Sticking with your doctor example: I fill out a form when I get to the emergency room stating what my issue is. Answering all questions on the standardized (!!) form. I get the idea. Initial picture of my state. But when I am being treated the docotr will subsequently ask specific questions knowing that I am not a doctor and may not know that this information is important.
Same here: I didn’t develop the Sim, I am an engineer, but not a software engineer. How would I know what to look for exactly?
And now comes the second part of your claim: the battery of questions is generic, trying to give an overall picture. THat’s it. And BTW: I provided the info they wanted, and the response was turn down the Rendering scale to 80.
That’s like your doctor saying: You broke your ankle? Well, try hand-standing
I thought that’s what I said, sorry for any confusion. Ah I reread your post, yes all issues ok that’s fair enough thank you for the clarification @Coppersens
No you are wrong, AI aircraft appearing/disappearing/spawning at about 4 miles out isn’t down to someone’s computer. it was working before the update, the frame rate limiter now doesnt work, like the a320 flap issue, they could see this on their computers before releasing the update.
My diagnosis…
“Over simplification as a result of frustration”
They have acknowledged there is a problem. They have not come up with a solution yet. Some people have been able to relieve the symptoms using a generic treatment.
The common cold exists. There is no cure. Aspirin and decongestant have helped many people reduce the symptoms and so is often recommended.
You provided the requested information. They confirmed you have a performance issue. They don’t have the answer yet and are researching it, using the information collected. In the meantime, some people found reducing the render scale helped restore some performance.
I congratulate you on providing the information requested. I, however, am not wrong, in this case. A very small percentage of people are even filling out the form at emergency. They are standing right here in the lobby. They yell. They rant. They say they want their money back. They usually won’t even accept assistance from the guy standing next to them that already found an answer and wants to share.
To paraphrase from an old programming manual…
“The developer helps those that first help themselves”
Hi @willisxdc. I believe that you missed some key information that already have been discussed and reported to ASOBO in many different ways:
They stated throught the Community manager that they are aware of the issue and will provide additional info to public (here) as soon as they have something useful
Within the statement there are linked specific threads on this forum, including these “bug” types that include voting. They already stated in the past that they take voting on these threads into account. I believe they read the content of these thread.
Many people (including me) filed a Zendesk issue that includes all known details (also described here on the forum)
That also include REPRODUCABLE info, I mean that many of us are experiencing massive stuttering at EXACT SAME geographical locations (including their boundaries, often in vicinity of specific airports). We already discussed it here, we reported it, we voted.
So I can’t imagine that they don’t aim at these specific issues. Just need some time to figure out what is the root cause, how and when they will be able to fix it and what exactly to tell us. That includes systematic pressure from us to them, who need answers ideally yesterday.
Believe me, even issue which looks clear, need some time and care. And they already asked us for patience.
It’s fair from them and errors happen, specifically in such as complex piece of software with all the variables as this ambitious Earth-wide flight simulation is.
Not sure why you are trying to discredit my statement.
I was originally answering to Sal’s post who said the info given by user’s is completely useless. And my answer was it is not the user’s task to give ‘useful’ information. Or is it?
I mean generic answers on generic questions don’t get anyone to the bottom of the problem. And if Asobo didn’t find the problem testing the Update, they will likely not be able to reproduce it. And that is where the troubleshooting comes to play. Ask you users or customers, talk to them directly, maybe even call them or send them a debugger tool or whatnot. That’s what we do in our business.
Btw. There exists a dogma in (software) development (for a good reason) that you should not connect developers dirstly to end user. That’s why there is some “mediator” / “ombudsman” (Community Manager in our case) who is responsible for communication with us and isolate development team from direct pressure from end users, so they can concentrate on their work.
Sorry for little bit of “theory” here, but it’s important to take it into account.
The thing is the game works great for the Majority of players, a small minority use the forums to begin with and a small percentage of that small minority (even if it’s a few hundred people) are vocal about their issues.
I have no issues, so I see all this negativity and screaming and it bothers me. I have been waiting for this Sim forever, it’s here, it’s amazing and there’s a small loud group of people actively bashing it because they are experiencing issues. I understand the frustration but it’s important for everyone to understand that the vast majority of users DO NOT experience these game breaking issues and it’s more then likely driver, hardware or software compatibility issues which take time and energy to work through.
All I’m saying is people need to calm down and be more positive.
I definitely share your @Juiceman39 excitement and passion about the sim. The product is undoubtly great and awesome in many ways.
There exist real issues that are undoubtly wide-spread this time. It needs to be fixed anyway and it brings some level of frustration to people who are more sensitive to this.
Anyway, nice to hear there are some who don’t suffer from any bugs of this severity.
Based on what data are you making the claim that it “works great for the majority of players”? You are confusing a lack of motivation to come onto the forums and discuss an issue with an actual lack of problems being experienced by a user. Also, if seeing “negativity” bothers you, then perhaps forums based on the idea of discussing issues aren’t the right place for you. And again, you keep making this claim that the “vast majority” of users don’t experience problems on the basis of ZERO evidence. You cannot seriously make that claim without any sort of widespread poll just because only a few people actually come onto the forums to report it
May have missed those points in my recent post Steve, but trust me when I say, I have posted those very points soo many times that I should almost have hotkeys for them. 80000 members. They can all type, apparently. Maybe some are using speech-to-text? But it seems only a few can read…
The developers are crying out for more details on the various problems, so they can reproduce them and find solutions. The majority of our members just shout back, “IT’S XXXXXXX BROKEN! FIX IT! or give me back my money!”
There are plenty of users, like yourself that have put in the effort to participate in the cure. Sadly, plenty, according to the math is around 0.4%. Not enough.
I’m glad your not having any performance issues, but put yourself in the shoes of someone that has a free evening to play MSFS, or a free afternoon on the weekend to fly around the MSFS universe but that experience has come to a screeching halt. They take off and then they go from 40 fps to 20 fps w/ stuttering and no matter how many times they reboot, roll back graphics drivers, or do a medicine man dance - the end result is disappointment. One more thing to consider is that about everyone was getting a great experience after the UK update, so this last update has been a very big buzz kill for about 30% of all MSFS users.
I take your logic. But still, I’m sure that they will find a solution and fix it. It will just take some time and all we can add is little bit of our patience.
My logic is - they didn’t break it on purpose and they are highly motivated to fix things (and lear from their errors). Most of them are also aviation enthusiasts btw.
That is why… YES it is the user’s task to give ‘useful’ information. If you want your problem solved.
This is EXACTLY how organizations gather data. When was the last time you participated in a poll?They don’t ask you to describe how you feel. They ask a question and give you 4 or 5 possible responses. In programming in particular, anecdotal data is useless. I need to know what platform, what drivers, what software, what button you clicked or route you flew and in what aircraft.
They already stated that they would be happy to recreate a bug, even if it means building a copy of the customers computer. That is how you find bugs.
If you are thus giving me an official update on behalf of Asobo/MS that the next SIM Downgrade and Scenery Downgrade will be free-of-charges, please accept a sincere thank you from this beta tester - who never complains and always maintains humour.
P.S. Thank you also for the nice stuttery ILS approach at Gatwick just now.
PPS There seem to be a lot of unofficial update from normal forum members here.
The evidence is right in front of you, a small sample size of users on the forum experience issues… a small sample size of the MSFS 2020 community is actively engaged on the forums. and Typically… maybe you have no experience with the internet, but generally more negative traffic gravitates to the forums looking for solutions then positive traffic of people that just enjoy the sim.
But if you want to believe “the sky is falling” that’s on you… my message to all of you is simply that, the core game is not broken, it’s likely driver/hardware related and they are working on it. I understand the frustrations.
