Been doing the VFR flight training, which uses the in game Cessna 152, and have to say, the pitch sensitivity on that plane seems to be utterly bonkers.
I’m using a centerstick setup with a 20cm extension and the thing has more pitch jerk than the DCS F-14. Even the trim is extremely strong if I use mouse wheel to click it in.
Right now I’m just running the default curves, and haven’t even yet found the in game curve calibrator.
Is it just the default planes have really steep deflection curves? Or do I have something misconfigured somewhere?
Once connected to your joystick in control options on the left you will find sensitvity settings although these are likely to be the same curves as you have already, if your stick has jittery potentiometers be sure to set deadzones for the neutral positions. Also when selecting an aircraft in the world menu you will find that each aircraft has a slider for rudder, elevator and aileron authority.
One thing to mention is that small aircraft are mostly very twitchy in real life, try watching a few YT videos of pilots in turbulence and you might well be shocked at how reactive they have to be. I know I was.
As mentioned above, the Sensitivity settings (Controls Options, Sensitivity) are very important to what I think you’re trying to achieve. Although I use a yoke and pedals, to get to where I could control the Cessna 152 and 172 (as well as other planes) as needed to get high marks in the Basic Training section of MSFS, I had to set Sensitivity - and + to as high as 75% on the elevator ad 35% on the ailerons. Dead zones were set to 5% to 9%. Don’t be afraid to experiment to get things the way you want.
All the same devs usually tune their aircraft to the default and I don’t think that controllers vary that much … So really I guess it’s a toss up between realism and comfort but I always keep my own alterations close to the liniar. Twitchy but I’m used to it. I try to match full deflection of the aircraft’s controls with full deflection of my joystick, it’s near enough as far as I’m concerned.
All the same devs usually tune their aircraft to the default
How is this done? I’ve flown a C152 and to me what I’ve done seems quite realistic. Although a real C150/C152 yoke reacts to any movement, they never seemed “twitchy” or “overly sensitive” to me but just responsive in a good way to small movements.
Granted, I use CH yoke and pedals in MSFS, but they work pretty well now that they’ve been adjusted. Perhaps now things have changed, but when I first set them up, there was no “Default” profile for CH yoke or pedals. If there is now, I should probably try it.
The default being a straight line corner to corner, overadjust sensitivities and the angle of turn will accelerate unrealistically as you reach full deflection. Most printed curves I’ve seen anywhere have been quite gentle or straight, e.g. a JustFlight dev once mentioned on here that they tune the arrows to the liniar.
My throttle and pedals are set that way. However, I found that my (old) CH yoke was extremely sensitive to the point it was really not allowing good aileron and rudder control. As soon as it was moved out of the dead zone, movement was quite quick and abrupt. This was minimized by using a higher sensitivity setting.
This could be due to what are called “light” springs by some who have replaced them with heavier springs to get better control. There is also a detente in the aileron control which some people have eliminated to provide a more realistic feel, as none exists in a real plane.
Yup and I’ll admit my cheapo joystick is no different. Very twitchy but I fly gliders, sometimes aerobatics and have got quite used to it. Airliners however I probably would want it dumbed down.
Ok, so it looks like a 25% curve does the job. Even with the 20cm extension, the game is about doubling the stick inputs to translate them to the full range of the aircraft controls.
I know this is an old topic, sorry, I’m searching for specific things and saw this.
Full control deflection is not common, but it does happen especially at slow speeds in adverse and gusty wind conditions. Control authority decreases with airspeed so the pilot will make large deflections of the controls at slow speeds, especially landings.
This is something that MSFS is terrible at simulating. It’s not remotely authentic or realistic. So, in the simulator, you have to be extremely precise on landing or you will over control. That’s wrong in the real world, but it’s how you fly the simulator as opposed to a real airplane.
I strongly disagree. It’s not the sim that’s causing issues with the control “feeling”; its hardware yokes/joysticks. The yoke of a real 172 moves pretty far in the pitch axis. Most sim yokes just barely manage to achieve half the travel of the real thing (some are closer to 1/3rd!). And most joysticks are much worse. This alone makes the plane really sensitive to your inputs, and when you add the fact that you’re lacking the firmness of an IRL yoke at higher airspeeds, it just ends up making the plane feel really twitchy.
In all of the 172s ive been renting for the past half-ish year, comfortable pitch control inputs during cruise is literally a mere centimeter of travel or less. And it takes some force to do that. Any more movement than that at 100+ kts and you’re gonna feel some G’s, or lack thereof depending on your input. I find the stock 172 in the sim feels close enough(WB sim addon is much better tho!) in terms of how it feels to land IRL, control wise. I make quick ~1 to 2 inch pitch adjustments to react to wind as I’m floating and bleeding off speed for a smooth touchdown, just like IRL but with a bit less force required. That being said, I have a fulcrum yoke that has a very similar pitch travel to the real 172. Which is why I don’t believe the sim is terrible at simulating this. It actually simulates it to an acceptable degree with the right hardware. Unfortunately, the right hardware is usually prohibitively expensive and I do think it would be good to find a way to make cheaper hardware work a bit better.
Crosswind is another story entirely though. But lets ignore that for now… ; )
Yeah, part of it is I’m using a center stick, but with a 20cm extension, it’s still got around a 1 foot travel range at the grip. But it does not have tons of centering force there, even with the heaviest springs and the highest tension. And because I’m using a bent extension, I’ve noticed that changing my grip is enough to change the center enough to knock it out of trim.
I think you make some very strong and valid points. The equipment is critical. I have been a sim car racer for years. Getting good equipment and a sim that properly implements force feedback makes a huge difference.
In this case, I have a basic Logitech yoke system and it’s not good. The throw is pitifully short and it’s not smooth. Trying to make fine adjustments can often lead to lurches – it sticks then releases and you pull further than you wanted. On center, there is virtually no spring resistance for at least an inch.
Having said that, I can be at cruise in a GA aircraft and move the yoke a certain amount and get a particular reaction from the aircraft. I can then slow the aircraft, put in some flaps, and then stabilize. I can move the yoke the same amount as before and get the same basic reaction. The only difference is it obviously stalls out quickly at the slower speeds.
That’s just not right. Control authority should be less at slower speeds. That’s just physics.
It could be the yoke and the silly way we have to trim that’s making it worse than it is, but I think the sim itself has aerodynamic issues. I could be wrong given all the other factors, but it’s the way it behaves.
One thing that would make things better is if the yoke just had a way to recenter the spring. When trim is used, it should physically move the center on the yoke. That would make feel a million times better.
I had similar issues on my Saitek yoke that I used for years. I actually modded it with rubber bands to get around that, which worked really well for about a year. But they broke and it still suffered from the short travel distance, so I just bit the bullet and bought a better yoke. My sim landings improved instantly.
I recall someone was making a force feedback yoke and I think it included the dynamic centering point for the trim like you said. I don’t remember what it was called though. I’ll see if I can find it. I expect it to cost a pretty penny though : /
All the talk about the control sensitivity but I need help on sensitivity of the trimming whether wheel or button or toggle what ever your using in trimming the aircraft I can’t find any solution. Its a constant battle trying to have it level off ans stay in some sort of trimmed aircraft climbing descending level I have not found anything yet that works. The sensitivity in MSFS2020 seems just valid for the controls not any for trim sensitivity but if there plaease help me find them otherwise Ill go back to FSX where the aircraft trim like real ones!
In msfs 2020, use the reactivity and sensitivity to tame your controls. Essentially, what these two will do is retard and slowdown the response between your yoke input and the aircraft’s behavior. It works great for elevator control. There’s a lot of information on this if you google, but I suggest you experiment with it until you can see the difference.
Thead revival going on here. Unfortunately reactivity disappeared from 2024
But I find the best tool is extremity dead zone. In an airliner, you will never pull 100% elevator deflection so if you make it more like 30 or 40%, you can set the sensitivity closer to zero giving you a nice straight response while removing the twitchiness
Thanks for the info I sort of forgot about thee settings but I’m hoping this is what will make trimming easier as it is non existent now. p down up down its totally unreal. Ok will let you konw any particular web site on sensitivity, I google all others but never on this subject. Thanks
