Denial, Anger, Bargaining, Depression, Acceptance

I can tell you my experience with 4090: at 4k native resolution plus an additional 125% scaling in TAA, so under demanding scenario, you could hit 45fps at apron (without frame generation). Now you get 25-35fps at most aprons, even on small airports and therefore also close to ground level. On the other hand you have no stuttering when you use G-sync (my case) as monitor adapts to existing fps figure dynamically. So with G-sync you can discard the fps problems, so the GPU factor or stuttering related to fps changes that go below monitor refresh rate.

What you get since AAU2 patch was released are crazy freezes, never seen before, which with SU15 can last up to 15 seconds (x3 times longer than last year). The simulation freezes completely. The freezing problems are not related with GPU but with CPU indeed, so the problem is again the overloaded main thread yet pushed more and more beyond its limits after each game patch.

You can see the following post from december, some months after those problems had started (AAU2 was released in June 2023). I could make a test and I found the reason of freezes at that time was the P+E-cores policy on modern CPUs.

But then they pushed main thread again to release some memory periodically and we were basically lost after that because that process is taking all your main thread cycle time for whatever design reason. Now even running game only on P-Cores (so as fast as possible) does not prevent the freezes.

This is what has really changed since game was launched. A relatively healthy main thread was turned into one that no system can handle smoothly because it´s main thread itself the one freezing, not user´s systems. Indeed faster CPUs don´t solve the issue as you can see how CPU drops close to 0% during those long freezes.

This is also the real problem behind the multiple combinations of recent posts from different users releated to SU15 performance, stuttering and cam panning freezes that you can find in the forum: the main thread is freezing, shortly or during several seconds, but it´s freezing.

Cheers

I have other issues than I didn’t see in SU14 (tiling, object popping, and screen flickering) but freezing and stutters are gone. Camera panning is now smooth as silk.
(5800X3D, 3090 Ti)

O my goodness my gracious these clouds don’t look normal! They look like whales! Very like a whale! I’m going to go eat worms until my acceptance comes!!

All I can say is freezing? what freezing? The worst I ever see is the occasional couple of frames when loading in dense t-LOD 400+ photogrammetry at close to rooftop level. Personally I believe data synchronage is the main issue here and is why I never run my gpu and gpu memory at anything other than Nvidia’s own stock speeds (OC graphics card manufacturers never claim their own overclocks will work well in every game or situation). Btw this doesn’t affect cpu or ram overclocks (e.g. XMP) so long as they are 100% stable.

That you don´t see the problem does not mean that the problem is not existing. I also don´t see the game hanging at “checking for updates” while many users are reporting it nowadays but I know it exists because I had that problem during almost 1 year in the past and Asobo added corrections to mitigate it in previous game versions.

Trust me, this one is not a problem caused by user´s systems, specially when Asobo introduced in SU15 a correction to fix slow memory management generated after SU14 together with a ton of CTDs fixes and other memory stabilization corrections. It´s clear that there´s a problem and unfortunatelly it´s not yet fixed completely. You can bet SU16 will come with yet more memory and stabilization corrections in its release notes, in addition to the famous GDK for consoles.

Anyway I have no overclock at all. During freezes game´s CPU usage drops close to 0% while GPU usage remains stable and other tasks CPU usage remains also stable. Than result can only happen when game´s main thread itself is freezing. If the freezing was caused by user´s system (e.g: due to a bottleneck) the other running tasks would be also affected by that freeze, but they run completely normal. You can even run another game together with MSFS (yes, two games at the same time) and you will see that when MSFS freezes the other game does not freeze at all and keeps working normally :wink:

Cheers

if your cpu really is dropping to idle then it rather looks like a distribution problem or DX conflict that your gpu has to unravel, of course that could include from a corrupt MSFS install but there’s enough of us without such problems that suggests it’s a per user issue and possibly system related. A couple of hours OCCT extreme profile stability testing of both cpu and memory might shed some light, ideally it should return zero faults. Btw “other games” are generally not MIMO and are sandboxed, they will almost always perform well.

You know, after 4 years I learnt to identify when MSFS fails. The main reason is that no other application fails, no other DX11/12 games fail, the failures keep reproducing after multiple Windows updates, drivers updates, BIOS updates, official content updates, third party content updates and everything starts to fail or stops failing just after SUs are released. However, when you have a system or HW failure everything fails, not only MSFS.

Remember that DX12 tiles issues, just to give a recent example, have been claimed to be a GPU driver issue for years till Asobo finally acknowledged they had a wrong implementation in the code and that was finally fixed. The main reason behind most MSFS problems is unfortunatelly MSFS itself.

Cheers

This is absolutely not true, infact very few hard faults will actually cause a system shutdown; example, that OCCT stability test I mentioned, every red entry is caused by a hardware failure just as are many of the yellow and red flags you may find in Windows event manager, they are rarely critical.

Yes those DX12 tiles were visible to all (by varying degrees depending on vram availability etc.) but nothing to do with overlong freezes suffered by relatively few so I fail to see how that is relevant to your complaint.

I’ll just add that my main suspect is still data distribution, maybe other family members online, internet TV, wifi fridges etc. (or even neighbours on the same wifi channel). Maybe you should check your router’s configaration.

I know you want to help so thanks for that but please, instead of guessing just observe game. If you monitor game you will understand what it does. It reaches peak download speed only during flight loading (blue bar screen) and for a few seconds. Everything is cached in memory and afterwards, during regular flying, it uses less than 20Mb to update scenery periodically. Similar thing happens when reading your local files. The disk activity is very low during regular use.

Now ask yourself why most of the corrections addresed by Asobo in the past 2 years were focused in memory optimizations and stability. Memory management has been always the main problem of this game for three reasons: caching is based on it, data swap overloads main thread and consoles have few memory available. And before you suggest it again my memory is ok as the rest of my system. I run stability tests many times and I have 64GB installed, more than enough to run game.

Cheers

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I’m not going to argue, memory management has always been a struggle but it doesn’t distract from the fact you are periodically seeing 15 second freezes and virtually no one else is. The sim is in no way perfect that’s for sure, MS/Asobo try their best but they can’t look under the hood of a PC hundreds of miles away, at least not in any great depth they can’t.

I have nothing further to say.

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When I’ve had system freezes that last for seconds, it’s always been due to some problem with USB - either a bad driver, malfunctioning hardware, or a Windows setting. Just something to think about…

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There are so many different permutations of hardware, and software, that diagnosing an issue that affects a diminishingly small number of users is going to be all but impossible. Following the growing number of recommendations for a “clean” install as a base to build from is recommended. Only when stability has been re-established can you move forward.

You can use the “Reliability Monitor” to view your reliability history to see how often your system has issues with MSFS, or indeed any program.

image

For me it doesn’t look great as lots of programs external to MSFS report problems, like the TDS GTNxi, even though MSFS itself has never been more stable for me.

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Good point … first test should always be vanilla with just keyboard and mouse

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Yes. No ancillary hardware, or software. Just the core sim.

The person with the issue doesn’t know what is causing it, so can’t logically rule anything out till they remove everything they can, then add things back till the problem returns. There are some shortcuts, like 50/50’ing the Community folder until resolution.

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That is in fact the way I would suggest to go ahead as well.
A long while ago I had added a 1-in-4 USB splitter. Simply because I was too lazy to change connections between three items that occupied a slot. This worked great for a few month. Long enough for me to forget to swap that cheap one for a more expensive powered hub I had purchased.
Then I had a strange jitter effect when moving my mouse in another game. Only then did I go back to that hub….all fixed in three minutes.

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Totally agree

A quite recent game freezing example which also affects performance. This is not caused by anything at user side (addons, drivers, HW, network, etc) and therefore there´s no possible fix for it locally. Many users are affected by it worldwide as seen in the post. Unfortunatelly it´s not the first time we see something like this happening either.

Cheers

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Bummer, man.

Sorry, it´s just what is happening dude :person_shrugging:

Cheers

Yes, I’ve noticed.