I think it would be a good idea to start another more specific topic ‘‘Glider feature wishlist’’ or something like that, because this thread is there to ask for gliders in general, since they were missing from the beginning.
But for some things like the competition system, broken adverse yaw and so on it might be good to start another topic. That way can vote and point in the right direction should go easily into the ‘‘top 10 of the last 3 months’’ list.
So Gliders are coming in November and we know the devs are working on the basic gameplay features to support it, like winch launch, tow plane & thermals.
But there are some more features that are quite essential for the gliding experience.
Here’s a list I compiled from feedback gathered in the gliding community:
Better simulation of adverse yaw
Waves behind ridges
Support for Competition tasks (incl. start/finish waypoints, min/max altitude for WP, custom WP radius, max speed limit for WP, Nav Displays showing relevant task data, etc)
Multiplayer Towplane functionality
Hypoxemia & Oxygen system
Synchronized Live Weather in multiplayer
Competitive Multiplayer modes
I’m sure there are many more advanced features that would improve gliding.
Please add them to this thread, but let’s focus on features that only Asobo can implement and can’t be done by 3rd parties.
I’d like to see an animated winch and cable to go with the launch support. It’s missing from the current glider models and would add to immersion as would animated launch point crews. (Not sure if glider fields use the old signalling bats these days or if its done with radios now but if so I’d like that included too.)
Tow plane needs something more than a straight out. The old FSX add on let you select left or right hand circuits for the tow plane. I think we need both an AI version and a multiplayer version.
I don’t know if oryginal wish author @PaulFalke is still here? But I think that this topic’s original message should be updated with clear stated list of features, I think it could be divided in ‘essential’ (like correct adverse yaw/need of rudder in turns, synchronized multiplayer live weather, correct polar/flaps, thermals) and ‘worthy’ - other more nice to have features that otherwise can be walkaround by 3rd party (like rope in winch, which is already in paid version of KA and prob. will be in premium Discus).
Not sure what you want to say. I read it already some time ago, maybe you mean this statement:
It is the same with gliders. You need thermals, which are completely different. Some people think that we have thermals, but we actually don’t have thermals in the sim. For it, you need to know what the terrain is, where the sun is, how much moisture there is, what the wind conditions are, etc. Then you can get thermals and we actually needed a bunch more data that we didn’t have before.
Well this is a bit contradictory to the answer in Q&A where they described how in SU9 sun warming ground affects thermals, as transcribed by GurtTractor:
In SU9 it computes the amount of watts, the energy recieved by the sun, which will depend on if it’s day or night, how high the sun is in the sky, how thick of atmosphere is crossed by the sunlight, if it’s humid or whatever if there’s haze etc, if there’s clouds. And so at the end there’s an amount of watts remaining that hits the ground at a certain angle, and then you know how much energy you get, then it calculates all sorts of things like how dark, albedo basically, how much energy is reflected, how much is kept. This transforms into heat, and then you know how much basically your ground is heating up. When you ground is significantly warmer than the air it builds up hot air which then wants to go up, and here you have your thermals.
But it really doesn’t matter as long as they say they are working on thermals and indeed they need improvement but SU9 is definately move in good direction and I already was able to do crosscountry, over 1hr flights over flatlands using convection under clouds.
As part of the multiplayer tow functionality it would be really very nice if there was some way for the towplane to ‘feel’ the weight of the towed glider and have it affect performance, and the sudden change when it detaches.
Sadly when flying gliders in MSFS I often catch myself not using or even not feeling the need to use rudder while turning.
Yesterday I was able to do real life cross country flying and using this opportunity I recorded quick demonstration ( https://youtu.be/0u-1t4OvynQ ) of real life adverse yaw effect in glider.
Maybe it will be of some use for MSFS 2020 glider designers, maybe it will inspire someone who have access to the RL versions of gliders we already have in MSFS to do similiar recording.
It may also convince sim pilots that such unintuitive glider behaviour in the sim when they try to turn without having/using rudder is not a broken flight model - in RL you must use rudder to have efficient turn.
In this footage I was flying DG-101G and tried to make turn using only stick/ailerons with neutral rudder - as you can see initially glider heading changes in the opposite direction and later glider’s nose falls down and in the turn direction. In RL the whole body feels loss of balance so it was actually hard not to use leg (thus recovery from the turn I mostly did using rudder) - at some point in training the glider becomes extension of your body and so your limbs instinctively try to rebalance your “extended body”. Sadly in flight sim you don’t have such balance feedback.
I was also worried, that by using too much MSFS where rudder is not that needed for good enough turns, I will unlearn how to turn in RL, luckly this is not the case - after 2 months of RL flying break and almost daily session of MSFS the balance sense in RL is so strong that I used rudder in turning quite instinctively (probably may be more of an issue for RL student-pilots that don’t have such instincts yet).
What glider do you fly in MSFS because I definitely get adverse yaw in the discus even if it’s not as pronounced as in RL? I’m only asking because many FSX converts just don’t have the complexity needed for true flight dynamics.
All of them - discus premium, ls4, ka7, dg808, as33.
Ka7 has the stronger adverse yaw. ls4 should have it similiar to my dg-101G but is visibly less.
But the most important thing I think is that not using rudder to coordinate turn after the phase of adverse yaw doesn’t result in huge sideslip in MSFS, which it should (and is seen on my video) as in RL. After too very short while in MSFS the glider automatically returns to balanced, aligned with airflow turn - in RL it should be off balance longer, yaw string should bend sideways stronger, you should hear wind sheer from sidways airflow, and even have little cabin shakes from turbulence caused by nonlaminar airflow - which should also decrease performance - none of it I experience in MSFS - and this is why I think we don’t need to use rudder for turns in MSFS. Hope people responsible for official gliders in MSFS will fix this.
The only explanation I see is that they didn’t implement it yet, but on the other hand how they can have any RL pilot to give them feedback about flight model without this quite fundamental for gliders flight instrument.
BTW both officially announced gliders, as Wiek S. rightly noticed at FB group, are flap-less gliders - that is a big shortcut and over-simplification for official gliders implementation - the official glider devs should carry the burden of fixing flap handling in MSFS instead of cleverly steer clear of it.
I would expect experienced glider pilots to be able to recognise sideslip and AY with their eyes closed, listening to Bach whilst planning their evening meal.
should go easily into the ‘‘top 10 of the last 3 months’’ list.
