What exactly does the “trim lock” switch do?
In one of the “how to trim” tutorials it says you need to have it “on” for trim to work at all. My trim works exactly the same with it on or off.
Any idea what that swich actually does?
Overhead panel, its quite obvious.
Disagree. Controllers make a huge difference. Maybe you’ve never hand your hands on high end controller, but I can assure you it does matter.
Indeed I have HOTAS Warthog + Thrustmaster pedals, so both are very high quality and for me they are a must as I´m a long term user of such controllers. That´s why I wrote that you can even fly with mouse or a cheaper stuff. But you need to know how to fly and how to tune them as well.
The entry point to helicopters can´t be a console controller in my opinion. That gives you very bad axis feeling unless you reduce sensitivity a lot. But you don´t need to spend 1000€ in controllers to start using helicopters as well. A decent joystick is fine and gives good precission to learn the basics.
Cheers
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Uh… I asked what does it do. I know where it is
Once I solved the bug with the Bell flight model I have been able to fly on a controller just fine using the realistic flight model and no assists.
I have it set up with cyclic on right stick, tail rotor on triggers, collective on dpad up and down and trim on RB + dpad.
The only issue I have is I really want to know what percentage my collective is at at all times and there is no way to do that (unfortunately even the “FS Inputs” mod that was posted earlier doesn’t work correctly with heli collective)
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“Trim Lock”, “Auto Trim” and “Force Trim” all seem to do the same … nothing. The easiest way to check this is to activate the MSFS HUD in cockpit mode, which shows the current pitch trim. At the moment, only the manual longitudinal and lateral trims work. And as others have reported, the “set longitudinal/lateral trim” button assignments only reset the trim to neutral.
Nonetheless, with the Bell 407 improvement mod by RafaelRafoso, I really enjoy flying the 407!!!
Nice. I understand your issue with collective but indeed if you get used to monitor the gauges instead that would be better. The reason is that required collective setting is not going to be the same everytime. Normally you are fine to stay around 50% for hover and low speed and go near 75-100% for high speed and climb but indeed both helicopters have a governor (Bell´s FADEC is an advanced one), which means they are going to adjust RPM automatically. What you need to try is to stay withing the limits to keep hover and altitude and learn which are the optimal values for each helicopter according to payload, altitude and weather conditions, so that you can set collective optimally and let governor deal with engine RPM.
As a very general rule according to my own experience with choopers in game so far: something about 40-50% torque on Bell and 50% RPM on Cabri would be enough during hover in most cases. With governor active Bell won´t let you go above 100% RPM nor overpass torque, unless you really force the rotor on purpose, and you should normally not need to overpass 90% RPM on Cabri to reach max speed.
Cheers
Yeah I’ve been doing all that you mentioned.
My issue is that I’d like to be able to reliably put the collective to 50% immediately and know it is at 50%… or immediately put it to a certain percentage.
For instance, if I am at 95% collective and know I want the collective at around 50% to start a maneuver, I can’t do that. I need to just hold the button down for a little bit, see how the heli responds, then adjust up and down to the point where I think the collective is where it needs to be.
If I was able to see the actual collective percentage at all time I’d be able to execute that maneuver much more quickly and effectively
Maybe you can try to map pedals and collective axis to the left stick instead of using single button presses, as while centered it will be near the 50% range. The downside is that you will need to hold stick down while on ground and adjust it a bit during hover… When I fly acarde games I use that combo in 4 keys on the keyboard and other 4 keys for cyclic or even use mouse for cyclic and just 4 keys for pedals and collective. Anyway this is not arcade… Your best option is to grab a cheap joystick which has twist axis for pedals and a power slider for collective. That´s how I started many years ago. Indeed I recently ordered the Thrustmaster T.Flight Stick X for my father, which is a total noob in simulation and he has improved quite a lot with it. That´s a basic one but has everything you need. As I said a console controller is not the optimal choice in this case if you are not really used to fly helicopters.
Cheers
Yeah having the collective on a centering stick is a no go for me. Having to hold the collective up at 85% constantly in flight to cruise at speed is just awful.
And unfortunately sitting at a desk with my HOTAS is not possible for me because of an injury. I need to use a gamepad.
I’ve actually considered building a simple sliding device that I could put on the floor and control with my foot for throttle/collective.
That being said, there is an entire audience on Xbox that is using a controller. It would be extremely beneficial for them to have the ability to see the collective percentage on screen at all times as well
In regards to many posts that I have read about flying helicopters, this is not easy earned experience. I have had the privilege to fly in multiple Heli airframes in real life and landed on micro sized LZ’s. Helicopters are no joke. When in comparison to fixed wing airframes, it’s the difference between a plane being 2D flying and a helicopter being 3D flying. A plane wants to go where you point it in general, a Heli you have to make it go there.
If you can fly it with an Xbox controller, my hats off to you. I don’t think it’s reasonable. You need to get a basic flight setup if you are going to experience this form of capacity of flying. I haven’t even tried to fly the Cabri, only the Bell. I made multiple takeoffs and landings with assists on at first hand, then lunged into realistic. The 407 is very close to the real deal. I have a HOTAS with a throttle (used as the collective) and pedals, exclusively on Xbox, and it’s a challenge. But I welcome it. I have had as many triumphs as I have had failures.
Don’t get discouraged. Watch as many vids as you can to understand the dynamics. This isn’t a “set the auto pilot and go” type of flying. That really doesn’t exist in real life. This really is a good “simulation”.
Just remember, 3D vs 2D. The throttle should not be a factor but set at 100%. The more collective applied at takeoff must be countered by tail rotor authority. Another thing I think people are missing is weather. If you are lifting off or landing in a cross wind or tail wind, you are gonna have a bad time, it’s that way in real life for excellent pilots. Know your weather and learn your airframe. Real commercial pilots spend many hours in a model of Heli before just, going to do a job. And all models act differently.
Don’t just bag on the developers saying “it’s a poor model” or coping out by saying “this is impossible to fly”. It actually is sort of is impossibility being made possible in all reality.
Get better equipment as all possible to achieve success. Learn 3D dynamics with all weather and airframe in consideration. Don’t get discouraged, it’s a sim, play it for what it is. And hold it close in thought, most Heli pilots in real life can fly a plane, but just because you can fly a plane by no means can you fly a helicopter.
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Being totally new with helis, the only way I’ve found to enjoy flying this one and Cabri is by:
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Mapping rotor to an AXIS, instead to button increase and decrease. This means, just map TAIL ROTOR AXIS, to your joystick twist axis (or pedals).
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Setting rotor assistance to ON. By only the first change, it will spin forever with not anti torque enough. So enable this assistance and it’s “fixed”.
This way I feel more kind of control, but still quite difficult to hover, take off and landing.
Don’t need anything else for now, and find them very pleasant and tricky to handle.
OneMoreBullet, I think you may have hit the nail on the head for many including me. I have spent so many frustrating hours trying to figure out why this heli is unflyable as if its under some voodoo spell.
I have the same controllers as yours and have been hearing that banging sound. Had the z axis physically locked and not bound the tail rotor axis on pedals. Too late at night now. Will change settings tomorrow. Thank you so much for sharing.
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I finally ended up disabling rotor assistance too.
Basically you need to be smoother with the collective power, specially at slow speed (take off, swings).
In case of sudden power needed, need to apply a counter rotor to the left (Bell 407) or to the right (Cabri).
It’s more challenging but definitely it’s worth it when you get used to.
I manage to fly through Manhattan buildings with no problems at all (well, sometimes). Also starting to land on top of the buildings.
Very fun.
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If you would read there is a bug that is making the helicopters unflyable. Also there is the same bug with aircraft where they are not responding properly to control imputs.
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Imagine now that there is a bug that is making helicopters unflyable and has nothing to do with how people are flying them. But I know lets just pretend you are the only one who knows how to fly them properly.
The 407 is not unflyable. Many people are flying it successfully. It takes finesse, a gentle touch on the controls and an understanding of helicopter aerodynamics. Even with its current issues, it is still a heck of a lot of fun to fly.
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It is unflyable for some not all https://www.facebook.com/photo?fbid=586627896800774&set=a.492530426210522