Thanks, incidentally I do know how OpenSource works.
Open source always requires a license (eg BSD, GPL) and this has implications for you.
Have you written new code that is a protectable work on its own or just modified files from the distribution?
If you have just edited some files, you cannot simply grant me a new license for something that you modified without receiving a legally binging answer from the creator.
And considering the tone of your reply the only answer you will ever receive is âshrugâ. You must get off your high horse (where is the functionality?! where is the documentation?! where is my answer?!) and instead ask nicely or itâs no surprise you are being ignored.
Donât want to be harsh but you seem to be under serious illusions who is dependant on who. Itâs currently not Asobo who is asking you to fix their work or who offered their cooperation, although it could be in the common interest if someone takes on this task.
I assume itâs their plan to eventually improve the Airbus themselves, create a 3d interior, add payable modules to it and include it in package deals of their own, etc.
My point is that you should not compare Asobo licensing to what an open-source mod would deem fair use of its code. They are two completely different things.
Well done, I always respect someone who can admit having made an error. And, for what its worth, your English seems just fine â you came across as a perfectly normal hot-headed English speaker.
My point was that (hypothetically) I could also require you to provide me with proper documentation, implement or discuss my feature requests or even stand trial as to the incompleteness of your work (read some of the acrimonious parts of your quote, I am not going to list them - it was practically unreadable from a professional point of view).
Considering this were my request you will probably agree I am a) creating more work than you would ever want to provide b) that i come off as impertinent and c) that I add nothing of value to your goals
And now if you put yourself in the shoes of Asobo, you have your answer why they wonât say anything. They may be mildly sympathetic and let it slip that you created a fork but may also not be exstatic that you already meddle in their incomplete, behind schedule Airbus while they try to do necessary work to it.
P.S. the synopsis of my points was not to criticize you but that the state of the Airbus and the SDK is probably way too early to take on your project, and Asobo is probably not able to provide you with what you need, even if they wanted to. Wait 1 year and it may be a better time. Or accept that the work you do now is only preparatory, like a prototype for the final mod.
A further complication could be the license deal with Airbus. I think the details are not released publicly but the Asobo_A320_NEO folder contains this notice:
âAirbus and other Airbus product and service marks are protected trademarks of Airbus. All rights reserved. Officially licensed by Airbus.â
Since there is probably a contract between Asobo and Airbus it may not be so simple to give you a license to develop derivative works.
Normally, as long as itâs just a fan modification and no harm is done, many companies would just let it go - without commenting though. But you will not receive a large envelope with a contract from Asobo granting you free reign to improve the Airbus with their permission. Youâd have to do this a bit more skillfully and wait until they issue a clear statement as to fan mods (the question is crucial to the future of MSFS and will come up), and then take them by their word. Right now you are on very thin ice.
P.S. I also see you apologized on your reddit post so you are making steps in the right direction. It was a bit imprudent to write a rant but no harm is done, and the points you make are well known - neither the SDK nor the documentation are currently sufficient to develop the study level aircraft MSFS needs.
I so badly want the MSFS development team to have great and wonderful short AND long term success. Their success is our success.
The problem is, there cannot be success if MSFS is not a FLIGHT SIMULATOR. It has to be this FIRST.
This topic is another example full of concerns and lack of concerns. Essentially there is a huge dispute over realism. Realism always wins in a flight simulator. If realism does not win here, MSFS will not be classified as a flight simulator.
Something that is worthy to note:
At this moment there is an eerie silence at the PMDG forums concerning patch #2. I for one was hoping for a wonderful reception of Patch #2 community wideâŠits not the case.
Also note-worthy is the silence from the MSFS team, considering the FLOOD of issues. Another weekend being grounded for manyâŠits been a month since release.
How long this âclimateâ goes on is very concerning to me.
Wow arenât we just a little overbearing and judgemental, hmm?? I can almost read the next post: âAnd who do you think makes you take those screenshots, hmmm?? SATAN???â
chill out, some folks can fly and stop to enjoy the scenery too or whatever they choose. they own as much of a license as you do. hurling very thinly (my generosity knows no bounds) insults at folks because they donât do things the way you do is rather nosy and dictatorial. conformists are everywhere, society couldnât function without them, butâŠhave some consideration and understand we all do our own thing and yet do the same things. its ok.
And you will never see much from Asobo here. All during alpha it was very rare to hear from them directly, and oh the wailing and gnashing of teeth.
It is a flight simulator, read the fix lists for godâs sake. Tweaking of what can only be classified as the engineâs use of parameters and / or particle characteristics encompass more then one listed fix. Whether you like the modeling or not, it is a simulator modelling all sorts of interactions (air, aluminum, rubber, water, tarmac, etc) and one focused onâŠyou guessed it, FLYING!
You should compare your (should we sayâŠwell I let others judge for themselves) profile to mine, before you judge me or try to tell me what to do.
Rather than attack people you donât know behind the net (like cowards do), you should debate the points I made. Nobody seems to ever want to try this, or when they do they eventually start up the personal attacks (because they have nothing else) or they scurry off.
Trust me, you can make yourself look much more productive, and caring of MSFS - UNLIKE your profile clearly exhibits.
The moderators have said it over and over - STAY ON TOPIC and REFRAIN FROM GETTING PERSONAL. Why is this so difficult for so many people hereâŠugh.
I am not sure if flybyaire are even on 3rd party partner, if yes there is NDA on 3rd party private forum. SDK are usually released few months after the release, in theory there should be no SDK available at the moment, but there is, they are updating this each month on DR map. As for cut, most likely not, you can sell your add-ons outside Ms market place.
Asobo has 31 vacancies on ca 140 (if I am correct and FS is not their only product) current staff⊠amazing that they got this far yet, amazing that Microsoft made all the promises they did make, working with such a relatively small partner.
WHOA. Hold up and go read your attack on a fellow forum poster about his voluminous screenshot posts. If you are in Texas Iâd truly love to meet you in person and discuss what constitutes an âattackâ and what constitutes a âdefenseâ. That would be some kind of extra special.
Extra special, kind of like when someone verbally denigrates someone else for taking enjoyment in a shared pass time that they donât enjoy in quite the same way, belittling them over this difference in details about a shared pass time. Now enters reserved (mild mannered even) wolf who upbraids the former publicly attacker for his public display of antisocial and potentially hurtful behavior towards a fellow forum poster. Now we are comparing profiles (I noticed you did that with that horrible screenshot man too)? How about real life accomplishments? How about real world manners, civility and interpersonal skills? For real man learn a lesson, stop parroting those trying to steer you in a better direction (which I admit I did about as poorly as could be characterized. the whole thing just made me angry.)
Not that enjoyable being called out publicly. Is that why the script flipping attempt? I try to avoid interactions of this nature but sometimes they cannot be avoided. Your post embodied everything you accuse me of, while I (perhaps sneeringly Iâll admit) simply explained the behavior as childish, rude, self-centered, etc. which it was. Iâve seen you here since the alpha, you ought to know better than to behave such with your keyboard cuddled close but apparently this lesson has escaped you, much the same as those describing âattackingâ and âdefendingâ participants in a combative situation.
I see near the end how you go check my forum profile like you are measuring yourâŠno contest kiddo but my profile I really donât care about. It serves a purpose but I canât say Iâve been there but to change my name. The idea of this being a measure of a man explains why this country is so full of whiny man-children.
Iâm done with this. Best sit down son and swallow your pride before it chokes you. You were wrong and I let you know you were, albeit a bit harshly its that simple.
Thatâs exactly the point, so hold down the horses.
And you say yourself that the team is âfloodedâ with issues - most of them probably totally pointless or redundant to a degree of 1â000, when I look here at the forums. So how do you expect them to answer on an individual basis? And they do have a âcommon problemsâ page here in the forum, but again, it would be pointless to list there every tiny little knob that would not be working on some aircraft⊠we already know that certain functionality is broken. So hold your breath here.
Again, we are a mere one month - one! - into the release, they already issues two patches, which just prooves that they are working under high pressure.
For the record: I actually reported a silly issue myself shortly after release (âyour airplane âcrashesâ under certain conditions when firmly on ground and you move away your drone camera - probably due to ground geometry updatesâ - really a silly issue). And even I just got a reply (not a personal one, of course) from them!
So again, relax yo all. We are talking about a 60 dollars (give or take) game, not some human rights.
[the quoted profile here belongs to someone else, but mine has been scrutinised in the same way by @aracines ]
There is your problem: not only do you seem to judge people âby their numbersâ, but you also draw the wrong conclusions!
Take your attack on my profile as an example again: you tried to depict me as a âYouTuberâ in a disrespectful manner (personnally I actually do enjoy the content of selected game channels, especially also with FS 2020 content since recently, for obvious reasons), based on your conclusion that "most of my posts had been made in the âuser screenshotsâ galleryâ - or however you came to that conclusion.
Fact is (and I repeat myself, see above): I posted three - three! - topics with pictures of my own in said âuser screenshotsâ forum. Yes, I gave lots of likes to other peopleâs photos (maybe that muddled your conclusion?), but the rest of my replies and topics were all distributed in the other forums, including this one. But especially also in those threads were people were asking for help, and with the little that I knew (or just learned myself) where I could help.
I make no secret that I am a former flight sim enthusiast (we are talking Falcon 3.0 and friends), and now a total noob who tries to enter flight simulations again. And yes, it was both the stunning graphics and the fact that you can âdumb downâ the airplanes, and gradually increase the realism level that convinced me!
(Oh and yes, I actually do happen to be an enthusiastic photographer as well, but yâknow, âin the real worldâ)
This is my first, genuine reaction that I made here in the forums:
So if you want to attack me based on my noob skills, then go ahead! I have no issues with that. What I donât agree with are false accusations and wrong facts.
Now on-topic: when I said âit works for meâ previously I meant the state and specifically my expecations I had when purchasing this sim. It seems some people here were expecting the âholy grail of flight simsâ on day one. Thatâs not how software development works, I tell you (from experience, btw).
So what âworked for meâ? The sim was absolutely playable, and the major achievements like being able to fly around the entire world with stunning graphics (clouds!) - worked. Mutliplayer - worked (as far as I can tell). Weather - partially worked (especially where I live - worked ;)). âFeels like realismâ - worked for me.
Again, itâs all about expectation management. And now the important stuff: what also âworks for meâ is the promise by Asobo / MS that development will continue, for up to 10 years. Now I already know your response (âI want a fully working product on day one!â), and I can totally understand that, too.
But you must understand that FS 2020 is basically a total rewrite of the original FSX! New game engine, new flight models, new cloud infrastructure (which needs to be able to cope with a factor X of more online players like back in the days!)⊠I can only guestimate how much Asobo was able to âcarry overâ from the old flight sim code. Probably not much more than a few âconfig filesâ with regards to flight characteristics, perhaps a couple of (outdated) airport data and frequenciesâŠ
So it is a new âbuild up phase nowâ. Not likeFSX, or any other franchise for that matter - dare I say Call of Duty here - that is able to incrementally build on the previous release / feature set.
And with regards to communication with third parties: your first priority as a development team is to âstabiliseâ the APIs before documenting them. And to fix the most pressing issues first!
Could communication be improved? Certainly. But personally Iâd rather see the studio coding and testing rather than âcommunicatingâ. Weâll see soon enough the improvements - once they are ready.
P.S. Oh, and by the way: the third reason why I purchased FS 2020 was because I knew that there would be an enthusiastic flight sim community that would demand the most realistic flight simulation. Itâs like buying a âmodular carâ that can be expanded to be a Ferrari: even if you know that you cannot drive a Ferrari right now (and may never be able to do so) there is the possibilty that you might just get there yourself.
What I was not prepared for here in the forums was this hostile environment and the tone that people âdemand their stuff right nowâ - at least in certain threads. And to make it clear: I consider this thread - the opening topic - absolutely âjustifiedâ and an important topic. But this thread, like so many, derailed into a poisonous soupâŠ
Figured out the Engine 1 issue, if the centre tank is at 0 when the APU powers down it kills the whole fuel line. Repeatable on ramp and runway starts(start on runway with empty centre tank, turn APU on, turn APU off, engine 1 dies). Having any amount of fuel in the centre tank when the APU turns off will keep the engine running the rest of the flight until this can be patched. Keep in mind if your wing tanks are not full the aircraft will automatically transfer fuel from the centre to the wing tanks the moment you start the ignition process. If you start with wing tanks under 80%, and donât want to tinker with fuel loads once in sim, you need at least 20% in the centre tank to ensure it doesnât hit 0 before you complete engine start and APU shutdown. Will submit a post to the bug forum for vote purposes and ZenDesk ticket.
Oh man. Flight sim community is so toxic. It is a miracle that some companies even develope Flight sims. Thumps up for Laminar research and Asobo/MS, you both dont deserve all this â â â â â â customers.
The flightsim community seems to have collective Stockholm syndrome.
Consumers paid for a product, and they recieved a beta. I take no qualms with anyone who is upset about this and voicing their disdain.
Software engineering is hard. But itâs a lack of leadership, communication and transparency that is the problem here.
And to the OP dev who is just trying to get an answer to a simple question; Iâm sorry youâre having such a â â â â developer experience. Our industry sets the bar preeeeeetty low sometimes.
