Seeking some advice/feedback on using a large 2K TV as a monitor. This will not be in a living room setting. Im talking about a large TV which is at least 100cms screen size and sitting on a desk just like a monitor would.
I want this for gaming (MSFS and other sims primarily) but also (crucially) it has to be good for work as well.
What is the resolution like sitting so close to a 2K TV? (can the eyes see the pixel grid?)
What does MS Excel and MS Word look like?
How good is text on the screen? Is it nice and sharp?
Any huge difference playing MSFS on a TV vs a monitor?
Would be very interested from those of you who went from a small monitor to a large TV - but the TV has to be on a desktop setting. Not on a wall across the room. I will be using it at close range and therefore getting feedback on what this is like would be great
Try this calculator that you can use to determine the optimal viewing experience. Assuming you have a 100 cm (39") display with 2560x1440 resolution, this could answer a few of your questions.
The Visual Acuity distance would be 1.14 m (3.7 ft). Meaning sitting closer to the display than this distance would make you able to see the individual pixel grid. Now this is subjective, and this value is based on average people with perfect eyesight. For someone like me who is nearsighted and wears glasses, I can get away with a closer distance for me to be able to make out the individual pixels. For someone that has a better than perfect eyesight, this value can be increased as they would need more distance before they start to notice the individual pixels.
Its looks depends on the viewing distance. The closer it is, especially under the Visual Acuity distance, the more blurry those apps would look like because you start to see the jagged pixels on the app screen.
Sharpness is relative and very subjective, you can consider an image on a display to be very sharp when there’s no anti-aliasing involved. So it depends on which one you prefer. Do you prefer an aliased text with improved sharpness of the letter edges, or do you prefer a softer anti-aliased texts where the corners are more smoothed out to shape the font curves. Either way, it still depends on your Visual Acuity distance.
Now this one depends on the viewing angle. On average, we can only see up to a total of 140 degrees of view in front of us. So with a large display, we are only able to see 70 degrees on each side. Meaning if you start viewing the edge of the screen, only 70 degrees from your center viewpoint is visible to you, so if the display width sits outside of that 70 degree range, they’re out of your peripheral vision.
When viewed at this degree, we’re looking at around 0.62 meters of viewing distance.
So for MSFS, it depends on what you’re expecting, really. Are you okay with having parts of the screen out of your view, or do you prefer to have the entire screen visible to you at all times?
Another thing to note is that having a big display too close to see would increase the distance difference between different parts of the display. If we’re talking about a flat screen and if you’re sitting at 100 cm distance. Looking at the corner would actually make you look for 111cm distance. And that means you’re looking at 11 cm further than you would when looking at the center of the screen. Similarly, if you look at the monitor closer, let’s say 50 cm distance. Then this difference is almost double where you’re looking at 20 cm further when looking at the corner.
So, at a visual acuity distance of 1.14m, you would be looking at an approx 42 degree angle. Which is slightly above the recommended THX viewing distance.
So the summary is, it depends on how much space you have between yourself and the monitor of your choice. If you are flexible with the viewing distance, by all means go with the TV size that you want, then adjust your viewing distance behind the desk according to these calculators.
Otherwise, if you have a fixed limited space to deal with in terms of your viewing distance. Then I recommend you pick screen size that will give you as close to the visual acuity distance as possible at that resolution.
Fantastic reply thank you very much for giving your time to tell me all this
I am digesting this info now, it is a lot to think about. Stuff that I had not considered! Checking out those links and I will need a few more re-reads of what you have written and then go away to chew on it a bit!
As you said a lot of those things are subjective, like sharpness.
I am currently on a 1080p 58cms monitor which is good but I want something massive and the huge monitors are just too expensive. But even big TVs are reasonably priced and I’m not going to get a Sony or something that are pricey.
Gonna to go to a TV store and stand very close to the 2K TVs on display the sales people will be scratching their heads!
This one has me thinking now. I will only be able to answer after my store experiment!
This is where I get lucky - I have tons of space. To give you an idea I can put the chair right across the room or right up against the display. Glad to hear this gives me some flexibility.
The one thing I forgot to include in my original post - curved TVs. What do you make of these? A big advantage to playing MSFS on that vs. flat?
I went from a 31" monitor 1080P, to a 55" uhd 4k, I find that making the switch has been well worth the lost of fps 20 is good enough as long as its constant.
As for other programs running on the big screen, you will find that you can open say a spreadsheet, but now instead of opening it up full screen, your can size it to what full screen look like before, and still have tons of space for word, mail, etc.
The only 2 downsides I have with this setup is
Its hard to play a FPS fullscreen since the Frame rates/response time isnt what it is on my 31"
165hz 1080 moinitor.
After a long day of being on the computer my neck starts to get stiff from the angle I view the TV.
Other then that I find it really good though. The other thing is with the 55" tv I can put two chairs side by side add another throttle, and then have a real co-pilot fly the plane as well. Was doing this with one of my grandsons before I moved…
Thanks for your reply, thats good to know, Im also not that fussed about a small FPS drop, as long as the game runs smooth. I keep photogrammetry off so that helps a bit and my next PC will be a beast machine (Im on a 14 year old PC atm haha!)
How high have you mounted it? I will mount mine so that the top edge of the tv will be level with top of head. I will not be going for an absolutely massive one as it will be close to me, will go to the shops and its only after standing close to different screen sizes will I get an idea.
most teles of that size are 4k nowadays,ofcourse they can run in 2k…but not all deliver
an equally good picture when downsized.
make sure to read reviews on the teles you make your choice from.
I had a ($500) 55inch 4K TV on my desk for 2 months (against the wall) about 3 feet away and it’s awesome.
Enormous amount of screen space for work and also great for MSFS.
Didn’t notice any pixels (or lag). Also because I probably wasn’t looking for it. Anyway, it’s not annoying enough to notice.
I guess it’s the same as “don’t think of an elephant right now”
Had to give it back to my son, who is the rightful owner. Using an older 1080p TV now.
Today, TV’s are almost cheaper than monitors.
edit: I have eye level slightly below top of TV screen. No stiff neck.
It sits on my desktop. I live in an apt, so I dont want to go punching holes in the wall. I bought it for a new bedroom tv, and due to issues with the sim, I installed on my gamming laptop and hooked it up to the 4k tv, right there I was hooked. my laptop is 1660 and desktop is 1080 cards.
I dont have any furniture, so I can only string across 2 chests of drawers in the bedroom, or on my desk.
I run at 4k on a 1080ti on a i7-6 with 16 gigs of ram. When the sim is behaving I get a nice smooth 20fps with everything on ultra (some light effects turned off due to personal preference, not performance) wise.
Curved display is a good idea. At least having a curved display, you will look at equal distances across the left and the right side compared to the middle due to the curved nature.
However, different displays have different curves, 1000R, 1800R, etc. the higher the number, the greater the radius of the curve so it’s actually “less” curve. These will impact on your viewing distance as well.
I would think that using a 1000R curved display, should make you sit at 1000 mm away from it. Since that distance would be the actual focal point of the curve. Meaning if you’re looking at the 1000R display from 1000 mm away, you are looking at equal distances when you look at the center or the edges of the display. Making it much more immersive.
But then again, it’s still depends on your viewing angle, after calculating it, if you use that 1000R monitor sitting at 1000 mm away from the monitor at the focal point for maximum immersion. You’re looking at a 41 degree viewing angle. Which is still more than the recommended THX standard of 36 degree. (good). And the Visual Acuity Distance is only 790 mm. So the viewing distance at 1000 mm is still well above it, so you shouldn’t have any issues with having the individual pixels visible.
So if you want to look for a curved display, make sure you’re sitting at the focal point that’s specified by the R spec. Then calculate to make sure you’re well above the visual acuity distance, and that you have a viewing angle of more than 36 degrees. As long as those are met, you should have an immersive experience.
There’s no point in getting a large TV if you are sitting under the Visual acuity distance making the pixels visible, but sitting further back which sacrifices your viewing angle instead.
It’s good that you have a lot of room available to you, so you shouldn’t have too much constraints preparing it, but do keep in mind on having those things in mind when deciding what to get.
Be careful. Many units at stores are set at Retail Mode. This makes them more attractive but it’s not the settings you want at home. You could ask they change the unit you are interested in to normal. They can revert to retail when done. The lighting in store will also have some effect, that is one reason for Retail mode.
A TV is a monitor that has an additional circuitry to display TV Signals.
A monitor with an HDMI port is the same as a TV with a HDMI port as long as both have the same specs. (HDMI 1.4, HDMI 2.0, HD, HDR, HDR 10, UHD, etc.)
As to FS2020, Gaming Monitors have additional specs as to Refresh Rate.
My 65 inch TV , 4K UHD (HDR10) Native 3840x2160, has a 60 Hz refresh rate.
The TV paints the screen 60 times per second.
I keep my FS2020 resolution to 30 or 60 Frames Per Second (FPS)
to match the TV refresh rate (the TV’s capability).
50" 4k Samsung, I use it as desktop @ 3ft. Works great, after some tweaks of contrast and sharpness so text is optimal. I have reading glasses but I don’t have to this way. Prob 55" would work also. Above that, your word processing and spreadsheet might get a bit weird. Check in a big store and ask them to pull up a word processor? (Still does not say much, you need to tweak for text). The screen need to be MAT, not gloss.
I’m using old 39" 60 hz fhd tv as monitor. I don’t see pixel grid and text is pretty sharp. It is used allround purposes like reading this forum, movies, gaming, reading pdf etc.
It is almost similar to my 24" 120 hz monitor. I use Dp to hdmi and tv has a computer dedicated hdmi so that might have some effect. Noticed that it gives variety of resolutions different to normal hdmi. I run it with RTX 3060ti, i5 9400f with 32 gigs of low latency memory and MSFS is high/ultra 40-45 fps, no visual artifacts due tv, no lagging or trailing and even colours seem to be quite right after adjusting.
I have it on my desk and viewing distance 90 cm or so. Looking at middle of the screen.
I’m using a 48" Samsung QLED 4k for years for work and games, I loved, for work I can open a lot of VMs and remote access from users on the same screen, for game 4k and HDR it’s amazing.
To use a TV for PC you need one that have Chroma 4:4:4, here a great article from RTings site about this subject.
I have used a 75" 4K LED TV for all my gaming (PC and PS4/5) as well as for my desktop PC (Finances, Excel, Word, Programming, Web browsing) for the last 3 years and it is magnificent.
I had a 65" OLED TV before it and have to say the LED TV is much better for desktop PC work (brighter, more consistent brightness with varying content, no auto screen dimming and no burn-in risk) so if you spend a lot of time using the desktop PC, I’d suggest an LED TV.
RIP eyes sitting in a dark room with a display that bright close to your eyes…
Agreed 100%, burn-ins are the reason why I stayed away from OLED TV. The better picture quality is not worth the short lifespan before it starts to degrade too much that it looks worse than a regular LED TV.
@Neo4316
Thats good to know. I dont know if the store close to me has the curved displays but if it does not I will go to one that does to se what it feels like. I have seen other users say it feels like a “wrap around” feeling that increases immersion. Thanks for the info on the R number about the curves!
I have made a note of these things. Im glad that the flexibilty to vary the distance will help. I think the only concern of mine is noticing a grid but from what you said and the others have said this is not a factor so thats a big relief ! Thanks again for sharing your technical knowledge and the physics of viewing distances and such!
Whoa good point, I didn’t know about this thanks for the heads up. I plan to narrow it down to 3 TVs and then will ask for the remote control to play with the picture modes!
@MSFSRonS
Whats blurring the lines for me is that big TVs are very reasonably priced.The big high quality gaming monitors I find pricey. I am not a fan of the ultra-wide displays that to me feel like I’m looking at the virtual world through a letter box slit. Thanks for the info on the refresh rate.
Another good point, thanks! I have a friend with a Dell laptop and the screen is pretty much a mirror, really annoying. Not a fan of the glossy stuff.
Thanks for the comment about the pixel grid! This was playing on my mind. Was worried that if I get a big screent that it would be like looking at fine mesh but now I can see those fears are unfounded. Cant wait to go to the store and check out some screens!
That does sound amazing. Its the sheer amount of screen space that I ma excited about as on a giant screen I could even window MSFS during the long cruise phase of a flight and check out YouTubes and all that! Must be a huge time save for you at work. Thanks for the info on the chroma stuff - I learn something every day! Also your English is fine friend!
Now THAT is a setup right there! You can run MSFS, ATS, DCS and watch YouTube all at the same time!! What a great screen that is. I think you have the TV version of a C-5 Galaxy aha! Really like your gaming room setup the deep red. So excellent for late night gaming sessions.
Oh yes the burn in issue, I always keep the Windows screensaver set to kick in after 10 minutes,. No pattern just the Blank option. This has always been a worry of mine even though I read that its less likely with modern displays but I dont buy that ! However I suffered screen burn on a Samsung Galaxy phone with an OLED screen. I do however miss the deep blacks it gave! LED screen OK made a note of that to compare to plasma & LCD (do they still make plasma? Ive been out of the loop)
Now THAT is a setup right there! You can run MSFS, ATS, DCS and watch YouTube all at the same time!! What a great screen that is. I think you have the TV version of a C-5 Galaxy aha! Really like your gaming room setup the deep red. So excellent for late night gaming sessions.