Thinking of going VR, need suggestions

User Support Hub Virtual Reality (VR)
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  1. VR headsets focus in the distance so you should be fine
  2. for MSFS the Reverb G2 is the best option. I have it myself and also played other VR-games with it. For other games: tracking of the Index is superior but in my opinion the tracking of the G2 is good enough to play everything in a casual manner.
  3. I´d say it depends on what exactly caused your headaches. Was it eye strain, migraine or were it just your neck musles not being used to the weight of the headset. At least I dont get headaches with my G2
  4. Personally I wear them the whole flight, most of the time between 1-2 hours.
  5. If you´re open to compromise on some graphical fidelity the 2070 super should be okay. Driving the high resolutions of modern headsets is extremely demanding even for a 3090 (like I have) so that´s where you´ll most likely have to compromise. But who knows maybe Asobo will implement DLSS for VR which would give GPU´s like your 2070 super a little more headroom.

All in all I personally would´t go back to 2D mode. The flying experiance is just so much more immersive that 2D feels boring in comparison, at least for me.
Will VR Headsets get even better in the future? Of course they will!
Will GPU´s in the future give you a better VR experiance? Of course they will!
Will current VR-tech with a capable GPU give you a cool virtual flying experiance? I would definetly agree on that!
There´s always better tech waiting for you in the future but at least I didn´t want to wait any longer and I´m really happy with my setup and the experiance.

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I have watched some VR 360 HD videos from You Tube on a Quest 2 so know it is capable of a fairly good resolution experience and totally immersive especially motor cycling or the Big Dipper
Also the cockpit in the Just Flight Piper Arrow is amazing and you can read the smallest writing on the panel. It is just the scenery that becomes blurry and annoying to me even running on a 3080 card and highest settings.

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This not true. I am a real life pilot and a Reverb G2 owner, and I can wholeheartedly say that after using VR, there’s zero chance to go back to 2D. VR makes it feel like you’re actually flying a plane, while 2D makes it feel like you are controlling a video of a plane flying. Once you try VR, there’s no turning back. The Reverb G2 has great clarity and quality and I can highly recommend it. Now if Asobo would fix their game after Sim Update 5 wrecked it, VR would be perfect again.

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Let’s also not forget to consider the mouse and keyboard too. I bought into VR a few years back, and while it was very neat the novelty wore off quickly. When I decided to embrace VR, I realized that the games which leverage VR are scarce, I thought that if nothing else I would get my money’s worth using it for x-plane. Sorry to use the X word, but this was a few years ago.

It turns out, for me it is unusable for flying because you need to use you stick, throttle, and at least a mouse. Doing that blind is harder than one would think.

Then there is the discomfort issue.

The VR set collects dust now.

If one is pondering VR specifically for MSFS2020, UI would say be very careful because VR is in its infancy with MSFS2020. There is a good chance one will be unimpressed.

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So am I ..but disagree…am I allowed to ?

flying a plane,
Never call it a plane it is an aircraft or an aeroplane my CFI used to bellow at me and “ keep the ball in the middle “!

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I’m not sure if the scenery blurriness is sometimes network issues, sometimes it looks good quite clear and fairly sharp up to a certain distance, other times quite average, Latest update made a bit of mess of things, it’s better after hotfix …

No comparison to 4K and I respect what users value, however still smile when remembering putting the vr goggles on in January in an xcub and the first thing I tried to do was touch the cockpit, and second memory after taking off was looking down at the wheels of the cub… didn’t matter that I was on a 1660ti and 3770k and it was a little bit of a slideshow

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Do it. No looking back to pancake mode.

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You’ve had a lot of responses to chew through. I personally moved to VR two weeks ago amongst the SU5 update mess… and despite all that it has been a thrill.

  • Last night I flew the Extra down through the belly of the Grand Canyon - a fun thrill ride I hadn’t considered doing until now
  • In 2D I often fly the TBM 930. The cockpit instruments are infront AND up above, so I would constantly cycle through the cockpit cameras to do all the busy work. In VR? I was literally blown away when I could JUST look UP and switch on the lights.
  • When up in the air making a wide bank, the vertigo you can get when you look down, there’s little like it.

BUT, some of this takes a little suspension of disbelief. I absolutely love it. I have a friend though who, despite being VERY creative (he’s an illustrator for a living) he DOES NOT care for VR, the gimmick doesn’t work for him.

My suggestion, pick up a cheap but high quality VR headset (the Quest 2 - you’ll appreciate the freedom of cables for other games) and try it for yourself. If it doesn’t work for you, then that’s what eBay is for.

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VR for flight sims is definitely fantastic! I don’t use anything else for my fight and racing stuff.

I think you should be okay without the reading glasses. IIRC most VR headsets lenses make your eyes think they’re focusing on something about 8’ away. If you find you need them, most headsets will accommodate glasses, and there are some 3rd parties that make prescription inserts for the different headsets.

I use the Valve Index. It’s one of the more expensive options, but offers a good balance of resolution and field of view. Some others offer more resolution and others more FOV, but the Index just works, and has good support. You’ll find a lot of people here use the Reverb G2, because it’s newer and has more resolution, though the FOV is lower.

I use the headset for the whole flight. I don’t have issues with headaches, but that’s probably something that will vary between individual. It’s a comfortable headset for me.

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I remember before MSFS was initially released, the Asobo Team was taking questions in a Q&A. They said that VR wouldn’t be available in the initial release – and it wasn’t – but that they (Asobo) were determined to get VR right. They specifically mentioned how inconvenient it is when you have to constantly take off your VR headset to look at the keyboard and to do other tasks VR can’t yet handle alone. But because of unrelenting pressure from VR religionists, Asobo released VR support anyway. And, needless to say, you must constantly take off your headset while flying in VR. The resolution is horrible – not because of Asobo but because the VR headsets currently on the market are all very very low resolution. The stated specs for each headset are extremely misleading and dupe the gullible (like me). I agree with someone here who said that there should be the equivalent of an Alcoholics Anonymous for people who bought a VR headset and can’t admit to themselves that they were disappointed. Apple is reportedly working on a VR headset, but it will no doubt cost multiple thousands of dollars and will require computer hardware not yet in existence. The moral of this story is: If you’re considering buying a VR headset for MSFS, don’t. Just don’t. It’s not the fault of Asobo. The VR hardware just isn’t ready.

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I’m starting to think that you have zero experience with VR. These statements are simply not true. I have completed hundreds of hours worth of Vatsim flights in VR from GA to Airliners and never once had to take off my headset. The resolution is not horrible… I can read even the smallest of details on the CRJ CRT screens with the G2. Maybe your vision or computer hardware needs a check? I use contact lenses and and high end PC and have none of the issues you’re describing.

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Where is the problem? After the first hour of use, you find all this and much more blind. xd

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There are pros and cons to VR and current hardware/software are still quite early on with regards to available and currently developed technology. Just as monitors have improve over the years the same will happen in time with VR headsets, plus the PC hardware we have to run them and the software that drives them.

Possibly the most important factor (for any of us) will be personal expectations and quite frankly your personal tolerances against those expectations. Do your research, (as you are here) read the comments but do remember to consider those comments are from people with different expectations than your own.

Unfortunately, there is no realistic way to understand or rather appreciate what VR provides as an experience without physically trying it for yourself. I.e. the good and not so good aspects. YouTube clips are typically recorded from a mirror view and therefore do not capture the visual quality inside a headset. Likewise “through the lens” clips are inherently difficult to record and provide a decent representation of the viewing quality. Certainly neither will provide you with the 3D aspect of VR at all.

Personally I pretty much only fly in VR since I got my headset (Reverb G1). I would actually say my experience of VR has closely mirrored my expectations at every turn: I was running a weak system (6700k O/C’d to 4.6 and a 2080Ti GPU) when I started out, and expected to turn settings down to obtain a workable performance this was correct.
The intention was always to upgrade my system (now 10900k O/C’d 5.3) which I did a couple of months ago, still running the 2080Ti though.
As expected the experience has improved considerably, is it quite there yet for me though? from a visual quality and performance perspective possibly not quite, but as an immersive experience clearly yes.

As immersion experience I really enjoy the a sense on being in a cockpit within the simulated world environment. The 3D aspect of course brings a sense of depth/distance/size that cannot be replicated on flat screen. As I said VR is something you can only truly appreciate by experiencing by trying it yourself. In my opinion VR and flight sims really are a good match, particularly for flying helicopters. I would encourage you to find somewhere to try VR or take the plunge with your eyes open.

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I have a Valve Index, and while the immersion is very good and the FOV is pretty good, I’ve not found the resolution to be enough to read the smaller text on glass avionics or make out details in the distance. (This may however improve if I can manage to use it with my glasses on. I’ll give it another try soon!) (Quick update – I tried with my glasses on, which required taking out the face cushion insert – I believe they make a larger version which will accomodate glasses but I don’t have one yet – and it slightly improved sharpness, but not by a lot. My eyesight and the resolution of the Index are very similar :smiley: ) (CORRECTION: what they make for this case is prescription lens inserts, which are adapter lenses that you place over the VR lens which are made to match your glasses or contacts prescription. I’m planning to get some after my next optemtrist visit & prescription update, since it’s not that expensive – $69 – and should noticeably improve the text that’s right at the boundary of legibility for me now.) Also if you don’t find the “zoom” feature to break immersion like I do, some folks might be fine with the resolution as-is.

More problematic though is the issue of the controls: you need to use your mouse/keyboard/controller/yoke/throttle/whatever blind, without seeing the position or state of either the controls or your hands.

I can use the yoke/throttle lever and a few switches by touch, but it’s pretty awkward sometimes and is, as they say, an “immersion killer”. :wink: Fumbling for the mouse for 45 seconds so you can adjust your heading is … not fun. ;_; And using the keyboard is impossible, as the one I’m using at my gaming setup isn’t really positioned for comfortable touch typing.

There’s a plan on the dev roadmap to support VR motion controllers down the line, which might be interesting, but I’m not sure I like for instance X-Plane’s interpretation of them. It’s neat with the Valve Index hand controllers to reach out to the Cessna 172’s throttle or mixture plunger and just push/pull it and be able to see your hand’s position in VR! But there’s no haptic feedback, and that makes controlling the virtual yoke a lot less “immersive” than using my physical yoke. I don’t know what MSFS will end up doing, or whether it’ll be better than the existing controls.

Additionally if you use any external tools – either Windows programs that run outside the MSFS window, or apps on a phone or iPad – you’ll have to give them up. You can’t see your other screen or your mobile device while in VR. (CORRECTION: You can see Windows programs in VR through SteamVR, though I’ve personally found this confusing to use so far. :smiley: But once you figure it out I’m sure it’s usable. External devices like iPads will be harder to deal with.)

Also consider screenshots – many folks won’t care and that’s fine! but a large part of what I love about flight IRL (as a passenger so far!) and in the sim is looking out the window and taking pictures and videos of beautiful places and sharing them with my family and friends. I’ve not yet figured out how to take screenshots conveniently in VR, though I think I can rig something up. I have managed to make screen recordings from the mirrored stereoscopic view on screen and transform the output using ffmpeg to a format that YouTube will accept for VR180 video, which means it can be viewed both in 2d on the web & YouTube app, and in 3d VR. And that’s pretty cool! But the resulting picture quality on the 2d view from a VR recording via my 3840x2160 mirrored screen is much lower than an equivalent recording in flat 2d on my 3440x1440 gaming screen. For my purposes of sharing experiences, VR is not as good as 2d.

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36

VR is great for flying, in many ways this is where VR truly excels.

But…

The 2070 might be a push for anything like the Reverb G2. That’s effectively a 4k monitor. A lot of pixels to push and you need smooth frames in VR.
(That said, a mate of mine runs MSFS2020 just fine on a G2 with a 2080ti so…)

I would recommend flying IL-2 (Great battles series) in VR first to help get your VR legs.
IL-2 performs very nicely in VR good frame rates and no stutter. Both of these will help you get your “VR legs” without too much motion sickness.
(Also Warthunder has great VR performance, it’s free to play but it’s a bit twitchy in flight and grindy as hell)

If you do experience motion sickness during the “training stage” follow all the guides and tips you will find here and online. Start with short experiences, stop the moment you feel discomfort etc. You are conditioning your brain to be ok with VR
Obviously start with something easy. Free flight, nice and level, look around…don’t go straight into aerobatic combat. (But when you do it will all suddenly make sense and you will have that “wow” moment that makes going back to a flat screen really quite hard.)

Once you have your VR legs then you can try out MSFS2020 - VR performance is a bit sketchy in my opinion, especially when compared to Sims that do it better but it will get there one day I guess.

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I have a Quest 2 it is great,I absolutely love MSFS in VR. I just spent 14 days trying to get MSFS back after update 5 wouldn’t load. I now know what an addict without a hit feels like! Yes it isn’t as detailed as flat screen.But the immersion makes up for it.Just flew the discovery Bora Bora in VR and was in tears ..so Beautiful.

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Thanks everyone for the comments, this has given me a lot to chew on. I didn’t want this to become a VR brand “war” but honest feedback on the pro’s and con’s of VR. (thanks for keeping it that way) Hopefully this has helped others on the fence…

While REALLY tempting… Think I’m going to hold off a few more months, and upgrade my GPU when prices get more sane. Then re-visit the VR headset options. I’m sure VR is the way to go long term…

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I love VR. At the moment my g2 is in for repair so forced to play pancake mode and it’s such a come down from the immersion VR gives. I also play DCS and Il2 but not touched them since the G2 had to go back.

One thing you could do is buy a headset from somewhere like amazon that has a 4 week no questions asked return policy.

I’ve actually used this a few times now as I have been experiencing the AMD g2 connectivity issues combined with a terrible cable design which resulted in a dead g2 after a couple of weeks. Im now actually on my 6th one which died after week 5. The specification of the g2 is great, the design is not. There is a rev 2 cable for anyone experiencing something similar by the way which removes the connectivity issue.

Try it, don’t like it? Send it back nothing lost.

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I tend to think of VR in FS2020 in terms of an illicit drug.

Before I tried it I was perfectly happy, flying around in my flat 2D world, looking around with hat switches and mouse. Didn’t know any better.

Watched a few videos of people seemingly having enormous fun flying over cities and through city streets, just moving their heads to look around. I need some of this action. What do i have to do?

My first few flights “Oh my god, this is amazing. It’s like I am actually in the plane and…whoah! look down there! I am up in the air!” etc etc

Now I am hooked. No 2d screen style flying is ever gonna match the immersion I have experienced.

I have tried weaning myself of of VR but to no avail. The 2d world is so flat and like a serious come down.

I squint at my instrument panel, giving myself a hernia, trying to lean forwards and read that tiny Garmin G3X. I fumble around in the 3d world outside of my headset learning to use a mini keyboard by touch and every button on my airbus flight stick is etched into my muscle memory. I suffer the hideous sometimes nauseating stutters and relatively poor graphical fidelity. However, I don’t care. I have tasted the future of gaming and I cannot let it go. I am addicted and there is definitely no cure.

BEWARE !

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41

VR is great fun and the sense of immersion is fantastic. How much of a novelty it ends up being for you depends a lot on how tolerant you are of its downsides. For people who aren’t too bothered about the technical shortcomings of VR the immersive aspect of it is what completely defines their experience. Thats why you’ll read some VR users here say ‘there’s no going back’ to playing a regular 2D screen.

For me the experience of VR in FS2020 just isn’t there yet. The potential for it is phenomenal but more has to come together to get it working well enough I think. Plus there are other downsides to it like being so cut off from things. I like using all the buttons and dials on my HOTAS and flight panels. VR cuts you off from all that. I love how beautiful the sim looks on a screen. Currently no matter what, with headsets not yet being high enough resolution and computer hardware not yet being powerful enough, those glorious graphics are to varying degrees partly lost in VR.

A VR headset is definitely worth getting though. Even though I’m not totally sold on VR I do enjoy putting on my headset every once in a while and dabbling with it. Its another way to enjoy the sim so the more options the better I think.

As to which headset. I got a Quest 2. The downside to it is you need to be logged on to Facebook for it to work. The upside to it is its a very good quality headset for the price and if you’re unsure about VR and just wanting to give it a go this is a very good selling point.

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