(Mods, sorry if this is covered in another thread, but I couldn’t find a thread specifically about voting against items)
Some wishlist items may be very controversial, but only have the ability to vote for, and not against. Personally, I found the changes made to the weather in SU5/7 of 2020 devastating to the weather experience, although many others felt it was good for Vatsim etc.
There’s currently a wishlist item for changing something in 2024 that I would strongly suggest does not need changing. Luckily, it doesn’t have so many votes, but I’d like the opportunity to vote against it anyway.
The problem with this is there are a lot of purist simmers in the community that will hate on anything they see as gaming, any thing Xbox related and possibly VR also
Not voting for something may not be weighted as heavily as actively voting against something, but it does have the danger of a vocal minority shouting down a passive majority that didn’t vote, or didn’t even know vote.
wish lists items are just a wish/suggestion by one person, and some agreeing with it.
ofc, many will disagree, many will not care, and many will never see/read.
I think we can take that as implied.
at the end of the day, its the dev team that will decide based on many factors if its an ‘idea’ they want to pursue or not.
(Id be pretty disappointed in a dev team if it implemented some thing just because it was popular ;))
Well I think that’s what happened with the SU5/7 problems with 2020’s weather. Some people were happy they could use Vatsim better, others were horrified by the huge deterioration of the overall weather picture. Just because lots of people vot d for it.
Often it’s hundreds, not ‘some’. Easily enough for devs to think ‘maybe this is something most people want’, when actually, it may not be what most people want at all.
Whilst we do not currently have a system implemented to vote against Wishlist items on the forums, we do ensure to keep up to date with discussions held by the community within a Wishlist item and not just the vote count! Comments, opinions and sentiment are a vital factor when we look at a Wishlist item, whether these comments agree with the original post or not.
If its in the hundreds then it probably means there is a real consensus that the wish list item is something needs changing or added to the sim. Its basically a form of democracy. From what I can see wish list items need to get hundreds of votes behind them and a real critical mass of attention before I think they’re even considered. 10 people voting because they don’t want imperfections modelled in canopy glass just isn’t going to ever get considered.
If you or someone else don’t like the wishlist suggestion then they can comment in the thread below it stating why they oppose it. Maybe that would just be considered voting against it?
I think if there is a wishlist item that more people don’t want than want, then the comments on it will be obviously negative and that will be considered, not only the numbers on the vote count. Alternatively you could try to create an opposite wish and start voting there, which would basically be the vote “no”.
A good way they should approach is to make every wish they implement, where possible, optional. I know that’s not possible for every wish, but they could strive for trying to make any experience as customizable as possible.
I don’t think we should be able to vote against Wishlist items.
But we should be allowed to discuss why we think they shouldn’t be implemented. In the past I’ve seen a moderator point out Wishlist threads are not the place for criticisms. “Vote or don’t vote” seems to be the rule.
I know that for / against conversations can get ‘frosty’ so I understand why that rule exists. For that reason, in Wishlist threads I’ve adopted the policy my Mom taught me many years ago: “If you don’t have something nice to say, don’t say anything at all.”
IMHO, more generalized discussions are the currently considered the place for opposing points of view. I think that’s an unwritten rule that should change to include the Wishlist category - assuming of course that the discussion remains civil, logical, and constructive.
I concur, there should be only one-way rule and it’s a healthier system to allow people to vote FOR than AGAINST. And got reassured by Chewwy’s post above saying that written opinions are taken into account, that’s the way to look at the whole thing vs one number (eg what would 0 vote mean in a dual-way vote system: no one voted because it’s uninteresting, or there was a huge debatz with arguments on both sides?)
If you’re not in favor of an idea, just do nothing and move on.
its not a democratic decision making process in any way.
vast majority of players/buyers dont even know the poll exists.
the dev are under zero obligation to implement.
also as above, if the devs are going to consider something, they’ll not just look at the OP and vote count. they’ll look at others comments, and look to see what other discussions are being had around the idea.
they’ll also have their own opinions on if its within scope/spirit of the game, and also technically/economically viable.
so its just a starting point of a suggestion, the vote merely gives an indicator of if its something people are ‘interested in’ so is worth investigating.
Regarding wishlist items, I saw a post that said something to the effect that the devs should decide on a wish list item. In my opinion, it should be project management that makes the decision as to wish list items and most importantly the order of bugs that should take priority remediation. To have the devs making that decision doesn’t make sense to me. Again, that’s just my opinion.
I think most use ‘devs’ as short for ‘development team’.
even that is a simplification, not only covering project managers, qa, coders, product owners , but also theres potentially many teams.
(and possibly even publisher involvement if its a big impact item)
so all these things have to be co-ordinated and input sought.
e.g. a PM often will need guidance from developers for time estimates, technical feasibility, impact assessment etc.
… so yeah, when I say “devs”, I mean in a very broad sense, meaning those involved in ‘getting it done’
I don’t think it’s necessary, all of the metrics are already in place to see forum activity (behind the scenes) as well as everyone can see how many times any topic including wish list items have been viewed.
If you view it, and it’s not for you, don’t vote.
If an item has been viewed (uniquely) 372 times and has 2 votes, than clearly it isn’t a priority of the masses,
I agree with most others - no negative votes please. I think the number of votes cast should be sufficient to draw a valid conclusion. 500 votes vs 30 votes pretty much tells the story to me. As for the priority MSAsobo would put on wishlist items, I would hope that problems that make the sim or situation unplayable would be considered first. After that I’d think you’d have to look at time constraints and value received for making the change.
