July 23rd 2025 Developer Livestream - Discussion

Discussion Hub General Discussion
22

I think I’ve attended all the Developer Livestream since they exist. It’s the first one that make me feel discouraged. I feel starting losing faith in the Microsoft and Asobo staff to get out of all problems listed during this stream. It was an endless raw of “it’s complex” “it’s difficult” “rest assure we do our best” “the team is working on it” “ongoing” “maybe in SU3 or SU4 I don’t know”…

MSFS2024 was officially released 248 days ago.

From my perspective, previous Livestreams drew a positive path and roadmap. This times, I have the weird feeling that Jorg, Sebastian and Martial and hundred of staff behind are powerless in front of the difficulties. They were unable to light the end of the tunnel. No offence, it’s a huge task on the communication side first and the technical development part. A huge huge task. How can I help as a simmers? is an honest self question that I share here. I beta test, I share feedback, I engage with the community… What else can I do?

Maybe it’s time to change the format and structure of these livestream? I feel sad for Marwan Gharib from FlightFX sandwiched between bugs discussion. Maybe splitting it in different smaller streams (SDK, Console, Career, MarketPlace) ? Shorten the format? Onboarding new representatives? I did enjoy the direct communication driven by Jorg and I feel it reaches it’s limit.

Who am I? I can qualified myself as a supporter of MSFS and PC Sim. I spent certainly too much of my spare time simflying GA :slight_smile: helping fellow simmers on various forums and Facebook groups, Beta testing all versions, actively engaging the communities every day. I also develop amateur’ish small airfields missing in the sim and offering them freely as my way of giving back for all I’ve received from this amazing community.. In short : Enjoying MSFS.

23

Are the promised optimisations to come the same optimisations we were told we’d get before release? They used that as a selling point last year and it backfired and to this day performance is still very very poor compared to 2020 (VR).

24

Today I’m going back to FS2020. It’s the stupid everyday in your face bugs I can’t stand anymore which seem to not exist for MS/Asobo or can’t be bothered to solve those.

25

I think it will be available as beta soon after SU3, as SU3 beta came soon after SU2. Although they might take some well earned rest for August in which case a Sept/Oct run would be fair enough. I share the sentiment from dreampage, this thing needs alot more substantive SUs going forward to fix the myriad of bugs within … An SU5 release before 2025 ends would be a good pace, methinks.

If they start bringing out movie-tie-ins, buckyball racing or spaceships again so help us all our sanity …

:alien:

26

Hi @Vincent1064! I think you are one of the more down to earth posters around, and in the past, your posts have been reasonably balanced.

I think they don’t want to overpromise. Maybe they learned their lesson? I don’t know. But I do understand where they are coming from. What matters to me the most though, is their progress. As the saying goes, “talk is cheap, show me!”

And judging by their progress since the release of MSFS 2024, I think it’s satisfactory. I won’t give them an A+, but I would give them a B. They have done solid work to improve MSFS 2024, and going by the latest comments from SU3 beta testers, it seems that MSFS 2024 is in a decent shape in the latest SU3 beta. Of course, there is still a lot of room for improvement for MSFS 2024, there is no question about it. But it seems like SU3 is going to end up as a good release, unless they drop the ball again in one of the SU3 updates (ie. the SimConnect CTD bug in SU3).

I can also understand why they consolidate everything into one Twitch Q&A. My guess is, they are so busy working on MSFS 2024, that they can’t spare the time to have separate smaller Twitch Q&As. I don’t blame them for this. If it makes it more efficient for them, that’s something that I can tolerate. It’s the same reason why Jorg probably didn’t attend FSEXpo this year, because he doesn’t want to deal with additional distractions, and just focus on fixing MSFS 2024.

Having said that, maybe what they should have done was have FlightFX on first, and then do the bugs and other segments after. That would have brought FlightFX and their Citation X to the forefront of the livestream.

The release of MSFS 2024 was a mess, and even Jorg admitted it. But since the release, all I can do is judge the MSFS team for what they have done since, and IMO, while not perfect, they are doing a “good enough” job, and hence I give them a B grade.

27

You are amazing! I asked about 20 questions in past livestreams and they never bothered to asnwer them, thats because I ask questions which they dont like, because it usually shows how they broke promises or something like that. They are like politicians. If you ask them about what they like they will answer, if they dont like that topic, they dont :slight_smile:
So in the end I gave up asking questions, because it was obviously waste of time.

28

I wonder why there is not single question or point related to MSFS 2020 update, because as far I know the updated which should update bing imagery did not happen, although it should happen and it was promised to release on 1st of July 2025.

29

I don’t think this is true at all. They get asked a lot of uncomfortable questions and while the answer you get may be noncommittal in terms of dates they generally try to answer it.

Case in point: 24:40 Current UI is impractical - what are the plans for making UI refinements?

Great to see they are finally doing a focused User Research and UX analysis, which will hopefully improve the overall UX. I have no idea why they didn’t do it properly in the first place, given the same problems existed in MSFD202 and were loudly condemned, but at least they have listened and acknowledge it this time.

30

Just the one? :laughing:

31

the updated bing imagery is SU 16 and not yet released.
this does not mean however that the overall quality in msfs2020 will remain or increase. it can also decrease.

32

Be careful what you wish for. SU16 Beta has the updated imagery, and it looks horrible.

33

Landing with a splash! I welcome you to the community!

34

Maybe they are omitting that right now in case there is a regression? When they have their SU3 RC, and no further changes planned, and it still works at speed, maybe then they will update it.

35

Yes I need to mind the center of gravity in the Cessna 172 that I rent regularly, don’t I?
:smiling_face_with_sunglasses:

36

This is exactly my concern. I am hoping against hope that SU16 stays in permanent beta so I can continue to enjoy FS2020 the way it is. I know the odds of Asobo doing this are incredibly slim, but let the update stay in beta so those that like it can branch off to use it, and those that don’t want anything to do with it like myself can continue using the good base program. I am very concerned that it will screw up FS2020 and then I will be forced to get FS24 whether it’s ready or not.

37

In the Twitch livestream, at 10:15 (Roadmap 2025) Jorg says,

“… on the calendar we are a little bit more than half way through the year, we have lots and lots of cool things coming. You know we spent most of the year so far addressing feedback, fixing issues, um, I think we are slowly but surely coming out of this and the second part of the year is going to be more fun new things.”

This is the past pattern. Jorg’s tendency is to want to focus on “new things”. He wants to believe everything is working fine, and falls back to his marketing belief that it’s “new things” that grow the sim user base and thus revenue for the business.

I really want to hear a change in priority - that the long term priority will be to build a stable, functional, reliable platform, and any “new things” must meet a higher standard of functionality before being released - for 1st party or 3rd party addons.

I fear that after 8 months of bug fixing, they just want to go back to their old patterns. The past 8 months forced them to bug fix, but they see it as temporary.

Jorg and Seb and Martial need to sit down with a blank new Xbox and PC, and go through the process of buying MSFS (or subscribing), installing, setting up peripherals, loading in to a parking spot cold and dark, filing a flight plan, trying to figure out Weight and Balance, take off, land (and see the blurry runways), and then try a 2nd flight without rebooting. If they just did that - seeing what users see, more frequently, they would understand. /end rant.

38

I agree with you. They tackled a lot of tough questions (VRAM, main thread, UI, etc.) so I don’t think they are avoiding the political hot potatoes they don’t want to answer—they are choosing questions that represent the most widespread concerns. I don’t blame them for ignoring the question about the hue of the taillight of some aircraft being too red and destroying immersion.

That said, their answers make it clear that “bugs” will continue to be targeted and fixed–through SU4 at least–but the systemic performance improvements some people hope for may be incremental in nature and take time. I thought the answers on VRAM optimization explained this pretty well. They released a list of dozens of airports they are going back and optimizing one by one to reduce the VRAM requirements. That said to me there are no silver bullets or individual bugs behind the VRAM issue. It will be a process of subtle or iterative improvement.

That is frustrating to hear as an answer, but it is an answer.

39

It’s indeed well solved, but why writing No repro instead of Fixed - SU3 ?

40

One subject that they 100% ducked was the CTD problems in MP on 2024. 95% of them seemed to come from the community of a well known streamer and really needed addressing.

For anyone who stayed on for the raid, and then further into the stream, what did you think about the alternative solution for MP that was mentioned?

–edit MP was meant to refer to Multiplayer

41

That is actually a genius idea. Would actually be a step to keep more users happy, without throwing away development effort. Maybe in 12 months time they could refine it and roll it out if they really want to.