow. I’m well aware through the communities I manage of DDR5 being a bit of a pig at the outset, but it’s improved markedly. MSI’s QVLs suck, that list really doesn’t give you much of anything since they’re not making it clear the differences between 1,2 and 4 stick kits. 4 Sticks of DDR5, basically nothing runs at the moment.

Pangoly still shows the original QVL list and my RAM is listed

And it’s also shown compatible with the Motherboard on G.Skills QVL list

Despite the above; It’s stable. It’s stable through Memtest 86, it’s rock solid in 4 months use, literally no other stability issues, and I do know what unstable ram looks and feels like since I OC RAM for fun and profit. The sim exhibits the same fault with XMP enabled and disabled. Obviously it being a memory fault, memory is your first concern, but this is (I maintain) A code error (code not keeping track of it’s variables properly - see here and not a hardware memory fault which are WAY more evil, and impact every aspect of a PCs operation. If it is, somehow a hardware fault that only fs2020 picks up? Well, I guess there’s a first time for everything.

One of the sentiments I resent is that FS2020 is somehow ‘special’ and touches hardware that other software simply can’t reach. I mean, it’s true to a degree because it does appear to crash with far more hardware or software environment configurations than anything else. But that doesn’t mean the hardware’s the problem. The single common thread is the flight sim itself.

Ultimately: If it’s the audio codec on my motherboard (Or associated software), the NIC on the motherboard (Or associated software), some other component I, and the others experiencing this fault have (Or associated software), or just ‘something else’… Once you’ve done the list of quick known fixes, I don’t see this as my problem any more. There are other past-times out there. It’s an Asobo problem.

It may be an Asobo problem to fix, but it is still also a “problem” for the MSFS USER., who may not want to desert a sinking ship.

But at least the MSFS user has an option to fix the Problem : – switch to XP11 / XP12

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